Fighting knife

BladeScout said:
I mean no disrespect, but the imperative words are 'if needed.' So you never had any cause to use the Manix hence as no empirical evidence of how it might or not have worked in a fight (I must stress, that I never have used a folder for fighting/self defense and hope to avoid having that situation arise. On my tours I did carry a fixed knife, but it was mainly used for slicing the plastic off rations and the like. I believe we were all aware, that were we to land ourselves in a situation where knife fighting was involved, we would have failed abysmally).
Just saying.....
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As to this-when I was working overseas my job entailed the very real possibility of getting snatched,and firearms don't work so well in a grapple-no matter how well trained you are they're still unidirectional. I carried a dedicated fighting knife (which I'm very grateful only came out of the sheath for oiling), and made very sure I knew how to use it.
That begs the question-are we talking "dueling knife" (where both combatants have knives) or "fighting knife" (where one has a knife and is using it as an antipersonnel scraper in CQB, and the other person could have quite literally anything, or be unarmed.)
As far as I'm concerned they aren't the same critter at all.
 
The Zieg said:
It seems most of us carrying knives for defense do so for peace of mind and for the confidence conveyed by having a tool that gives us a leg-up on assailants who outclass us in fight. Therefore, the folding fighter is a not a oxymoron. The navajas of Spain did strong work in this regard for about two hundred years and they varied from four to ten inches in blade length. The current incarnation of those Andalusian beasts is the Espada XL by Cold Steel. Check that one out.

Zieg

navajas_and_snickersnees1.jpg


ColdSteelEspada_1.jpg
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Large Navajas were popular just because peasants couldn't carry fixed blades and swords not because they are superior.
 
Spectre said:
Your first point is fine, though if one folder is demonstrably stronger than another, within reason, the stronger folder would seem like the better choice (until one gets into over-large, as the Espada in question is for most people/situations).
To your second point, I designed a knife that Spyderco is making especially for situations service members might be in where they did not have their service weapon or their service buddies. I'm pretty sure you'll agree that just taking a shower is not an "abysmal failure", and I designed a knife for that especially vulnerable situation.

John Shirley
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As to your first point, I totally agree.
As for the second part, I remember reading about the 'shower rape/asault' knife a while back (the ARK IIRC). With respect. I admit that I didnt quite knew what to make of it at first. This was a non-problem, where I was deployed.
After reading on, it made a bit more sense + Sal dont make no frivolous knives:)
In the desert, showers in the field didnt exist. When in camp where there were showers, assaults were not a factor; the local/foreign workers referred to in connection to the ARK knife were few and not often present in my neck of the 'woods'.
.......hmmmmm, maybe I should carry my MISSION MBK TI or my MPU TI when next I shower, lol.
Kudos for having designed a knife with Spyderco.
 
J W Bensinger said:
As to this-when I was working overseas my job entailed the very real possibility of getting snatched,and firearms don't work so well in a grapple-no matter how well trained you are they're still unidirectional. I carried a dedicated fighting knife (which I'm very grateful only came out of the sheath for oiling), and made very sure I knew how to use it.
That begs the question-are we talking "dueling knife" (where both combatants have knives) or "fighting knife" (where one has a knife and is using it as an antipersonnel scraper in CQB, and the other person could have quite literally anything, or be unarmed.)
As far as I'm concerned they aren't the same critter at all.
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Good points and a distinction worthy of consideration (i.e. whether only one party or both are armed with cold steel).

Purely hypothetical- If I was working abroad and not able to carry a firearm or for some reason suddenly found myself without a firearm, a dedicate fighting knife could make all the difference in a 'sticky' situation (pun intended). Again, a fixed knife in my preference.
 
BladeScout said:
As to your first point, I totally agree.
As for the second part, I remember reading about the 'shower rape/asault' knife a while back (the ARK IIRC). With respect. I admit that I didnt quite knew what to make of it at first. This was a non-problem, where I was deployed.
After reading on, it made a bit more sense + Sal dont make no frivolous knives:)
In the desert, showers in the field didnt exist. When in camp where there were showers, assaults were not a factor; the local/foreign workers referred to in connection to the ARK knife were few and not often present in my neck of the 'woods'.
.......hmmmmm, maybe I should carry my MISSION MBK TI or my MPU TI when next I shower, lol.
Kudos for having designed a knife with Spyderco.
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Yeah, I think exactly when in the conflict one comes in, makes a huge difference. If you're "in early" when mostly US personnel are around, your risks are probably going to be different than later in the conflict, when practically all manual labor is done by LNs and TCNs. On my 2006 deployment, I spent part of the time on a tiny firebase with a handful of Americans. At night, there were only maybe 4 people there who weren't US troops. This is very different from my 2011-12 deployment, where there were approximately 1000 Romanians who were the SecFor for KAF, and thousands of workers who they had just lost accountability for.
Thank you. It was a good design, but Spyderco's input and attention to detail made it better. My belief that they could make it better, along with superior ethics, is why I talked to Sal in the first place.

John
 
BladeScout said:
Good points and a distinction worthy of consideration (i.e. whether only one party or both are armed with cold steel).

