New car / automobile buying & leasing tips for CPK'ers

Casinostocks said:
That model is a factory set up which was only limited to the Tacoma Trail Edition (basically a glorified SR5). The bronze accents including the TRD Pro type of wheels and the TOYOTA heritage grille. Sadly the color Army Green has been discontinued in the 2023 Trail Editions but not quite sure about the other models such as TRD Off-Road and the TRD Sport.

If anyone is considering a souped-up Tacoma, this is what I would do now: get a long-bed SR5 4WD (alas the Trail only came in short-bed) at the $38K+ and then have the dealer to the legit Toyota upgrade kit for the $2.5K which they charge (kinda like the Pro shocks lifting the front by 2" and the rear by 1.1"). None of the expensive aftermarket stuff with the exception of your own choice of wheels and beefier off-road tires such as the KO2s. I got what I got because I wanted the locking rear diff which the regular SR5 doesn't offer in addition to the standard 4WD. For that reason, I was limited to the 1" front end lift and the .5" back lift by factory, also losing 1 foot in bed length (SB only!). What I have is "off road lite" because I don't care for the fancy features such as Crawl and all the other electronic assistances that the fancier TRD Pro and TRD Off-Road versions can offer. A Southern Cali mall-hauler doesn't need any of those other fanciful schticks! 🤣
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Been toying with the idea of getting those wheels for mine. Found a dealership close-ish that I could get them for a couple hundred less (shipped) than the dealer I got my truck from.
 
I would appreciate some advice from this knowledgeable crowd since I buy a car once every 15 years or so, whether I need it or not. Unfortunately I can’t justify a truck in the burbs. I’ve got 263K miles on my 2005 Honda Accord Hybrid and would love to buy another one with gas on the rise and all. I’ve read that the 2021 model fixed some growling that was in the 18-20 models so was focusing on that. I’m looking for the Touring trim with all the goodies.

I don’t mind a higher mileage used car since I keep my cars a while and I didn’t have to put a penny into my old one until the last couple of years. But I was wondering if a new 2023 can be had for close to a used 2021 or 2022 given that 2024s are showing up on the lots now. In other words, are 2023 Accord Hybrids being discounted at all these days or will I be laughed out the door if I offer $35K vs the $39,440 sticker price??

I also need (want) a white or light grey interior since black depresses me and makes the cabin too hot in the summers. Will that requirement degrade my negotiating position? Thanks in advance!
 
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It would help me more to do some digging into this if I know where you are and what radius you are willing to shop? For the same exact reason that you stated (gas prices on the rise) you will most likely (politely or impolitely) be shown the door if low-balling the auto dealer on his ~ 40K window price, but then again, not impossible just highly improbable depending on the current MMR range of that 2023 Accord Hybrid. Can you get me the VIN on that Accord?

P.S. I suggest that you consider buying the basic ($10 membership?) and message me if you'd like. I can try to help you out some more through DM.
 
I have been away from BF for a while (sacrilege, I know) and let my gold membership lapse (more sacrilege) but renewed it just now. Thanks for the reminder. I’ll try to message you later.

When I search for used cars on cars.com I use a 150 or 200 mile radius from Framingham MA. Not sure it would be wise to go that far for a new car since a big advantage of a new car is the relationship with the dealer during the initial years. Or is that worthless these days?

I don’t have a VIN since I’m assuming that if I go the new car route any dealership close to my house will be able the bring in a specific car that meets my requirements from another dealership. Are things so cutthroat now that they won’t do that?

I’m considering any Accord Hybrid Touring with white or light grey interior, red or silver exterior. I could try to get a VIN as an example for you if that helps you help me.

I guess I’m really asking what price I can reasonably push for on that new car and how to go about getting that price. Are MMR reports useful for new cars, too?

Thanks very much!
 
wayone said:
I have been away from BF for a while (sacrilege, I know) and let my gold membership lapse (more sacrilege) but renewed it just now. Thanks for the reminder. I’ll try to message you later.

