Horizontal Grinder in my way

[Natlek]

OK guys , this is final drawing of my new toy .When I do something like this I like to use parts I can find around to avoid to much machining .... I have almost all parts to build this , but short with time . I hope that is clear on drawing what I intend to do ...... bearings for contact wheels are from water pump from car engine , most a from INA and have quality .I have dozen new water pump which are for very old automobiles , so ....one for inch Dia. contact wheel , one for two inch....... I will never again use any kind of spring for tension on belt grinder , never ! Tracking wheel will be only for tracking and I will use contact wheels/ with different Dia. of course/ for tension .I have not yet decide about speed of belt , no VFD here ...thinking on about 10 - 15 m/s ? As I make some progress I will update here . . .
What do you think ?

Part for contact wheel and tension ....stainless That shine part pressed on axle of water pump bearing is piston pin..... need polyurethane tube to become 3cm Dia. contact wheel ...probably one most used size ??

Tracking part . . . . not that wheel/bearing of course

 

[Natlek]

I use that idler wheel because when I change size of contact wheel I do not have to constantly adjust the plate behind belt . . ..

 

[Natlek]

Now I can take measurement for plate . I will use 2 X 42 belts on this grinder . I like it so far , from the top of the plate will be visible only wheels and several bolts head and tracking knob . I will be able to use contact wheels from half inch to four inch Dia .wheels . Most used one from me probably will be this one I already made ... it is 27mm Dia.perfect for choil . I intend to make one 4cm , 5cm , 7cm and 10 cm Dia, contact wheels ......Did I need them ?? Drive wheel will be usable to ? For start I will use rubber , if they don t work good I will use polyurethane .Idler wheel will be problematic to use because I need that space for plate behind belt which is important part , should be as long as possible . But I will try . . .
Well here are some pictures , they will better explain then me

Contact wheel will be IN plate not like on picture .....

Handle for tension on belt ...will be under plate to .

Tracking mechanism is ready ....I don t put tracking wheel yet to not damage it .

First contact wheel .............27mm dia.

When wheel run right here we say ..it sleeps

NOW , speed guys , speed ......how much SFPM to run this thing ???Which SFPM you will use for horizontal grinder if VFD is not option ?

 

[Ken H>]

Somewhere between 1000 SFPM and 2,000 SFPM would be my choice..... maybe 1500?

Remember, with the horizontal you're usually not removing much metal, just "trimming" to get the final fit, so a lot of speed isn't really needed.

 

[Natlek]

Well , today I find time to cut plate for this thing .I fabricated everything I need to finish this . And I start with work backwards , from small contact/tension wheel And it works I can set tension as I like , no limit .... Changing belt and size of wheel will be easy because I don t have to fight with tension spring and I have free both hand to do that .Tomorrow I will positioned tracking wheel and motor if I have enough time. It is weird on first look but I think that I do right way .....What do you guys think ?
Pictures from the underside. . . .

Tight belt . . . .

Free belt . . .

View from above

 

[Maelstrom78]

I am not super mechanically inclined but I dig that camming belt tension mechanism. Does it hold the tension well or do you think the vibration would work it loose?

 

[Natlek]

I am not super mechanically inclined but I dig that camming belt tension mechanism. Does it hold the tension well or do you think the vibration would work it loose?

Thanks Well , two M8 screw/bolts will lock that small wheel in place , cam function is only to tight belt .So I don t think that it can loose in any way...

Tomorrow come very fast here I wait guests for dinner , but they have canceled at the last minute So I drill hole and I make all thread for tracking wheel mechanism .And I hate mirror I cut plate in wrong place for shaft of tracking wheel , just as I drill hole for cam on opposite side... I hate mirror Remains to drill one more hole for tracking bolt where is that X. . .

 

[Ken H>]

Natlek, you've got an interesting method of putting belt tension - and I think it's slick and will work really good. I like it.

Now, since I can't PM or email you on this site allow me to hi-jack thread to say your suggestions got me to running a higher belt speed for grinding, and for the last 4 blades I've been freehanding rather than the usual jig method. Blades are getting beveled faster and belt seem to last longer at the high belt speed around 4,000 SFPM. Thanks for your comments to push me in the right direction.

Later

 

[Natlek]

Natlek, you've got an interesting method of putting belt tension - and I think it's slick and will work really good. I like it.

Now, since I can't PM or email you on this site allow me to hi-jack thread to say your suggestions got me to running a higher belt speed for grinding, and for the last 4 blades I've been freehanding rather than the usual jig method. Blades are getting beveled faster and belt seem to last longer at the high belt speed around 4,000 SFPM. Thanks for your comments to push me in the right direction.

Later

Belt tension................it does no mater how it work , simple bolt ...cam like this . . .ratchet or whatever else.What is important is tension to be steady which steel spring or gas spring can not deliver without to much force ....
About speed on grinder.....4000 SFPM is bottom limit for ceramic if you ask me ...double of that is perfect . One more thing........ceramic don t last long grinding annealed steel , they shine and last much longer on hardened steel ...harder better !! That is my modest experience with ceramic belts so far .
Now about this flat grinder
I decide tracking bolt to be from bottom side ......it is easy accessible . And I get one crazy idea , again ...... what if I make rest/work plate like this ???? I don t like idea to use only 5mm belt most time when grinding on this thing ............. ?

