Fallkniven CC4 inaccurate grit ratings

[Stahl-Enthusiast]

Which is frankly silly. I don't know why so many sellers of sintered stones suggest using them dry. Like, you CAN, but the way that sintered stones have limited ability to shed grit, if at all, means that using at least water on the stone, or even possibly oil, will reduce the wear to the surface grains so you don't end up glazing the stone from use. Sintered stones need periodic refreshing to keep them cutting instead of burnishing.

My personal experience is that I use my CC4 dry because for me it's a portable pocket sharpener / honer / stropper, and I take one with me if I go somewhere for a little longer, or if I go where I know I might need a touch up or something. It's way more convenient for me to use the CC4 dry, because it's just simpler for me and you don't need to bring or make or requite water or oil or soap water. Every now and then I just clean the light side with not even a whole drop of Ballistol and something to wipe off that steel residue. The rough side I rarely ever need, but I used it a bunch a few times when I did some minor fixing, and it's still the same rough. Maybe they suggest to use ceramics dry because these stones don't need water or oil to function. But then people will do what they prefer anyways. Thinking about it, I didn't have to use my trusty 5k / 2k grit waterstone in a long time, which I only keep at home, but that's me.
I started out on an oil stone when I was a young lad, and you really needed to create that paste with the residue that gets bonded in the oil. It's basically that fine-grained oil-paste that sharpens the edge and not the stone itself with oil stones; as far as my experience goes.
And I used my CC4 dry for a couple of years by now, and it hasn't glazed yet.

 

[Stahl-Enthusiast]

They rougher side is rough when new. It is possible to do minor repairs. But it will smooth out with use. And will produce a smooth edge.
I know that Fällkniven says to use the stone dry. If have read (and seen videos on YouTube) that guys use water or soapy water on Spyderco's ceramics. Or even oil.
I use my Fällkniven stones dry. But I tried and old (and worn out) with water. So what? Why shouldn't I lubricate the ceramic with soapy water to flush away metal particles and to make the scratch pattern finer?
Who says that an oilstone can only be used with oil? Don't be so pedantic.

I am also aware that Fällkniven says that the stone is made of synthetic sapphires. But the ceramic is very different to other ceramics, say Spyderco or Lansky. These are sintered ceramics because one would not be able to create a slurry.
Spyderco and Lansky (medium ceramic) don't change there surface that much. They do. But not as drastic as Fällkniven does. And they absorb less water.

Doubts are not a bad thing. But feel free to believe what folks that want your money write. As I mentioned before: You can change the surface dramatically. And then none of all ratings (be it Fällkniven or any retailer) will be accurate.

I don't like how you talk to me. Sorry.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

My personal experience is that I use my CC4 dry because for me it's a portable pocket sharpener / honer / stropper, and I take one with me if I go somewhere for a little longer, or if I go where I know I might need a touch up or something. It's way more convenient for me to use the CC4 dry, because it's just simpler for me and you don't need to bring or make or requite water or oil or soap water. Every now and then I just clean the light side with not even a whole drop of Ballistol and something to wipe off that steel residue. The rough side I rarely ever need, but I used it a bunch a few times when I did some minor fixing, and it's still the same rough. Maybe they suggest to use ceramics dry because these stones don't need water or oil to function. But then people will do what they prefer anyways. Thinking about it, I didn't have to use my trusty 5k / 2k grit waterstone in a long time, which I only keep at home, but that's me.
I started out on an oil stone when I was a young lad, and you really needed to create that paste with the residue that gets bonded in the oil. It's basically that fine-grained oil-paste that sharpens the edge and not the stone itself with oil stones; as far as my experience goes.
And I used my CC4 dry for a couple of years by now, and it hasn't glazed yet.

Many don't realize they're mostly burnishing rather than cutting because the worn grit does still remove some steel, and the material is so hard that it provides an effect much like a butcher's steel. But also, because they're best used for light touchups, they also undergo less wear than a lot of stones do. It's most likely to be seen by people using very hard steels and trying to use them more heavily than best practices dictate.

 

[Papilio]

I don't like how you talk to me. Sorry.

