Input on Spyderco Amalgam vs ZT 0452CF

Better overall knife

  • Spyderco Amalgam

    Votes: 17 43.6%

  • ZT 0452CF

    Votes: 22 56.4%
  • Total voters
    39
jill jackson said:
A little too far for me.
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Mine can do pretty much the same, but it only does it if I deliberately push it. I have never seen it happen other circumstances.
 
Lapedog said:
Mine can do pretty much the same, but it only does it if I deliberately push it. I have never seen it happen other circumstances.
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That was the most any of my frame locks ever went over. I have other ZT's that will barely move.
 
jill jackson said:
It was for me. So it's gone.
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Just cause it was a nuissance or was it causing some actual detriment to the knife’s performance?

I understand why some people would consider the fact that it can be pushed at all a problem in itself; but beyond that did it cause a problem with the function of the knife beyond it just being a nuissance?
 
It was a terrible nuisance and I considered it shoddy workmanship. I wouldn't feel comfortable having one of my framelocks with such mushy lockup. So, I replaced it with the M390 model which I find to be more consistent with the lockup I'm accustomed to.
 
Lapedog said:
Just cause it was a nuissance or was it causing some actual detriment to the knife’s performance?

I understand why some people would consider the fact that it can be pushed at all a problem in itself; but beyond that did it cause a problem with the function of the knife beyond it just being a nuissance?
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If the lockbar can be pushed easily over to the other side, it means the lockup is not solid enough (flexing) and most likely the knife will fail the spine whacking test.
 
I prefer the design of the Amalgam, which is why I bought one instead of a 0452CF. Better blade for cutting, still has a stout tip, better lock, and more deployment options.
 
sharp_edge said:
If the lockbar can be pushed easily over to the other side, it means the lockup is not solid enough (flexing) and most likely the knife will fail the spine whacking test.
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Idk mine doesn’t fail spinewhacks, although to be honest I haven’t whacked it hard enough to fail.

To me the movement seemed to be from the lockface on the tang having too flat a ramp. At the same time the steel lockbar insert wears next to nil as it has no lockstick.

My biggest threat to too shallow a tang lock ramp is that if the lockbar wears it can quickly wear away from contact and thus create lockrock, but again the steel insert hardly wears so I’m not worried about that. I just considered it an oddity of the knife that doesn’t affect function.

But maybe you’re right about lockbar flexing contributing. I can’t say for sure until I have a 452cf to brutally spinewhack.
 
What do I know (?) but I had the 0452 and the blade was really thick behind the edge - best use: stabbing. Have not held the Amalgam.
 
FWIW I would normally pick the Spyderco, but don't really like comp lock flippers and the 0452 is one of those rare knives that is damn near perfect for what it is. I think I've owned and sold every version at one point... Keep narrowing it down to the OG 0452cf user. The Ti was probably my favorite.

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Lapedog said:
That mushy lock charachterisic of the cf versions of the 452 has never been an issue for me. It is a minor nuissance at the most. It has never caused a fault in the lockup and didn’t cause the lockbar to wear over fast or anything.

Actually most my framelocks can be pushed over to some degree even my CRKs.
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It has for me. Cutting anything harder than a sandwich and the lock bar on my 452 would slide all the way over, requiring me to find something to pry the lock open with or to put pressure on the edge to unjam the lock. I can push my CRKs over a little but they pop back to their normal engagement and they don't get jammed up from hard cutting. Flipped like a dream though.

I'm not a fan of the Amalgam so this is a hard decision to make for me.
 
kniferbro said:
It has for me. Cutting anything harder than a sandwich and the lock bar on my 452 would slide all the way over, requiring me to find something to pry the lock open with or to put pressure on the edge to unjam the lock. I can push my CRKs over a little but they pop back to their normal engagement and they don't get jammed up from hard cutting. Flipped like a dream though.

I'm not a fan of the Amalgam so this is a hard decision to make for me.
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Most of my frame locks won't move over hardly any, some not at all. They don't stick either. For ZT to put out a knife that has no radius at all on the blade tang and it will move over so far reminds me of cheap China made frame locks that sold for 10 or 20 dollars. I've seen some of those do the exact same.
 
I have both knives. I prefer the Amalgam as a user because of its ergos, the blade (robust yet slicey thanks to the thick stock but thin grind behind the edge), and the fingerchoil (doubles as a sharpening choil and is shaped to not snag materials when cutting). But I also feel the 0452CF is a more premium knife (and the price reflects that) with a beautiful sleek Sinkevich design and full slabs of carbon fiber and titanium, all combined with the strong snappy action that knife guys tend to look for in a flipper. They're both quite light and carry nicely for their sizes. You can't really go wrong with either, but aside from the general lengths I consider them to be pretty different knives. I suspect most knife guys would choose the 0452CF, but my personal preference is the Amalgam (I mean, I kind of have to like it :p).
 
Much more practical blade shape on the amalgam.

As far as steel, although the ZT has on paper a better steel, ZT generally does a poor job with their heat treats and their steels rarely perform anywhere close to what other makers do with the same alloy. I will give Spyderco the advantage for their S30V over ZT 20CV, they get the absolute best performance from that alloy of any maker I have used.

Also, geometry is WAY better on the Spyderco with a very thin 30 degree edge versus a thick 40-45 degree on the ZT.
 
John_0917 said:
Much more practical blade shape on the amalgam.

As far as steel, although the ZT has on paper a better steel, ZT generally does a poor job with their heat treats and their steels rarely perform anywhere close to what other makers do with the same alloy. I will give Spyderco the advantage for their S30V over ZT 20CV, they get the absolute best performance from that alloy of any maker I have used.

Also, geometry is WAY better on the Spyderco with a very thin 30 degree edge versus a thick 40-45 degree on the ZT.
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ZT 0452CF is in S35V.
 
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John_0917 said:
As far as steel, although the ZT has on paper a better steel, ZT generally does a poor job with their heat treats and their steels rarely perform anywhere close to what other makers do with the same alloy.
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It doesn't really matter to me because I seldom actually use any of my knives BUT is there any technical data to actually prove this assertion?
 
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John_0917 said:
Much more practical blade shape on the amalgam.

As far as steel, although the ZT has on paper a better steel, ZT generally does a poor job with their heat treats and their steels rarely perform anywhere close to what other makers do with the same alloy. I will give Spyderco the advantage for their S30V over ZT 20CV, they get the absolute best performance from that alloy of any maker I have used.

Also, geometry is WAY better on the Spyderco with a very thin 30 degree edge versus a thick 40-45 degree on the ZT.
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Doing a poor heat treat is vastly different than purposefully running it a little soft. Please notice the difference.

I've been fine with zts s35vn. I've also been fine with spyderco's s30v. I'd rather have the s35vn though. Ease of sharpening and a bit more toughness. That said, the differences between these steels is not what would make me choose one knife over the other. I much prefer the aesthetics of the 0452cf.
 
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sgt1372 said:
It doesn't really matter to me because I seldom actually use any of my knives BUT is there any technical data to actually prove this assertion?
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There are tests, namely one or two by Pete (Cedric Ada) in which the S35VN from ZT performs very poorly, like on par with VG10 and 8CR13.
 
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