I will drill another hole in right place for other wheel , if I ever need deep access on something .
And can t decide about which motor and speed yet

 

[Ken H>]

Looking good - You gonna like that horizontal grinder.

I've not ground much annealed steel in a good while - I use mostly AEB-L and do the HT'ing before grinding, except for profiling and drilling holes. I'm pretty impressed with 4,000 SFPM belt speed. I can only imagine what 8,000 SFPM would do. Faster than I'd care for - any little huh-oh would make a big huh-oh in a hurry!

 

[Natlek]

Looking good - You gonna like that horizontal grinder.

I've not ground much annealed steel in a good while - I use mostly AEB-L and do the HT'ing before grinding, except for profiling and drilling holes. I'm pretty impressed with 4,000 SFPM belt speed. I can only imagine what 8,000 SFPM would do. Faster than I'd care for - any little huh-oh would make a big huh-oh in a hurry!

Thanks Ken , I'm glad you like it My first grinder have 30 m/s and that is maybe best speed .....40 is crazy fast , but with jig is pleasure to grind .
You know what , now I'm not sorry I did not yet finish/make surface grinding attachment . This grinder is perfect for that . Drive wheel is just perfect for this .......I have already fabricated same parts for surface attachment .... plan si to add one more movement/axis so I can grind distal taper bevel ....

 

[Natlek]

Looking good - You gonna like that horizontal grinder.

I've not ground much annealed steel in a good while - I use mostly AEB-L and do the HT'ing before grinding, except for profiling and drilling holes. I'm pretty impressed with 4,000 SFPM belt speed. I can only imagine what 8,000 SFPM would do. Faster than I'd care for - any little huh-oh would make a big huh-oh in a hurry!

One more thing @ Ken H> ...............jig and speed allow me to get extra fine finish with 40 grit belts .When I m almost done with grinding I make several light and smooth pass .....and after that I can see on bevels my ugly face and shave my beard , probably I get something like 600 grit finish Even if it is 40 grit it depends how much pressure we apply and how much deep tip of ceramic dig in steel . . . When grinding free hand on 8000 SFPM is almost impossible to do that ...or very risky Except 40 grit belts I have 80 and 100 grit BUT I've never tried them , no need so far

 

[Natlek]

Would you believe that I can t find my finished tracking wheel for this grinder in my shop I make some progress.....work/rest plate for small wheel side , of course with adjustable angle . I made it from 5mm hardened steel plate .Next I make two plate from angle iron for behind belt .I have ceramic glass for them ..... Also I decide tracking bolt to be from bottom side , no need to be on top .

tracking wheel/bolt.............

drilled and tapered hole for additional wheel

 

[Ken H>]

Would you believe that I can t find my finished tracking wheel for this grinder in my shop

Looking good - and can't find something sounds like me. Work on an item, lay it down for a minute, then can't find it. Good luck {g}

 

[Natlek]

I desperately need to finish this grinder .I can t find right face mount motor and that is .I have only one and it is mono phase 1.5hp + it is to fast ...2950 rpm. I have another one which is 2HP 1400 rpm and three phase , but can be mounted only on legs?? is right word ? WHAT if I use this motor and mount/make it in same time to be tracking wheel ? And get rid of real tracking wheel I have on grinder now ? I mean , to make it two wheel grinder, drive wheel and contact wheel only . What do you think , would this work ?
Something like this ?

 

[A.McPherson]

Sure it could work!
there are lots of 2 wheel grinders out there.
I think the TW-90 uses the motor to handle tracking, and it's widely regarded as the gold standard in knife grinders...

 

[Natlek]

Hey , Im trying to make something and you guys don t help me I mount motor tonight , now I need to fabricate part for tracking bolt ....Do you think this would work ? Speak now so I do not waste my free time that I do not have to much
Whats wrong with Imgur ??? Which link I should copy ????

 

[A.McPherson]

I have problems with imgur too... some times the links work and other times it doesn't... I don't know.

if you mount an "L" shaped arm to your motor mount, 90 degrees to your motor shaft, you can put the adjusting screw at the end of the arm and make it easier to adjust the tracking, and more accurate too. you have to move the screw more to adjust the tracking, but it will be easier to move.

 

[Natlek]

Sure it could work!
there are lots of 2 wheel grinders out there.
I think the TW-90 uses the motor to handle tracking, and it's widely regarded as the gold standard in knife grinders...

Thanks You write post in same time when I was trying to make pictures to work
I wonder if there are differences in which way drive wheel will tilt ?

 

[Natlek]

I have problems with imgur too... some times the links work and other times it doesn't... I don't know.

if you mount an "L" shaped arm to your motor mount, 90 degrees to your motor shaft, you can put the adjusting screw at the end of the arm and make it easier to adjust the tracking, and more accurate too. you have to move the screw more to adjust the tracking, but it will be easier to move.

You mean something like this If I understood you right ?