Please recommend a decent folder in 440C

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VorpelSword said:
I think many Buck folders re in 440
C, but can't swer to that.

The clsssic Boy Scout pocket knives can be found in SS, which I assume to be 440C. Vintage BSA folders are offered at around $80 on e-Bay. The Boy Scout website store has the current one listed for $30. It looks just like the 1990s era knife and its brand new.

In premium non-folders, I think that al of Randall's fixed ballade stainless models are in 440C.
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For their standard line, Buck changed from 440C to 425M in the early 80s.
 
VorpelSword said:
My Gast it totally Flabbered!

What about Randall Made?
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Randall uses 440B steel at higher carbon content than the nominal amount, at 0.90-0.95% instead of around 0.8%, edging 440C's carbon content. It also has some other addictive in the alloy mix. With their make to orders and high price, it makes sense that they can get custom lot of steel. Case CV steel is a custom alloy as well, they changed it to 1095 a few years ago.

In other standards where 440C equivalents has more sub types, because the acceptable variance of carbon in 440C is quite large (from 0.95% to 1.20%), the makers usually take the lower carbon ones.
 
VorpelSword said:
I think many Buck folders re in 440
C, but can't swer to that.

The clsssic Boy Scout pocket knives can be found in SS, which I assume to be 440C. Vintage BSA folders are offered at around $80 on e-Bay. The Boy Scout website store has the current one listed for $30. It looks just like the 1990s era knife and its brand new.

In premium non-folders, I think that al of Randall's fixed ballade stainless models are in 440C.
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I've read older Queen knives that advertised "Queen steel" were 440C but don't have a clue on the truth.
 
Maximumbob54 said:
Is this a recent change? I've bought two different models and I would swear they were listed as 440A. And neither one holds an edge like I would expect so I was assuming it was soft 440A at that.
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To find out for sure, once and for all, I emailed Swiza about the blade steel used in their knives...and they confirmed it's not 440C :(

Here is the answer I received:

Hello Patrick,
Thank you for your message.
I inform you the steel used for the main blade is 1.4110 (also called X55CrMo14).
For any further request do not hesitate to contact us.
 
patrickguignot said:
To find out for sure, once and for all, I emailed Swiza about the blade steel used in their knives...and they confirmed it's not 440C :(

Here is the answer I received:

Hello Patrick,
Thank you for your message.
I inform you the steel used for the main blade is 1.4110 (also called X55CrMo14).
For any further request do not hesitate to contact us.
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Pretty wild how many listings are incorrect. I just looked at a few and they all said 440, 440HC, or 440C. I could believe 440A but what they emailed back I'm pretty sure is the same thing Victorinox uses.

Thank you for going straight to the source.
 
I have recommendation for folder. I don't have this knife (I have CS Talwar 4) but I had that steel. I had cryo 440c Recondo fixed. This steel is excellent. When knife is sharpened (Worksharp Onion on 20 degrees per side) feels like Fallkniven VG10. Really amazing. This is Sog Tellus. I'm sure that is very useful. Or Ontario Appache Tac1. I still crying for him :)
 
DocJD said:
Ganzo has a lot of supposed 440C folders , IDK about quality of steel or HT . 🤷‍♂️
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Though I am a diehard spyderco user, I did wade through some Ganzo firebird models
And ganzo 440c is pretty decent, I have no complaints about their HRC and edge retention,
I have a bunch of 1970’s Gerber 440c that is great stuff to !
For farm and ranch, hunting blade steel, Ganzo blows any 8crmov out of the water
I love their FRN scale delica clones in 440c
 
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Why limit yourself to 440C? Is it for ease of sharpening or something? Because there are so many better steels out now, they can be ground thinner, hold an edge better, tougher, just as corrosion resistant, or better, and easily as simple to sharpen, many much more so, than 440C.

Just my two cents.

If I was in the market for a new folder, it would be Hogue's new Mysto in Magnacut. The Richilite scaled model is less than 200 bucks.
 
whp said:
I m surprised this hasn't t been mentioned already. So may be this is wrong.

I ve seen mentioned on several websites that Aus10 is almost identical to 440c. And a definite step up from AUS8 which you liked. And it s available from Cold Steel, which historically has done a good job with their heat treatments.

