Gore tex in boots, a good idea but...............

I agree that the advertisers made me have too high expectations when purchasing my first gore tex dress. Statements like "Incredible breathing ability combined with a 100% waterproof membrane," should set off the "sceptic-alarm."
The first time I used gore tex was a sunny but windy day on a trip in the mountains with a friend. I was ready for the outdoor clothing revolution.
After an our with walking I felt like a drowned cat. My friend was very supportive with his ironic remarks.
At that time I couldn't get the image of the dress prize tag out of my head.
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However the next two days it was constantly raining. The only drowning cat around for those two days was my ironic friend.
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During the season wear and tear evened the score a bit.
Some years later I still think gore tex works quite well. The combination of qualities makes it my first choice.
After a rainy day you can leave it in the outer tent and it's dry or almost dry the next morning. Of course the jacket must go on and off to adjust temperature and dampness. The prize and decreasing performance after some time are the obvious downsides. You always end up with a nice water-repellent jacket.
 
I do not wish to offend anyone, but it has been my experience that if you are paying $200 for a knife or a pair of boots you are buying the name. Buy quality gear that is proven, but don't send some guy's kid to college equipping yourself with what's "in". Best regards, Clayton
 
Thanks Greg. On another note I have heard that a lot of members of the Alaska National Guard have followed the earlier recommendations of special operations groups and purchased Wiggys bags. My cousin was stationed in Alaska and participated in the tests on the current issue sleeping bags. He told me the temp ratings were way off. Many unit commanders expressed their concern about the issue sleeping bags during the tests and this did not make Natick, nor the Army happy. After the failed tests, the Alaska National Guard was going to purchase the sleeping bags from Wiggys, but soon after hearing this, the bags dropped to half the original contract price so the Guard is now stuck with them. As always, politics overrule good judgement. Regards, Clayton.
 
Nimrod makes a excellent point about breathability.My feet sweat lots after the beez wax has been applied.......Is there any way around this or am I just stuck wearing ovens ?

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Jay
Life is like a box of chocolates,never know what your gona git!
ICQ#4571042
 
All, I apologize that his doesn't fit the current discussion.

Clayton, how do you mean that the bag ratings were off? Were they too generous in rating so that one would become too cold at the extreme temp range. I've been very intrigued by Wiggys claims and have been thinking about getting a system myself. I understand that "ratings" are to be taken with a grain, therefore I always look for a bag that is rated slightly higher than the ambient air temp expected. (eg. with a SD polargaurd 3D bag, rating 0 degrees...I can comfortably use this bag if the air temp is as low as -20 to 25 degrees. Mind you, I sleep very warm and start sweating my arse off if the temp gets near the bag rating) Truthfully, I would rather be a slight chilly than to be a soaked mess when I need to climb out.
 
Strabs, the military issue "integrated sleep system" is rated to -30 degrees F when the user is wearing issue polypro undergarments. The soldiers that first tested these bags became uncomfortable at around 0 degrees F, if I recall correctly. Nonetheless, the rating of -30 is way off. I was never issued this bag so I cannot personally say. I was however issued the bivy bag, which was quite dissapointing to me. I stayed wet with condensation inside the Gore-Tex bivy bag. As far as Wiggy's bags, the ratings are right on in my experiance anyway. Ratings are only a guide, of course, but many manufacturers could do much better by actually testing their products and making changes if nessesary. The bottom line is, even W.L. Gore & Associates is rethinking the use of Gore-Tex in sleeping bags.In a conversation I had with Jerry Wigutow, the maker of Wiggy's bags, he told me that in order for something to breath, it had to be living.
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Gore-Tex probably works great in the lab conditions that it was developed in, but the real world is a bit different. I think that once fabric technology catches up, Gore-Tex may be as good as it is currently marketed to be, but mabye not. Why improve a product that already sells better than anything else.
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If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Learn good fieldcraft and save your money for what has worked in the real world. Fancy equipment will never replace good 'ole common sense. Regards, Clayton Hufford
 
Can anyone recommend a good pair of three-season hiking boots for someone who A) is a tightwad and doesn't want to have to buy new ones in two years, B) has rather wide feet, and C) has very warm feet (lived in the former Czechoslovakia for 5 years and never got cold feet, even in cotton socks and my cheapo, thin "urban hikers." My preferences run toward traditional styling (i.e. leather over gore tex).
Thanks in advance.
 
mnblade, I have had good results with military jungle boots. I have been wearing U.S. military jungle boots for hiking and canoeing for over ten years now with no complaints. I prefer the OD canvas ones. You can purchase jungle boots through many retailers, as well as direct from the two contractors, Bellville Shoe Co. and Altama. Regards, Clayton Hufford
 
I love Goretex! I first encountered it when stationed an Ft. Lewis, Washington (9th ID days). Nothing will keep you dry all the time on a 30-day FTX with lots of moving, patrolling, setting-up, and tearing-down, but goretex will keep your drier than anything else I've ever tried. I think the real reason alot of folks don't like goretex is because they think it's some kind of miracle-cure. It's not. You still have to use basic field hygiene (wash yourself, change your underwear and socks often, dress in layers, ect).
As for the sleeping bags, I was always amazed at how alot of Soldiers don't care where they choose to sleep: some will throw down their sleeping-bag right in a shallow depression or in a small draw and then complain about how they got flooded when it rained. It's just like buying a house: location, location, location!
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by GREENJACKET:
Goretex works best when it can transfer water vapour, sweat, from a warm steamy inside to a cold dry airy outside. That's why you see the advertisements with Artic explorers, because thats where it works best.

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I am not a goretex user, but I do know that when it comes to extreme cold temperatures, any barrier to vapor movement, even if it's semi-permeable like goretex, will gather condensation and get you wet. Extreme cold offers no threat from external moisture, the only threat is internal moisture. Wear something tightly woven on the outside to keep dry snow from sticking, but don't bother with any kind of waterproof anything. I've come in from playing in very subzero temps wearing wool and polypro, and had ice all over my back and head from condensation. I hadn't sweated enough to ever be wet, or even damp, but I had evaporated enough to coat myself in ice. Good canvas, with proper insulation underneath, is all you need for boots/gaitors to keep the snow from sticking.

Stryver

 
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