GEC #143223 Crown Lifter/Beer Cub/Barlow/Gentleman’s Jack

Will Power said:
Yeah, but we in Europe call Elk elk and Moose when it's in the US. They're both Alces alces. US Elk or Wapiti is Cervus canadensis and a close relative of the European Red Deer - Cervus elaphus. All CAN provide handles for knives, American Elk & Red Deer can give quite nice antler, not so much Elk/Moose nor Reindeer. Anyway you don't call them Reindeer but some Caribou thing - except when they're Rudolph pulling the sleigh ;) :D

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Most of these naming issues arose when the Europeans arrived and tried to fit things into their own labels and may have been better served to use the current residents names.
 
Probably, only they didn't, due to indifference to indigenous languages or incompetence. Fortunately another European Carl Linnaeus bothered to classify animals and plants in Latin enabling us still to understand differences in naming. My point is about antler - Sambar gives the best and most complex antler and it is native neither to Europe or the Americas. American Elk, Red Deer and Père David can provide interesting quality too but less complex and with a tendency to pith.
 
Will Power said:
Probably, only they didn't, due to indifference to indigenous languages or incompetence. Fortunately another European Carl Linnaeus bothered to classify animals and plants in Latin enabling us still to understand differences in naming. My point is about antler - Sambar gives the best and most complex antler and it is native neither to Europe or the Americas. American Elk, Red Deer and Père David can provide interesting quality too but less complex and with a tendency to pith.
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And unless they add to the NF 14 offerings it will be another run without out stag. Aside from the rendezvous knife, I believe we are going back to September 2022 the 59 run being the last. My point of the Christmas miracle in the first place. 😉🎄⛄️
 
Will Power said:
Yeah, but we in Europe call Elk elk and Moose when it's in the US. They're both Alces alces. US Elk or Wapiti is Cervus canadensis and a close relative of the European Red Deer - Cervus elaphus. All CAN provide handles for knives, American Elk & Red Deer can give quite nice antler, not so much Elk/Moose nor Reindeer. Anyway you don't call them Reindeer but some Caribou thing - except when they're Rudolph pulling the sleigh ;) :D
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They look vastly different to me.

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It's funny, I was just reading a thread on here from a few years back about moose covers and the general consensus was that the tines make excellent covers that, when polished, are a passable substitute for ivory. It was also mentioned that there are techniques for getting good handle material from the paddles/palms/flats as well.

What I'd really like is for Bill Howard to get his hands on some of that elusive Florida Sambar stag.

Hey - want to see an antelope?? Stop me if you've heard this one... 🤣🤣🤣
 
Will Power said:
Probably, only they didn't, due to indifference to indigenous languages or incompetence. Fortunately another European Carl Linnaeus bothered to classify animals and plants in Latin enabling us still to understand differences in naming. My point is about antler - Sambar gives the best and most complex antler and it is native neither to Europe or the Americas. American Elk, Red Deer and Père David can provide interesting quality too but less complex and with a tendency to pith.
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I don't know much about knives but as a hunter of red and sambar I do know my deer. I wouldn't say sambar is any more complex or beautiful than red. It's all a matter of the of the deer, the time of year, where it lives etc. That determine the aesthetics. It's the pearling that really gives antler its beauty in my eyes, that is the textured look it has. If anything I'd say a mature red stag early in the season has far more complexity in its pearling and texture, sambar has more basic prominent ridges running linearly.
They may vary in density and thickness, but all deer antler has pithy parts as antler is bone and needs a blood supply during development. Sambar are typically thicker so probably have more solid bone.
It'd possible that sambar don't rub as much as reds, not sure. But their cast antlers tend to retain their quality, reds on the other hand rub vigorously toward the time of antler drop and late season deer typically have worn off much of their pearling. Farmed reds, forget about it they have very pale antler and wear them down fast rubbing fence posts and such. I think farmed reds would be the main source for antler and probably why any you've seen lacks the eye catchyness.
I've got some hunted red stag heads from early season in my shed that would make incredible knives. There's one 11 pt I shot a few years back that I've been eyeing off for just that.
 