One knife I m carrying more and more with Aus10 is the Airlite.. Well made. Sturdy, thin and light. Other Cold Steel options with AUS10 are available.
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knarfeng said:
AUS 10 is closer to VG10 and 154CM than it is to 440C
AUS10, VG10 and 154CM/ATS-34 are all a step up in edge retention from 440C.
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AUS-10 is just AUS-8 with more carbon. I've had knives in AUS-10 and it's okay. Really, I don't understand the appeal. The main benefit of AUS-8 (or the analogous 8Cr13Mov) besides affordability is decent toughness. Upping the carbon reduces that toughness a little. It also reduces corrosion resistance and AUS-8 is already mediocre in that department. What do you get for that trade? You get a little more edge retention but not really more than you can get from VG-10, N690, or 154CM.

154CM is generally best of the bunch there on edge retention and is at least similar to AUS-8 (or slightly better) on corrosion resistance. Some of the more reputable Chinese brands are using 154CM at the "budget" level now and giving it a reasonable heat treatment. Kizer is the best example and they've got tons of fun models in 154CM. If you need more corrosion resistance, N690 and VG-10 are good choices. VG-10 has a little extra toughness if you need it. (Note that 10Cr15CoMov is the Chinese analog of VG-10 and shows up in some of the Civivi and Sencut knives.) If you want very high toughness with good corrosion resistance, 14C28N is hard to beat and that's also showing up in lots of Chinese knives lately.

Speaking of Chinese knives and staying closer to 440C, 9Cr18Mov shouldn't be discounted. Sure, the carbon content is closer to 440B but in actual use, 9Cr18Mov with a good heat treatment on stuff like the Civivi and Sencut knives performs a lot like 440C I've had in the past. The chromium content is higher than 440B or 440C, giving it exceptional corrosion resistance too. If you love 440C, a Sencut in 9Cr18Mov could be right up your alley.
 
Chronovore said:
AUS-10 is just AUS-8 with more carbon. I've had knives in AUS-10 and it's okay. Really, I don't understand the appeal. The main benefit of AUS-8 (or the analogous 8Cr13Mov) besides affordability is decent toughness. Upping the carbon reduces that toughness a little. It also reduces corrosion resistance and AUS-8 is already mediocre in that department. What do you get for that trade? You get a little more edge retention but not really more than you can get from VG-10, N690, or 154CM.

154CM is generally best of the bunch there on edge retention and is at least similar to AUS-8 (or slightly better) on corrosion resistance. Some of the more reputable Chinese brands are using 154CM at the "budget" level now and giving it a reasonable heat treatment. Kizer is the best example and they've got tons of fun models in 154CM. If you need more corrosion resistance, N690 and VG-10 are good choices. VG-10 has a little extra toughness if you need it. (Note that 10Cr15CoMov is the Chinese analog of VG-10 and shows up in some of the Civivi and Sencut knives.) If you want very high toughness with good corrosion resistance, 14C28N is hard to beat and that's also showing up in lots of Chinese knives lately.

Speaking of Chinese knives and staying closer to 440C, 9Cr18Mov shouldn't be discounted. Sure, the carbon content is closer to 440B but in actual use, 9Cr18Mov with a good heat treatment on stuff like the Civivi and Sencut knives performs a lot like 440C I've had in the past. The chromium content is higher than 440B or 440C, giving it exceptional corrosion resistance too. If you love 440C, a Sencut in 9Cr18Mov could be right up your alley.
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The appeal of AUS10 over AUS8 is that the increased carbon in AUS10 results in a steel containing chunks of chromium carbide. This gives AUS10 better wear resistance than AUS8.

If hardened to the same hardness AUS 10 and 154CM will very similar levels of edge retention. IMO, Cold Steel leaves their AUS 10 a bit on the soft side, judging by the way it reacts to my sharpening stones. So Cold Steel AUS 10 might be expected to have a bit lower edge retention than somebody else's 154CM. I've not done any testing to verify edge retention of Cold Steel AUS 10, however. I have tested an AUS 10 blade from another company and it was quite similar to VG10, 154CM, and ATS 34.
 
