NIB? What does that mean?

[MTguy]

I would say if you took the knife out of the box to inspect it but you did not break any seals at all to do so then it would be classed as NIB. But if you had to break any seals to look at the knife then imo it would now be LNIB or CIB.

 

[Kaizen1]

Oh and to address the OP, I'd say that if you provided a detailed description on what you did or didn't do with the knife (eg "I only opened the box to inspect for defects. I opened it 2 or 3 times. Didn't cut anything."), that would probably be better than any of the common terms used (LNIB, NIB). You may even say afterward something like "And that's why I'm calling this 'NIB.'" That makes sure everything is open and the potential buyers can interpret that however they like without feeling like the item was misrepresented. They may no agree with your label, but they won't feel cheated because of the elaboration.

 

[hardheart]

The ability to return an item really hammers on some of these definitions. A product can go from new, to like new/pre-owned/used, back to new, depending only on what shelf it is sitting on at the time.

And for some manufacturers and some sellers, the warranty issue doesn't apply in the distinction since you won't/can't get any outside assistance and must deal direct if possible.

 

[drifts1]

Unless it comes in a sealed package there is no way to tell for sure if a knife has ever been simply handled so that is a moot point to consider.

I will set my definition of NIB in regards to knives bought from an individual as; 1) It was sold to me as NIB in an unsealed package as it came from the factory with all original paperwork and I cannot tell that is has been used or handled. 2) It is still in its sealed package.

If I buy from a dealer, I either bought a knife sold as new or bought one sold as used,display,damaged. ect... Conditional of knife could vary wether it was bought as new or other, which is why I look before i buy and if ordered online I'm taking a chance but expect new condtion if i bought new.

my .02

 

[FLymon]

What if it's not a dealer? We're talking about the exchange here, right? So what if you buy from me a knife that I say is NIB and I've never opened/inspected/etc. it?

I would not buy from you in that condition. You would have to show it to me or make the claim that it is free from defect, and/or answer my questions about lockup, centering etc.. If you wanted to sell it "sealed" I would move on assuming it is something I could buy new from a dealer for close to the same money.

 

[MTguy]

I will set my definition of NIB in regards to knives bought from an individual as; 1) It was sold to me as NIB in an unsealed package as it came from the factory with all original paperwork and I cannot tell that is has been used or handled. 2) It is still in its sealed package.

+1 this is basically where I stand.

 

[THG]

I would not buy from you in that condition. You would have to show it to me or make the claim that it is free from defect, and/or answer my questions about lockup, centering etc.. If you wanted to sell it "sealed" I would move on assuming it is something I could buy new from a dealer for close to the same money.

So basically, you wouldn't buy "NIB" from anyone here, according to your definition of NIB. That's all I wanted to know.

 

[Fascion]

If this thread has shown me anything, it's that the power is truly in the hands of the buyer.
As a buyer, if usage, package condition, storage method or boogerfingers are at all a concern, you should be asking questions before pulling the trigger.

 

[Klingsteve]

Maybe it's just best to avoid any letters altogether, as it seems we have different interpretations of what NIB and LNIB mean. Perhaps we should just describe the circumstances and condition of the knife.

For example, a knife I wanted to sell or trade could be described as: I bought the knife as it's original owner, I never carried / sharpened / cut anything with it. I only open and closed it a few times, inspected for defects and there are none, I looked at it and admired it, and put it back in the box. It has all the paperwork and accompanyments. It was "never used as a knife" in any way as a knife is typically used.

Then the buyer can decide if he wants the knife based on his / her interpretation of what NIB or LNIB means to them.

Aw crap. Maybe NIB means it was never touched by human hands, and LNIB if it was. That way we can account for boogers.

And don't go there by saying what if my pet Monkey played with it before I sold it.

This thread could go on forever. Me, if I see NIB or LNIB, I'm going to trust the good people on this forum and think that it is like buying it from the store for the first time, unless there are some caveats in a description of the thing, which I hope we would all add as a courtesy to the buyer and to protect our reputations, which is all we have here that really matters.

Just my .04 cents.

--Steve

 

[BP Green]

Maybe it's just best to avoid any letters altogether, as it seems we have different interpretations of what NIB and LNIB mean. Perhaps we should just describe the circumstances and condition of the knife.

