Older Japanese Tanto Question

I have been fortunate enough to receive a very nice tanto in shira-saya from friend and knifemaker Sava Damlovac.

View


The yokote doesn't show up in pic well, but it's there, as is a very nice hamon. Two piece habaki. Bamboo mekugi. The tang is not signed.

Sava estimates the piece to be from somewhere between the 17th and 19th centuries.

OAL is 15.5" (16.75" in scabbard).

I'm new to these blades though I've long admired them.

Any and all info gratefully received.

The info is for my knowledge only. I have no interest in selling this piece.

Thanks,

Blues

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Live Free or Die

Blues' Knife Pix



[This message has been edited by Blues (edited 08-17-2000).]
 
Blues: Exactly what type of info are you looking for? Kinda difficult to help if I don't know what ya need help with.

Shinryû.
 
Robert,

Ignorant as I am, any information at all would be helpful.

For example, I'd like to know about this style of blade, if it is of a certain type that was from any particular period.

If it is of a certain region.

What steel may have been commonly used in its manufacture.

Assume you're talking to someone with no background in these blades and you'll be essentially right.
wink.gif


I'm fascinated by the knife and how well it's been kept. Anything that puts me more in touch with it is gratefully appreciated.

Thanks,

Blues

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Live Free or Die

Blues' Knife Pix
 
Blues:

I'm going to send you an email with some basic information and inquiries to help me help ya out. Since I don't have it in front of me, there's not all that much I can help ya with, but I'll see what I can do.

Shinryû.
 
Blues,

How long is the cutting edge? How much is the curvature? How much is the width as the habaki region and how wide is it at the yokote? Approximately how thick is it at the habaki region? How is the shape of the back? Is it Maru(rounded), Iori(ridge), Mitsu(ridge but flat) or Kaku(flat)? How is the file mark on the tang? Horizontal? sloped to one side? I can't see them in your pics as the resolution is not high enough.

When we appraise a sword, always look at the sugata (size and shape) first. Then the forging (Jitesu) then the last is look at the hammon.

From the pic, I would guess that it is a Shinogi-zukuri, but it can be a Shobu. The point is, wash your hand thoroughly and then dry them thoroughly. Remove the oil from the blade and feel if the yokote is there. If you can feel it, It's Shinogi-Z but if you can't feel it, then it is Shobu-Z. Remember to clean and oil the blade immediately after that.

After we have all the informations about its sugata, we can proceed to look at the forging.

Hope this would help and not too confusing

Joe
 
Given its size and the way the temper line goes into the point, My guess is that this blade started out life as a waikazashi(Short Sword.) I am not an expert, but I've seen alot of them. Perhaps an expert out ther would care to comment?

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The thorn stands to defend the Rose, yet it is peaceful and does not seek conflict
 
Joe,

Here are at least partial answers to some of your questions:

1. From the kissaki to the habaki, measuring along the mune is 9.75".

2. The width of the blade at the habaki is approximately 7/8"

3. Th width of the blade at the yokote is about 11/16".

4. The width across the mune, which is of the ihori style is about 3/16".

5. The tip of the tang is haagari.

6. The yokote is more "seen" than "felt". In other words, I can see a "line" but do not really feel any ridge there. I can feel only the transition in the width as it goes down toward the kissaki. It is very smooth.

I have not disassembled it again to try to see if I could discern the direction of the file marks on the nakago. I don't remember them standing out on looking at the tang yesterday.

I appreciate the interest and the help.

Blues

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Live Free or Die

Blues' Knife Pix
 
Blues,

First, there are no tanto in the form of shinogi-zukuri that I know of. I searched through the "connoiseur's book...." and there aren't any shinogi-zukuri tanto. They'll make it as hira-zukuri or Shobu.

This tanto most probably started it's life as a wakizashi as the width at the motohaba and sakihaba is that of a Waki or tanto and yet we see the hammon. So most probably it is suriaged from either a shinogi-z or a shobu-z wakizashi.

Then I look at the boshi, it's quite white, hazy. Do you see hammon on the boshi? If it is a suriaged Waki of shinogi-z then you should feel the yokote. If it is suriaged from a shobu-z then it will have more curve. The tang is too original to me. So the point is whether you see any hammon underneath the haze at the boshi.

I can't see clearly on the ji( as the pic is not at a high enough resolution). But the trend is, the more refine is the forging at time goes on. So you'll see more very fine itame in later time of shinto and shinshinto. And more morkume or mesame in koto blades. Of course it is just a general trend and there are outstanding smiths who can make much better stuff than his time.

It's always good to have a shot of the whole blade, without the habaki. And a real close-up shot of the tang, showing file marks, if there are any.

Joe

[This message has been edited by JoeL (edited 08-19-2000).]
 
Joe,

So far, I am having a difficult time picking up the hamon under the "haze" at the boshi.

I don't know if it is my own relative lack of experience (so that I am not recognizing something)or something else coming into play.

The rest of the blade seems to feature choji-gunome as well as other hamon patterns.

Also, last night I went back to the "yokote". I can barely feel the "line", there is something there, but it is not nearly as distinct as, say, the shinogi would feel.

Blues

[This message has been edited by Blues (edited 08-19-2000).]
 
Blues,

A real yokote is slightly raised, so it cannot be added on later. In this case, it is either a shobu-zukuri wakizashi and the polisher put on cosmetic whitening to mimic a yokote.

Or, hmmm.....I really have to see the sword, hold it n my hands to confirm, but it can be a shinogi-zukuri waki that the tip has been broken and the polisher intentionally make that less obvious. From the thickness at the mune, it seems to be a shinogi-zukuri sword as a shobu with Iori-mune should be much thinner at the mune.

But don't take it as the reality, as I haven't seen the sword in person and maybe I am wrong.

Joe
 
Right or wrong, Joe, I thank you for your efforts and interest.

Regardless of "what" this blade may ultimately be, it is an honored piece in my collection, both because of the sense of history and beauty it conveys as well as the manner in which it was acquired.

Last night as I examined it I was amazed at how when studying the hamon it was as if I could look deep "into" the blade well beneath the surface. That sense of three dimensionality is truly fascinating and something I hadn't before observed.

Blues
 
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