When I search for used cars on cars.com I use a 150 or 200 mile radius from Framingham MA. Not sure it would be wise to go that far for a new car since a big advantage of a new car is the relationship with the dealer during the initial years. Or is that worthless these days?

I don’t have a VIN since I’m assuming that if I go the new car route any dealership close to my house will be able the bring in a specific car that meets my requirements from another dealership. Are things so cutthroat now that they won’t do that?

I’m considering any Accord Hybrid Touring with white or light grey interior, red or silver exterior. I could try to get a VIN as an example for you if that helps you help me.

I guess I’m really asking what price I can reasonably push for on that new car and how to go about getting that price. Are MMR reports useful for new cars, too?

Thanks very much!
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MMR is a great snapshot to use for used cars, not new. The MMR is used more religiously these days than Kelly Blue Book, NADA (or whatever their new name is since they got bought out) Black Book, etc. For new cars, I suggest that you dig around the forums on the site LeaseHacker (not necessarily for leases) but beware that just like any sites it takes a bit of time and effort to navigate around the forums in there. We can discuss things a bit more through PM so not to clog up Nathan's sub with outside leads and such.
 
PSA for the fans of Toyota trucks and SUVs: Tacos, 4Runners and the new Tundra (meh, not a big fan of these right now taking a wait and see posture on the new V6 twin turbo / hybrid engines). I am starting to see some deep discounts as compared to the lofty and heady prices and ridiculous markups during and early post Covid era. I am seeing ~4K ~ 5K off their MSRP (through brokers who birddog bargain hunters for dealerships' older must-sell units). I expect this trend to continue as the higher interest rates are biting and people are not in the mood to spend on want vs need items. If you are a believer in the proven naturally aspirated V6 Toyota engines vs the new trend of the turdos / hybrids and don't mind the old antiquated stodgy styling and also believe that the current Gen 5 4Runner and the current Gen 3 Tacos will retain a great deal of their value in the future, this is about good time to start getting serious.

The above was the good, now the bad/ugly part:

- You may have to travel or arrange for transportation (will cost you some $) if you are from smaller states where you ca not get these deals
- You will have to work with a broker and pay the brokerage fees upon signing the paperwork (it's off the books, nothing to do with the selling dealer and based on honor system. Yes, the broker does at times get stiffed, C'est la Vie!)
- If you are financing, the current rates are awful! For instance, TFS (Toyota Financial Services) rates for 60 mo for 4Runners is at 7.15% and Tacos are at 4.99% for premier credit (FICO score > 720ish). Banks and CU rates are not much better these days.
- New taco models are coming out in 2024 and new 4Runner in 2025 meaning that there will be a glut of used trade-ins so the used car market will be probably be swamped with trade-ins by those who throw their $ at wanting the latest and the greatest!
- Although Toyota has always been quite conservative and doesn't price gouge, their MSRP and new vehicle delivery fee$ have escalated recently meaning that even MSRP less ~ 5K comes to about what you would've paid a few years ago on these even if you were the worst negotiator!

Caveat emptor: don't shoot the messenger. As stated on top, this is just a PSA!
 
Casinostocks said:
PSA for the fans of Toyota trucks and SUVs: Tacos, 4Runners and the new Tundra (meh, not a big fan of these right now taking a wait and see posture on the new V6 twin turbo / hybrid engines). I am starting to see some deep discounts as compared to the lofty and heady prices and ridiculous markups during and early post Covid era. I am seeing ~4K ~ 5K off their MSRP (through brokers who birddog bargain hunters for dealerships' older must-sell units). I expect this trend to continue as the higher interest rates are biting and people are not in the mood to spend on want vs need items. If you are a believer in the proven naturally aspirated V6 Toyota engines vs the new trend of the turdos / hybrids and don't mind the old antiquated stodgy styling and also believe that the current Gen 5 4Runner and the current Gen 3 Tacos will retain a great deal of their value in the future, this is about good time to start getting serious.