Jiki said:
My point of the Christmas miracle in the first place. 😉🎄⛄
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A Northfield 15 in stag, clip blade, with un-X-ld shield. 🎅 Or even a stag BullBuster? Stagbuster? Hope that doesn't mean anything bad, lol.
 
The sawcut looks great! That’s the one I was most looking forward to, so I’m glad it sounds like they made a lot of those. I’ve got one on the way, looks like it’ll be here Monday. I’m hoping to get ahold of at least one of the wood ones, but we’ll see what happens.
 
So, the only crownlifter variants are the two Tidiuote?

Would anyone know how these compare to the 15s size wise? Specifically the Radio Jack SFO? Been looking to replace mine for a bit now.
 
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serpentine009 said:
So, the only crownlifter variants are the two Tidiuote?

Would anyone know how these compare to the 15s size wise? Specifically the Radio Jack SFO? Been looking to replace mine for a bit now.
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I tend to look at bladehq when trying to understand the size for GEC knives. They keep up the specs for what seems like any GEC they have sold.
 
Hatchet_Jack said:
I don't know much about knives but as a hunter of red and sambar I do know my deer. I wouldn't say sambar is any more complex or beautiful than red. It's all a matter of the of the deer, the time of year, where it lives etc. That determine the aesthetics. It's the pearling that really gives antler its beauty in my eyes, that is the textured look it has. If anything I'd say a mature red stag early in the season has far more complexity in its pearling and texture, sambar has more basic prominent ridges running linearly.
They may vary in density and thickness, but all deer antler has pithy parts as antler is bone and needs a blood supply during development. Sambar are typically thicker so probably have more solid bone.
It'd possible that sambar don't rub as much as reds, not sure. But their cast antlers tend to retain their quality, reds on the other hand rub vigorously toward the time of antler drop and late season deer typically have worn off much of their pearling. Farmed reds, forget about it they have very pale antler and wear them down fast rubbing fence posts and such. I think farmed reds would be the main source for antler and probably why any you've seen lacks the eye catchyness.
I've got some hunted red stag heads from early season in my shed that would make incredible knives. There's one 11 pt I shot a few years back that I've been eyeing off for just that.
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Interesting to get an hunter's in the field perspective :thumbsup:

You should take a bit of time to look over the long running Saturday Stag thread, some really good examples of different types of Antler there in situ as knife handles . Red Deer certainly will make good handles when you get the right type - I have knives from France & Germany, Argentina with very nice slabs. American Elk (Wapiti) also offers different but rewarding Antler, some excellent GEC stainless knives have appeared in it and the Buck 2018 Forum Knife is another fine example. European Elk (Moose) can be OK but the Antler soon calcifies in the wild if not retrieved quickly or devoured by animals. My point is that Sambar Stag is universally admired for good reason: its variety and complexity plus its durability. If you look at very old knives from the English & German cutlers of the late c19th early c20th you find Stag of astonishing beauty that has aged fantastically . GEC has had some really admirable Sambar knives until lately when the supply seems to have all but dried up. The Sambar Deer is native to the Indian subcontinent and is a large animal, it is under threat due to vanishing habitat, human population increase, poaching. It is also a favoured prey of the Tiger, another magnificent animal threatened by us. So restrictions have been made on the export of Antler to protect the owners of these antlers ;) There are small herds in the US- that you have clearly hunted- but they will lack the genetic variety of the Indian animals, may not produce such interesting antler, food, habitat can also impact on Stag quality. Interestingly, Père David Deer were a native of China and became near extinct, herds in England reared I think by the Duke of Bedford? at the start of the c20th , provided individuals for re-introduction to China. Its Antler can be very nice as Polished Stag but it lacks grooves, popcorn, fissures etc and is often pithy.

Finally, the sheer variety of Stag gives it such appeal as one of the finest knife handles and GEC has added to that appreciation over recent years. You really should get that Red Deer Antler out of your shed and made up into knife slabs :cool::D

Thanks, Will

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