Help me understand price ceiling...

For me, a lot of what makes me consider spending more based on a brand name comes from perceived reputation in putting out a quality product. Since I've not bought dozens of knives from various brands I tend to read as many informed opinions as I can to get a sense of how consistent a company is with their product. I couple that with the experiences I've had with the few products I did purchase and that helps me decide if I'm willing to spend more beyond a simple comparison of materials.

For instance, I held off on purchasing a Benchmade for more than a year. I kept reading comments about how inconsistent they were, but many also saying how nice the knives are. I wasn't willing to spend the money to "hopefully" get a good product. When I did eventually buy the mini Crooked River I saw what most were talking about. Good knife, but came with some flaws. The blade had a burr and one of the springs has broken after hardly any use. This only reinforces how hesitant I'll be in the future in spending $200+ on more of their products.

In comparison, I would happily spend similar money on a Spyderco knife with hardly a concern. Every single knife of theirs I've purchased has had barely an issue. I can confidently asses whether I like a Spyderco knife based on specs and pictures and not have to worry whether the knife I do end up getting will work as expected. For that, I'm willing to pay that little extra.
 
So anyway; Price Ceiling is technically a term used for when a government controls the price of a commodity. A rent control is a good widespread example of this.

The thread seems to have drifted into a different economic and political bent. The sum of it appears that the system that most western knife makers have built their success on called Capitalism is unacceptable to some individual agitators.

As always as they say you are entitled to your own opinion. And as come into the current vernacular you aren't entitled to your own facts. The "spidergreed' person has used false premises to create their own facts to support their position. And weirdly their issue isn't around the more exotic and high priced knives but instead the bread and butter affordable knives made in China.

The gist of it appears to be that if "China" can make a $2 knife then any Spyderco knife made in China should also be $2. To this person the floor price is where the discussion starts and ends. They are unwilling to accept that a $75 Tenacious could be that much better than another Chinese product.

To me that's setting off my Spydersense. Combined with the user name, and the other posts about background it does feel like a Chinese factory owner who spends his days pumping out counterfeits and behaving in a disrespectful manner. Who in an ironic twist of fate very life revolves around the pursuit of profit in a manner that would bring a tear to the eye of a robber baron of old.

To coin a new term; sounds like "Spyderenvy" has reared it's ugly head.

The solution for anyone who's jealous of another brand's success or popularity is to hoe your own garden.
 
"Price ceiling" was probably not the best choice of words. But that's what many people have expressed. Saying "I wouldn't spend that much on a Spyderco" is a personal limit for the brand.

Interesting comment about Benchmade. I don't want to belabor that on the Spyderco forum, but all things being equal I would pay MORE for a name brand knife rather than a mid-Tech or a custom. Back to point I made in the first post, imagine a $500 knife. Now imagine the same knife is made by a custom maker, a mid-tech maker, and Spyderco (this is theoretical) . Which is the better knife? For me, the Spyderco is the better option based on the ability to get parts and service for an extended period of time. I tend to value manufactures who will be able to send me pocket clips in 5 years or sell me a replacement blade if needed.

You could argue that a custom or mid-tech is likely appreciate in value. I have no issue with that. But then you're not really buying a knife, you're essentially investing in something you hope will appreciate. Another counter argument is the Slysz Bowie - you never know what will become more valuable.
 
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See for me the Mid-Tech knifes don't strike a chord. I find myself most drawn to form follows function followed by price.

For me knives are to be used so I don't worry about appreciation and if I use a knife it'll loose value. I enjoy very much what Spyderco does when they partner up with other makers. That gets you a nice knife that's not a product of a cookie cutter production line.

I find the Mid-Techs are aimed to people who want a custom but can't afford it. Short answer they're a massive compromise with a nod to the Champagne taste/Beer budget folks.

I for sure have a Beer budget. But I love Beer so win/win. The principle playing the cards you're dealt works well for me.
 
Danke42 said:
See for me the Mid-Tech knifes don't strike a chord. I find myself most drawn to form follows function followed by price.

For me knives are to be used so I don't worry about appreciation and if I use a knife it'll loose value. I enjoy very much what Spyderco does when they partner up with other makers. That gets you a nice knife that's not a product of a cookie cutter production line.

I find the Mid-Techs are aimed to people who want a custom but can't afford it. Short answer they're a massive compromise with a nod to the Champagne taste/Beer budget folks.

I for sure have a Beer budget. But I love Beer so win/win. The principle playing the cards you're dealt works well for me.
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Interesting. As an owner of mid-techs I think I agree. You get most of the disadvantages of a custom but not the "uniqueness" value factor. I now think of mid-techs as production knives from people who have less equipment and capacity. (No offense intended - there are great mid-techs.)

Here's my issue with customs: say I get an awesome $800 knife where I can't get it refinished or a scale replaced if I scratch it. What am I going to do with it? Cut marshmallows? Are all customs destined to be safe queens? Could just be me. fwiw, I've had a Norseman. Great, odd, interesting knife. I just couldn't see using it.
 
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RipD said:
Interesting. As an owner of mid-techs I think I agree. You get most of the disadvantages of a custom but not the "uniqueness" value factor. I now think of mid-techs as production knives from people who have less equipment and capacity. (No offense intended - there are great mid-techs.)