The above was the good, now the bad/ugly part:

- You may have to travel or arrange for transportation (will cost you some $) if you are from smaller states where you ca not get these deals
- You will have to work with a broker and pay the brokerage fees upon signing the paperwork (it's off the books, nothing to do with the selling dealer and based on honor system. Yes, the broker does at times get stiffed, C'est la Vie!)
- If you are financing, the current rates are awful! For instance, TFS (Toyota Financial Services) rates for 60 mo for 4Runners is at 7.15% and Tacos are at 4.99% for premier credit (FICO score > 720ish). Banks and CU rates are not much better these days.
- New taco models are coming out in 2024 and new 4Runner in 2025 meaning that there will be a glut of used trade-ins so the used car market will be probably be swamped with trade-ins by those who throw their $ at wanting the latest and the greatest!
- Although Toyota has always been quite conservative and doesn't price gouge, their MSRP and new vehicle delivery fee$ have escalated recently meaning that even MSRP less ~ 5K comes to about what you would've paid a few years ago on these even if you were the worst negotiator!

Caveat emptor: don't shoot the messenger. As stated on top, this is just a PSA!
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I have to agree about the naturally aspirated V6 from Toyota. I have a 1995 T100 with the 3.4L V6. This is my daily driver, commuter, camping rig, hauler, my only vehicle Lol. I keep up on any minor maintenance and this truck is always there for me. I can perform any maintenance myself for cheap. I might upgrade someday to a gen3 Taco, or gen5 4Runner. I plan to stay away from the turbo4, turbo6, and hybrid models that are coming out. I just don’t see those models lasting 30 yrs like the old T100.
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AR-Trvlr said:
Any advice on either a CR-V Hybrid or Rav4 Hybrid purchased new? My 2015 GTI has shit the bed so I'm going to fix it and trade it in on a small SUV. We're a fan of both Toyota and Honda reliability. Mazda would work, too, but the Mazda dealership in our area has closed.
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My wife has the 2024 CRV hybrid, 6000 miles so far and not a single issues. Average is 40+ mpg and a nice and roomy interior and comfortable ride. Only thing is the electric motor on idle is so quiet, I can’t tell if the car is on or off. I recommend it.
 
coolbreezy37 said:
My wife has the 2024 CRV hybrid, 6000 miles so far and not a single issues. Average is 40+ mpg and a nice and roomy interior and comfortable ride. Only thing is the electric motor on idle is so quiet, I can’t tell if the car is on or off. I recommend it.
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I’m torn between a hybrid or ‘normal’ version. The extra cost for the hybrid drivetrain should pay for itself in 3-5 years, but does the additional complexity (and long term maintenance costs) of having both the gas and electrical systems outweigh the savings?
 
AR-Trvlr said:
I’m torn between a hybrid or ‘normal’ version. The extra cost for the hybrid drivetrain should pay for itself in 3-5 years, but does the additional complexity (and long term maintenance costs) of having both the gas and electrical systems outweigh the savings?
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FWIW and always take with a grain of salt:

https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/honda/cr-v-hybrid/2023

"...However, I did have a problem with the hybrid crossover. If you’re driving in the city, you’ll enjoy the maximum fuel-economy benefit of the hybrid powertrain. Get it out on the highway though, and the gas mileage I experienced was, well, terrible. It was no better than you’d see from a non-hybrid SUV and a far cry from the results its archrival, the Toyota RAV4 Hybrid, delivers.

The CR-V Hybrid also carries a significantly higher price tag than the Kia Sportage Hybrid or the Hyundai Tucson Hybrid, though it doesn’t offer comparable warranty coverage..."

Personal opinion: if your $ stretches, go for Toyota, then Honda in that order before considering either Hyundai or KIA not matter the "experts'" rankings. You will get better deals on the gas models, the last I looked they seem to be a couple of thousands or perhaps better, off the MSRP on the gas models. but as always YMMV (no pun).
 
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