I too was (and still am) a fan of 440c for what it is, so I get it, but it certainly does get harder and harder each year to find quality manufacturers using it with much regularity these days as more newer steels are added to the market each year claiming marked improvements here there and everywhere across the board.

That being said however, as a classic 440c fan myself, another steel that I did not see mentioned by anybody else here that the op M Maximumbob54 might enjoy and can still be found by certain top manufacturers, as I certainly did and do enjoy the blades I have that are made with it, is finding something made with Carpenter's CTS-XHP... originally branded as 440xh, it was based on the original the 440c with targeted improvements of it's own, and was even marketed as something akin to a higher hardness edge retaining 440c or a truly stainless D2... Great steel in my opinion when made by a quality manufacturer.

You can find a Spyderco Chaparrel LW w/ it currently on sale for just north of $100, or a Spartan Talos for a few bucks more, or if you prefer slightly larger blades, the Spartan Astor runs about $150
 
strategy9 said:
I too was (and still am) a fan of 440c for what it is, so I get it, but it certainly does get harder and harder each year to find quality manufacturers using it with much regularity these days as more newer steels are added to the market each year claiming marked improvements here there and everywhere across the board.

That being said however, as a classic 440c fan myself, another steel that I did not see mentioned by anybody else here that the op M Maximumbob54 might enjoy and can still be found by certain top manufacturers, as I certainly did and do enjoy the blades I have that are made with it, is finding something made with Carpenter's CTS-XHP... originally branded as 440xh, it was based on the original the 440c with targeted improvements of it's own, and was even marketed as something akin to a higher hardness edge retaining 440c or a truly stainless D2... Great steel in my opinion when made by a quality manufacturer.

You can find a Spyderco Chaparrel LW w/ it currently on sale for just north of $100, or a Spartan Talos for a few bucks more, or if you prefer slightly larger blades, the Spartan Astor runs about $150
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OP said he wanted to try actual, made to spec, 440C.

CTS-XHP is a PM steel and is pretty far beyond 440C in performance. You cannot get a feel for the performance of 440C from a blade made of XHP.

Maximumbob54 said:

Please recommend a decent folder in 440C​

Carried way too much "420 won't stay sharp steel" when I was younger. Moved to some AUS-6 and 8 and found it immediately better. Then I bought my first Spyderco Endura in VG10 and found it hard to go back. But I never had a good 440C pocketknife that I carried. So I'd like to find out what I missed out on. But it seems like the folder industry has moved on and the selection is pretty thin.

I did just buy a Boker Catalyst but that little thing has a THICK blade as in I have thinner fixed blades. Was going to try a SOG Tellus but found enough negative reviews that I'm passing that one by.

Recommendations?
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knarfeng said:
OP said he wanted to try actual, made to spec, 440C.

CTS-XHP is a PM steel and is pretty far beyond 440C in performance. You cannot get a feel for the performance of 440C from a blade made of XHP.
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I get all that, and I never said or implied that he would "get a feel" for 440c from xhp. I only stated pretty plainly, that with quality 440c being harder and harder to find (as compared to say even 5-10 years ago), that the op might
also enjoy xhp, particularly as it was originally specifically marketed as a new and improved version in the "440" lineage of steels. That's all.
 
As european - I find it outrageous how many N690 and other similar N6xx steels knives are being made here for crazy steep prices for the steel you're getting.

I'm also finding it strange that you want that.
 
If im reading everything right, op wants to try a decent folder in 440c because he didnt when the steel was widely used and he feels he missed out so he wants to see what it was all about, but as others stated it needs a stellar HT to be decent at all, there's too many other options and preferences for most makers at this point to bother with 440c so it is harder to find, but still possible if you look enough--- if you can, op, I'd say forego the desire and check out with N690, it's widely used and much better of an option over the two.
 
Maximumbob54 said:
Hit the button on a Maserin. Will use it for a while and report back. Thank you to everyone that gave options. Even if I didn't follow them it was still interesting seeing what's still available. I also noticed some what I feel like are wide variables in listed HRC for 440C. The model I chose says 59-60 which I hope is good.
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It seems Maximum has found one to try, so no need to sell him on a steel he never asked for.
 
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