Legality of carrying a fixed blade in VA?

T

ThePatriot29

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Feb 9, 2002
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I want to carry a fixed blade for defense since being only 18 I can't get a VA carry permit yet. One legal concern though. I'm in Virginia. They've outlawed the carrying of dirks and bowie knives concealed. Virginia case law defines a



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"'dirk' or weapon of like kind" as "any stabbing weapon having two sharp edges and a point"; and defining "'bowie knife' or weapon of like kind" as "any stabbing weapon having a single sharp edge, a dull or serrated flat edge and a point".
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A bowie knife, by this definition, would be practically any "tactical" fixed blade knife with one edge, and a dirk any such knife with two edges. If so, what does this mean for an EDC knife?

In my opinion it's better to be tried by 12 then carried by six. I believe that the only way that anyone would know that I had it would be if I had to use it in defense. I am very discrete, don't show off or brag about what I'm carrying or play with a defense knife publicy. If I had to use it in public, it would be in a defensive capacity, in which case I would be either alive and facing a misdemeanor charge possibly in addition to a homicide investigation, or I'd be dead and not really worrying about breaking VA law. Does this make sense?

I'd be carrying it under a suit coat or jacket. I'm a clean cut individual, never in trouble with the law, don't intend to be, don't fit the typical "gang" profile, so I don't think I'd be targeted for a search.

What are the legal consequences of carrying a concealed fixed blade? Also, do you guys consider it worth it to do so, tried by twelve rather than carried by six?

Does anyone have first hand experience from Virginia?

*Definition taken from Richards v. Commonwealth, 18 Va. App. 242, 245, 246 n.2, 443 S.E.2d 177, 179, 179 n.2 (1994)
 
Hi ThePatriot29,

You are doing exactly the right thing in trying to research the case law in addition to the statutes. It is amazing what kinds of suprises the case law can hold.

However, the definition you posted would cover any knife, including a pocket knife with a 1 inch blade. There has to be more to it.

Did you try Shepardizing the case?
 
Shepardizing is checking to see if other cases have cited the case you intend to rely on. It is done so that you know the case wasn't overruled, superceded by statute, etc.

When I read a case, I generally don't like out-of-context quotes. The case really doesn't do me any good unless I know the facts, issues, holding, and rationale. Then I can see what influenced the court, and how the court might view a similar, but slightly different, set of facts.
 
I was hoping for some input from others here in Virginia, but I guess I'll jump in. Please keep in mind that I'm not an LEO or an attorney, only a government bureaucrat with some experience at reading and interpreting case law.

In my opinion, the answer is a definite "maybe." It appears that the crucial factor is whether the Court considers the knife to be a weapon. In Ricks (Jimmy) v. Commonwealth of VA, No. 0929-97-2, June 2, 1998, the Appeals Court held that an ordinary steak knife was not a "weapon of like kind" and therefore not an illegal concealed weapon. On the other hand, there are also a couple of cases where the Appeals Court held that a balisong was a "weapon of like kind" and not an ordinary pocket knife.

You might want to keep in mind that, if you use the knife as a weapon, you may well have proved the prosecution's case. Also, in order for Jimmy Ricks to have his conviction overturned by the Appeals Court, he had to get convicted in the first place. You don't want to go there.

If you're absolutely determined to carry a fixed blade, one option might be to get something with a sheepsfoot blade. No point on it, so it can't be used for stabbing, and can't be considered a dirk, bowie, or weapon of like kind. You can still do some real damage, though.

Personally, I'd recommend sticking with the combination of a decent folder and the smarts to walk/run away from trouble instead of letting your ego and testosterone get the better of you.
 
Originally posted by dsvirsky
If you're absolutely determined to carry a fixed blade, one option might be to get something with a sheepsfoot blade. No point on it, so it can't be used for stabbing, and can't be considered a dirk, bowie, or weapon of like kind. You can still do some real damage, though.

Click to expand...

I carry a Jens Anso Personal Sheepsfoot. It's a fixed blade with a 1.75" edge. It's small enough that I can carry it in it's sheath in my pocket if I wish. I have it in my pocket as we speak. Other times, I carry it on my belt. It's my most common EDC in Va. It's legality hasn't been questioned though. I certainly wouldn't look to me as an example of what's permissible.

Chris
 
Thanks for all your advice. Sounds like it's more trouble than it's worth. It's not a matter of ego or testosterone, and I avoid "problem areas" well, just don't want to be defenseless if I need it. Sounds like I'll be sticking to my S&W SWAT for EDC.
 
I believe the following to be the most up-to-date definitions of the various types of knives prohibited in VA.

Dirk: stabbing weapon having two sharp edges and a point, including daggers, short swords, and stilettos. O'Banion v. Commonwealth of Virginia, 531 S.E.2d 599, 604 n. 2 (Va. Ct. App. 2000)(citing Richards v. Commonwealth, 443 S.E.2d 177, 179 n. 2 (Va. 1994))

Bowie knife: large hunting knife adapted especially for knife-fighting . . . having a guarded handle and a strong, single-edge blade typically 10-15 inches long with its back straight for most of its length and then curving concavely and sometimes in a sharpened edge to the point. O'Banion v. Commonwealth of Virginia, 531 S.E.2d 599, 604 n. 2 (Va. Ct. App. 2000)(citing Wood v. Henry County Public Schools, 255 495 S.E.2d 255, 261 n. 6 (Va. 1998)).

Switchblade knife: pocketknife having a spring-operated blade, so that pressure on a release latch causes the blade to fly open. O'Banion v. Commonwealth of Virginia, 531 S.E.2d 599, 604 n. 2 (Va. Ct. App. 2000)(citing Wood v. Henry County Public Schools, 255 495 S.E.2d 255, 261 n. 6 (Va. 1998)).

Ballistic Knife: Any knife with a detachable blade that is propelled by a spring-operated mechanism. O'Banion v. Commonwealth of Virginia, 531 S.E.2d 599, 604 n. 2 (Va. Ct. App. 2000)(citing Va. Code Ann. sec. 18.2-308).

I leave it to the reader to apply these definitions to any knife they wish to carry, with advice to confirm any decisions to carry a knife with an attorney admitted to practice in VA.
 
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