Purely hypothetical- If I was working abroad and not able to carry a firearm or for some reason suddenly found myself without a firearm, a dedicate fighting knife could make all the difference in a 'sticky' situation (pun intended). Again, a fixed knife in my preference.
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I was pretty heavily armed-but the knife was a definite asset
Folder if necessary...but fixie by choice. This was my rig:

Dedicated reverse grip, inside edge primary...and not what I'd want against a dueling knife. I'd rather have a chair leg lol
 
Spyder59 said:
Ah, but folders are superior in conceal-ability.
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Yet still dont make as effective a fighting knife as a fixed blade;)

What? You cant conceal a big ole' fixed blade fighting knife, I hear you say......?:D

Agree to disagree;

Bagwell on carrying a decent size fixed blade concealed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_bIQUXXKLw

Panther Carry Concealment Systems sheaths
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kXp5zGqwmw

Im a big fan of this type of sheath/knife and where legal, Id rather carry a Hells Belle or a Kwaiken for that matter over a dinky folder every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
Just my opinion of course.
 
BladeScout said:
Good points and a distinction worthy of consideration (i.e. whether only one party or both are armed with cold steel).

Purely hypothetical- If I was working abroad and not able to carry a firearm or for some reason suddenly found myself without a firearm, a dedicate fighting knife could make all the difference in a 'sticky' situation (pun intended). Again, a fixed knife in my preference.
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When I was originally active duty, I identified a need for a quick-access knife after a situation where one of my squadmates narrowly escaped injury after getting tangled in some gear while getting off a truck. At that point, I came to believe that a 3-4" fixed blade, worn on the LBV or armor, was the answer. On my first deployment, I used a "Speed Dialer" with a WAVEd Endura to give an instantly available blade that took up almost no additional weight and little additional space.
Sam and I are currently working on a true combat knife that will be larger than the last-ditch ARK without being the boat anchor most so-called combat knives are.

John
 
If you can find a Spyderco Chinook, that'd be my recommendation. Really wish I had held onto mine. It was a tough-as-nails blade, and although I only used it as a tool, I was very confident in its ability as a weapon.
 
puukkoman said:
If you can find a Spyderco Chinook, that'd be my recommendation. Really wish I had held onto mine. It was a tough-as-nails blade, and although I only used it as a tool, I was very confident in its ability as a weapon.
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I used to say that, if I was in a conflict and handicapped by only being able to use a folding knife, the Chinook would be my first choice.

The Manix 2 XL has replaced the Chinook in that role for me, and I believe the handle shape means it carries much easier in a pocket.
 
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J W Bensinger said:
I was pretty heavily armed-but the knife was a definite asset
Folder if necessary...but fixie by choice. This was my rig:
-PIC-
Dedicated reverse grip, inside edge primary...and not what I'd want against a dueling knife. I'd rather have a chair leg lol
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That knife config should do the trick if forced into a confrontation.
Yeah, same here; that or a motorbike...or any prospect of not getting tangled in a knife fight, lol.
 
Spectre said:
When I was originally active duty, I identified a need for a quick-access knife after a situation where one of my squadmates narrowly escaped injury after getting tangled in some gear while getting off a truck. At that point, I came to believe that a 3-4" fixed blade, worn on the LBV or armor, was the answer. On my first deployment, I used a "Speed Dialer" with a WAVEd Endura to give an instantly available blade that took up almost no additional weight and little additional space.
Sam and I are currently working on a true combat knife that will be larger than the last-ditch ARK without being the boat anchor most so-called combat knives are.

John
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The need for having the ability to being quickly untangled also weighed heavily on my mind and was identified early on - I quite agree.
All that gear and very quickly egressing APCs made for messy situations at times and was why I always carried a Benchmade Rescue Hook with a Malice Clip for MOLLE on my vest.
Diesel dont ignite as easily as gas, but man, when it gets going, it sure makes for a spectacular and lethal situation. Especially, when we are talking an APC with hundreds of gallons in spare cans.
Today I carry this which also has an integrated seat belt cutter:

 
Another sturdy and aggressive folder, (and remarkably cheap), that I would consider choosing if I absolutely had to choose a folding knife to fight with;

United Cutlery's Williamson urban tactical Blondie








Thing is an aggressively designed beast of a folder for slashing and stabbing, or just using it's weight like a roll of nickles to punch or hammerfist with while holding it,
*which at 5.6oz. Is actually not all that heavy for a nearly 4.5" blade and 5.75" handle. It's a very minimalist design for sure, no frills, just lots of knife and it balances just below the finger choil, all but dead center on the overall length;

it's a sizeable, sharp, simple, tough and sturdy framelock, easy to manipulate - open - and with an aggressive handle to not lose grip. Another one of those impulse buys i made, saw the sale price of $25 (and i love 440c), so figured it wouldnt hurt to toss it into a free shipping cart with other purchases i was already making, and while i figured worst case i gift it to someone, i was actually surprised how well built it is for a U.C. and i kept it...

Biggest downfall to it being a "fighting knife" is no metal liner to back the g10 side of the handle, so there is the greatee risk of the g10 cracking... I'm seriously considering moding it to address that issue though... Maybe one of these days...
*(not suitable for smallish hands though).
 
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M3 Fighting knife or M4 bayonet. Real purpose designed and issued fighting knives.

PAL%2520US%2520M3.JPG

Imperial%2520M4%2520Bayonet.JPG
 
ourgon said:
Large Navajas were popular just because peasants couldn't carry fixed blades and swords not because they are superior.
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Yep, just like today. Man, this thread has gone off the rails. I'm outta here.

Zieg
 
How about something like this?

 
I had a Benchmade version of the CQC-7 way back in the day. 970-ish model...

If I was looking for a "fighting folder", I'd get another one.

It was ergonomic, tough as nails, and the ATS-34 was something I could get to wicked sharpness. The tip could probably pierce steel.

I had an Emerson CQC-7 with the wave feature too. I'd pick the Benchmade version in a heartbeat. The "wave" I simply found gimmicky.

Keep what you got, is what I say.
 
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