Here's my issue with customs: say I get an awesome $800 knife where I can't get it refinish or a scale replaced if I scratch it. What am I going to do with it? Cut marshmallows? Are all customs destined to be safe queens? Could just be me. fwiw, I've had a Norseman. Great, odd, interesting knife. I just couldn't see using it.
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Well if it makes you feel any better some folks say the very same thing about a $50 knife and other say that when it's $100.
 
Yep. I was there too. I scratched the coating on my Drifter blade and was mad at myself for it. I got some scratches on my Chaparral blade and am not happy. My tolerance for using and marking up more expensive knives is increasing. I blame you guys.
 
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I hope Taiwan doesn’t reunite with China soon, as I still don’t have a Taichung spydie! Of the last batch of discontinued folders, I only picked up 2 or the fluted Ti Millies . I also stocked up enough Military’s from knifeworks’ exclusive sales that I can ride out any future price wars or inflationary price increases. I have about 8 millies in my edc rotation, and another 10 or so still NIB, so the price increases have not bothered me much at all. Seki sprint runs use the same frn patterns on “the big 6” made in Japan, so the increases only amount to about $10 per knife. The only knife I missed out on, and may never own due to the increases, was the shaman.
 
Ganzofan said:
There's a general negative sentiment toward the ever rising Spyderco price where some have coined the term "Spydergreed"

Of course you don't see too much of that on this board but plenty on YouTube comments and other mediums

Anyways, I believe the profit margins are high and you believe it's lower. But both of us are just speculating and no one really knows for sure. And now we know a basis for comparison, 1/6 the cost of Chinese made Spyderco vs others. By reverse calculation it gives us a basis to make more educated speculation on this matter.
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Youtube comments are candidly, meaningless. Look at the comments on ANY video about a knife that was more than $50. The toxicity and the "Meh, my $15 (insert trash knife here) cuts way better than this ever could!" comments are thick on the ground. This baseless assertion of "Spydergreed"* sounds to me like sour grapes from a generation of people who want things to be free, and who feel that companies don't deserve to realize a profit, or if they do, it should only be as much profit as the naysayers have arbitrarily decided. Poor logic all around.


* A term I've never heard of, and I'm a member of multiple knife boards, SubReddits, etc.
 
I treat anything Ganzo says as trollish and/or blissful ignorance as he has shown in the past to support brands with a reputation for at the least underhanded methods. Looking at his arguments with Sal Glesser Sal Glesser I feel he was misreading Sal's response or purposefully twisting it to represent something else.

I will say on the actual subject first posted by the OP I have seen many knives priced by Spyderco at prices that are higher than I would like. I often can see how the price got to where it is/was for these knives but would personally rather have seen some changes that would have likely resulted in a reduction in costs with minimal sacrifice to the end result. The Drunken and Paysan are prime examples currently both nice solid looking knives with some features and materials that could be lost or swapped and result in a product I would ultimately view as equal yet with a probable reduction in cost to where I might consider purchasing/saving up for.
 
Don't know why this thread is revived but as it comes to pricing and buying, nowadays when money is really not easy to make I will be thinking hard before pulling trigger on any folder > $200. For that, I have happily found most mid-range Spydercos fall into my comfy zone of $100-$200 (I did pick up a kw M4/CF for $220 and a kw S90v/cf/ti Military for $240 but they were priced quite fairly IMO).
 
PirateSeulb said:
I treat anything Ganzo says as trollish and/or blissful ignorance as he has shown in the past to support brands with a reputation for at the least underhanded methods. Looking at his arguments with Sal Glesser Sal Glesser I feel he was misreading Sal's response or purposefully twisting it to represent something else.

I will say on the actual subject first posted by the OP I have seen many knives priced by Spyderco at prices that are higher than I would like. I often can see how the price got to where it is/was for these knives but would personally rather have seen some changes that would have likely resulted in a reduction in costs with minimal sacrifice to the end result. The Drunken and Paysan are prime examples currently both nice solid looking knives with some features and materials that could be lost or swapped and result in a product I would ultimately view as equal yet with a probable reduction in cost to where I might consider purchasing/saving up for.
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Hi Pirate,

I agree with you on Ganzo, both poster and company.

On the Paysan and Drunken, we try to make the designs as the collaborator designed them. On our own in-house designs, we pay more attention to lowering cost without lowering quality or design.

sal
 
I see where the cost ends up and I understand you may keep more to the designers wishes or original design. I didn't intend to imply any reduction in quality. Examples of changes I would consider are things like G-10 over titanium and less work put into additions, ie the amount of milling in the Drunken iirc, neither change would compromise the quality but would impact the cost and likely favorably. I am not a machinist but would I be correct to think machining G-10 as a lower cost than Titanium? I am not knocking where those are priced I fully believe based on what went into those two models in the configurations they are offered they fit their price. This price is just beyond my reach yet a design that I like so I must share my dismay in being unable to get my hands on such a knife.

Thank you Sal Glesser Sal Glesser for taking the time to respond.
 
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Hi Pirate,

Understand. Collaborators are very funny about our being true to their design. Most are customs makers so they are accustomed to higher prices, and out prices are much lower than their custom prices.. Sometimes they speak to us about making less expensive models. Perhaps this thread will influence them?

sal
 
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