For example, a knife I wanted to sell or trade could be described as: I bought the knife as it's original owner, I never carried / sharpened / cut anything with it. I only open and closed it a few times, inspected for defects and there are none, I looked at it and admired it, and put it back in the box. It has all the paperwork and accompanyments. It was "never used as a knife" in any way as a knife is typically used.

Then the buyer can decide if he wants the knife based on his / her interpretation of what NIB or LNIB means to them.

Aw crap. Maybe NIB means it was never touched by human hands, and LNIB if it was. That way we can account for boogers.

And don't go there by saying what if my pet Monkey played with it before I sold it.

This thread could go on forever. Me, if I see NIB or LNIB, I'm going to trust the good people on this forum and think that it is like buying it from the store for the first time, unless there are some caveats in a description of the thing, which I hope we would all add as a courtesy to the buyer and to protect our reputations, which is all we have here that really matters.

Just my .04 cents.

--Steve

The most sensible post I've read in this whole thread. . . :thumbup:

 

[FLymon]

So basically, you wouldn't buy "NIB" from anyone here, according to your definition of NIB. That's all I wanted to know.

Before you define what I think is NIB for me, This was me in post #42

IMHO the real difference between NIB and LNIB is ownership. If I am a knife dealer who buys knives explicitly for the purpose of resale, and the knives I buy (to the best of my knowledge) have never been purchased by an end user then they are NIB. Once john Q. Public buys a knife it is no longer, and never will be new again. Weather it ever gets used is another issue.

I accept that other end users will sell a knife they own as NIB, and that really does not bother me as long it really is LNIB.

Nothing in my response to your scenario changes my previously stated position.

Let me ask you this. If I did buy from you with the understanding that your knife was as it left the manufacturer, sealed, and unseen by anyone. Would you accept a return if I opened it and found it to be defective?
If not, and I am talking about a knife currently in production and available elsewhere, why would I buy it from you under those conditions?
Price, that's why. If it were 50% lower than the best price I could get from a reputable dealer, I might take a chance.
And yes, I know you don't need the dealer to work with a manufacturer about defects in the knife world, but I prefer to deal with retailers/distributors, since I are one myself .

 

[link2derek]

As a seller/trader, I find that the best policy is to under-promise and over-deliver!

 

[ono724]

The only reason I read this whole thread was to see what else Powernoodle would write about "booger fingers". I about spit up my coffee. Let me take a wild guess that you have about half a dozen Purell dispensers scattered around your house, huh? AND I'm going to steal the term "dispositive" if you don't mind as well.

Thomas is dead on with the NIB thing. If a manufacturer doesn't routinely and uniformly check every unit that goes out the door, they are not going to be operating in the top of this field. Period. For example, every Sebenza that rolls out of CRK's has been hard flicked, handled and tweaked a few times before it ever leaves the shop. Are none of them NIB?

QC/QA is part of the manufacturing process. It's coming from the manufacturer NIB. I would think we all expect our knives to be thoroughly tested before buying them NIB.

On the other hand, buying a new knife from booger fingers, ehh, maybe LNIB? Or at least come with the warning "decontaminate prior to use"

 

[THG]

Before you define what I think is NIB for me, This was me in post #42

Well yeah, that's what I was saying. According to your definition of NIB, you wouldn't buy from anyone here who said that his or her knife is NIB.

Let me ask you this. If I did buy from you with the understanding that your knife was as it left the manufacturer, sealed, and unseen by anyone. Would you accept a return if I opened it and found it to be defective?

If I weren't allowed to look at the knife because everyone would say it's not NIB otherwise, then no, because that's everyone else's choice by their decision of defining NIB as "never touched by human hands except at the factory." (Of course, those terms would have to be stated before the sale.) Everybody would be imposing a guessing game by that definition, so the individual seller would not be able to guarantee the condition. In fact, all sales by individuals would probably halt.

I should be able to protect myself from selling a defective product by looking at it, first. If you don't allow me to, then that's on you. I guess that's what I'm trying to say, here.

If not, and I am talking about a knife currently in production and available elsewhere, why would I buy it from you under those conditions?
Price, that's why. If it were 50% lower than the best price I could get from a reputable dealer, I might take a chance.

In most cases, to save on shipping, but if 50% is your limit, then I can't argue with that.