Maybe you should read your post after my first answer again ;-) I did not like the way you tutored me, too. It's not what you say, but how you say it.
I did my best to answer your question. All you did was to emphasize all my errors.

 

[Stahl-Enthusiast]

Many don't realize they're mostly burnishing rather than cutting because the worn grit does still remove some steel, and the material is so hard that it provides an effect much like a butcher's steel. But also, because they're best used for light touchups, they also undergo less wear than a lot of stones do. It's most likely to be seen by people using very hard steels and trying to use them more heavily than best practices dictate.

Aah I see. On harder steels I am using industrial diamond stuff too. Maybe I don't see any glazing / burnishing on my CC4 because I use "the appropriate steels" for it; I mostly use it for steels under 60 HRC (or roundabout 60) and for carbon steels. (I like to edc a small fixed in carbon steel.) Carbon steels can be well over 60 HRC as well, but their carbides are usually not as hard as those formed with chrome, vanadium and so on. And I didn't think I could hone my D2 blades as well with my CC4 as it happened to work out, maybe the ones I got are not much abobe 60 HRC, but even then I expected the harder and chunkier carbides in D2 to cause me more trouble. For anything significantly above 60 HRC I prefer a DC4 for example, when I am on the move, or other industrial diamond tools. Fällkniven also mentions the very fine side is mostly for polishing by the way, but I to hone with it to touch an edge up mostly; that way I don't really have to go through a full on reprofiling / sharpening and so on, but that's me I guess.
I also got a telescopic steel whetting rod, but that one I only use to straighten out a deformed edge. That way I can save material and time. It happens rarely, but it's great to have while being not at home. Steel rods are actually great in the kitchen, because kitchen knives usually have quite fine edges, softer steel and the edge also tend to roll from extended use, and in kitchens it's just so much faster to straighten back up a rolled / deformed edge than actually going to sharpen them and remove material and create a new edge (especially in a work environment, and not the private kitchen). But yeah, steel rods don't sharpen, and you use them like a strop, but not to sharpen, but just to straighten back up a deformed edge. With edc that usually doesn't happen often, but that also can happen. Depending on what happened I use different things, and depending on where I am. That CC4 is great to edc though, from my personal experience.
And yeah, if you glaze your CC4, try a DC4 instead (for example).

 

[Stahl-Enthusiast]

Maybe you should read your post after my first answer again ;-) I did not like the way you tutored me, too. It's not what you say, but how you say it.
I did my best to answer your question. All you did was to emphasize all my errors.

Sorry, but I don't have the capacity or the will to argue out these personal matters with you and to deal with your personality / constant snarky remarks that are very annoying to me. I am mostly here for sharing information and experiences, and not to deal with postings getting personal. No offense, and have a good day!

 

[Papilio]

Sorry, but I don't have the capacity or the will to argue out these personal matters with you and to deal with your personality / constant snarky remarks that are very annoying to me. I am mostly here for sharing information and experiences, and not to deal with postings getting personal. No offense, and have a good day!

I don't think that you know my personality after sharing two posts. How do you know that I am "constant snarky"? Did you read all my postings?
You are the first one to complain. Maybe it is not my personality.
Enjoy the forum!

Btw: When s.b. says " no offense", it's most likely the opposite.

 

[Stahl-Enthusiast]

I don't think that you know my personality after sharing two posts. How do you know that I am "constant snarky"? Did you read all my postings?
You are the first one to complain. Maybe it is not my personality.
Enjoy the forum!

Btw: When s.b. says " no offense", it's most likely the opposite.

I would very much appreciate it, if you could stop with the personal matters and not make a harmless topic / comment derail into getting all personal like that from your first comment addressed at me until now, throughout all of your comments addressed at me.

I would very much appreciate it, if we could stay on topic and be friendly, and not throw around implications of personal attacks and direct personal attacks (or whatever you want to call it).

I hope I was clear enough now, to make this getting personal stuff finally stop.
This topic is about CC4 grit ratings after all.

Maybe we have started out on the wrong foot, but when we meet again I hope we can stay on subject.
I think both of us got better things to do, than fighting each other on a personal level.