But keep in mind that if everyone used your definition of NIB, then there would not be any new knives for sale here on the forum. Maybe that's what you want, and all we're doing here is arguing definitions - fine. Either way, when I sell a "NIB" knife, I am definitely going to say "NIB - handled for photos" or "opened and closed" if applicable. Of course, that'll be my definition of NIB, but you'll know exactly what it means. I'm sure that you do likewise for your sales.

 

[hardheart]

I don't think you have to state the obvious. If there are pictures of the knife, then it was taken out of the box and handled for photos. Just exactly like the knives on the dealer websites that were photographed and then sold as new along with the rest of the inventory.

 

[Maniacal Pete]

I've been offered knives that were "LNIB, but no box."

pete

 

[TX Archer]

If you don't mind the newbie throwing in his two cents...

Maybe it's just best to avoid any letters altogether, as it seems we have different interpretations of what NIB and LNIB mean. Perhaps we should just describe the circumstances and condition of the knife.

I was thinking this while reading all the way through the thread and someone on page 4 finally said it. Acronyms and abbreviations can't be as descriptive as... well, descriptions. And I think it's in the seller's interest to give as much info as he can in a case such as is being described here.

And for a personal anecdote, I purchased one of the Benchmade Cabela's D2 Mini-Grips two years ago this month. I (admittedly stupidly) made my decision based on the display knife and accepted one in a box without examining it. Upon opening the box when I got home, I found out the box was labeled as D2 but the knife inside was 154CM. How this happened was never discovered and is irrelevant for this discussion. BUT, if I had stored it away without opening it and later sold it under the strictest definition for NIB, the blame would have been put on me. I just think it's prudent to open any knife not in a blister pack, handle it (hopefully without booger fingers), and just be descriptive up front in any sale situation.

Thanks for indulging the new guy.

 

[toxicchill]

NIB to me says New (unused) In Box (original box)
this has no statement on the condition of the box.

New In Opened Box to me is what most people are referring to when they say NIB.
a new (unused item) in a box (original box) but it has been opened and inspected.

Mint in Box
this to me is a New (unused) in an unopened package (although the box may have wear and tear)

 

[FLymon]

Well yeah, that's what I was saying. According to your definition of NIB, you wouldn't buy from anyone here who said that his or her knife is NIB.



If I weren't allowed to look at the knife because everyone would say it's not NIB otherwise, then no, because that's everyone else's choice by their decision of defining NIB as "never touched by human hands except at the factory." (Of course, those terms would have to be stated before the sale.) Everybody would be imposing a guessing game by that definition, so the individual seller would not be able to guarantee the condition. In fact, all sales by individuals would probably halt.

I should be able to protect myself from selling a defective product by looking at it, first. If you don't allow me to, then that's on you. I guess that's what I'm trying to say, here.



In most cases, to save on shipping, but if 50% is your limit, then I can't argue with that.

But keep in mind that if everyone used your definition of NIB, then there would not be any new knives for sale here on the forum. Maybe that's what you want, and all we're doing here is arguing definitions - fine. Either way, when I sell a "NIB" knife, I am definitely going to say "NIB - handled for photos" or "opened and closed" if applicable. Of course, that'll be my definition of NIB, but you'll know exactly what it means. I'm sure that you do likewise for your sales.

I am too confused to continue this. Maybe this will clear up my position on the original question.

As I have stated, I don't have a problem with people listing items as NIB because I believe good men can disagree on this point. You don't have to be wrong for me to be right, and vice versa. MrPres can go either way, and as long as he is trying to do the right thing, it will be the right thing.

Having been in the exact position as MrPres I sold my knife as LNIB, not NIB, because I believe that the knife was not new once I bought it.

And just to be clear, when I do see a knife being sold NIB I don't expect it to imply that the knife has never been touched. That is something YOU are trying to ascribe to me without merit.

 

[LMT66]

IMHO the real difference between NIB and LNIB is ownership. If I am a knife dealer who buys knives explicitly for the purpose of resale, and the knives I buy (to the best of my knowledge) have never been purchased by an end user then they are NIB. Once john Q. Public buys a knife it is no longer, and never will be new again. Weather it ever gets used is another issue.

I accept that other end users will sell a knife they own as NIB, and that really does not bother me as long it really is LNIB.

I agree.