Reporting Clones

Barrettboy

Barrettboy

Joined
Oct 20, 2016
Messages
201
Hey all. Just a thought here - after reading the latest "discussion" about the acceptability of clones (FYI, there is no acceptability, no wiggle room, nada, zip, not a poofteenth or a flies arse of space), I was wondering if it's worth us being a bit more organised and deliberate about dobbing in direct rip-offs and clones? Whenever I spot them on Ebay or AliExpress (the mother lode for cheap knock-offs) I report them as selling counterfeit goods. It's just a matter of hitting a "report" link in the middle of the listing. Maybe it's our civic duty to the hobby that, whenever we are on these sites or others like them, we take just a few minutes to see what we can see and hit that little report button.

What do you guys think?
 
Are we talking counterfeits or just matching patterns like the Griptillian vs the Hogue MK1?
 
kylemiller said:
Are we talking counterfeits or just matching patterns like the Griptillian vs the Hogue MK1?
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I think just counterfeits. There'd be too many blurred lines, too much potential to start fights and lose focus by include patterns and semi-homages. But then again, it's up to you when you're on these sites. If you personally think it should be reported, then report it. Include a link in the report that gets sent, and then it's up to the sites to action it or not.
 
Barrettboy said:
I think just counterfeits. There'd be too many blurred lines, too much potential to start fights and lose focus by include patterns and semi-homages. But then again, it's up to you when you're on these sites. If you personally think it should be reported, then report it. Include a link in the report that gets sent, and then it's up to the sites to action it or not.
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I did actually report a clone Marfione Custom UTX-85 beard comb I saw on ebay before reading your thread. I was doing my daily Socom Mini search and stumbled across it. First time I've ever reported a clone. Few minutes later I see this thread.

I think counterfeits are bad, but in a way they keep some companies honest. Anyone here who's tried a Green Thorn F95 knows that every other frame lock maker has some answering to do. Because what they can sell for $75 cannot be simply design costs making up the difference. You'd have a hard time find a better put together flipper for $300. I still don't mind spending big money on knives. I buy mostly Chris Reeve, Microtech and Strider and lords know that isn't cheap. But seeing that Green Thorn F95 really changed the way I look at value. I feel the companies I buy from actually earn the extra $400 in tangible value and not me just "supporting the cause".

Plus the pilpul one has to go through in this hobby when moving between modern folders and traditional when it comes to borrowed patterns makes for some full contact mental gymnastics. I think it's fun.
 
I tend to report them if I see them. Does anything happen as a result? Probably not. But at least I feel better for doing my "civic duty" as a knife fan.

I wish sites like Aliexpress would just vanish from google sites but I have no control over that.
 
gazz98 said:
I tend to report them if I see them. Does anything happen as a result? Probably not. But at least I feel better for doing my "civic duty" as a knife fan.

I wish sites like Aliexpress would just vanish from google sites but I have no control over that.
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Maybe I'm being too capitalist, but I like the competition. I spent time with high end clones, mostly to check out designs I'd end up buying in the future. Shirogorov has a few extra $K in their bank account thanks to my good experience with Green Thorn. Same for the resellers I was able to buy Striders from. Not casting judgement, it just is what it is. Coming away from that there are still knives in Made in USA, Russia or any number of other countries that I feel like are worth the extra money tangibly. Not just for the sake of supporting them. That's what I want to maintain. I don't want to buy knives out of charity, and I won't. I hope knife makers feel the same way. I want to buy the best product for the money and have found non clone or borrowed pattern brands that offer me that. But my time with clones did lower my perception of some other makers.

I think knife makers should have to answer a little bit for companies being able to offer a product that's 95% identical at 20% the price. There are a few out there. They cannot claim it's impossible because there are brands out there who simply cannot be cloned at such a price reduction.
 
kylemiller said:
Maybe I'm being too capitalist, but I like the competition. I spent time with high end clones, mostly to check out designs I'd end up buying in the future. Shirogorov has a few extra $K in their bank account thanks to my good experience with Green Thorn. Same for the resellers I was able to buy Striders from. Not casting judgement, it just is what it is. Coming away from that there are still knives in Made in USA, Russia or any number of other countries that I feel like are worth the extra money tangibly. Not just for the sake of supporting them. That's what I want to maintain. I don't want to buy knives out of charity, and I won't. I hope knife makers feel the same way. I want to buy the best product for the money and have found non clone or borrowed pattern brands that offer me that. But my time with clones did lower my perception of some other makers.

I think knife makers should have to answer a little bit for companies being able to offer a product that's 95% identical at 20% the price. There are a few out there. They cannot claim it's impossible because there are brands out there who simply cannot be cloned at such a price reduction.
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If you want to buy clones (high end or not) that is your right as a consumer. I don't support the making of clones or counterfeits (not just knives, anything) or the purchase of them. I've been on this forum for 11+ years and most folks on this forum are not supportive of clones/counterfeits.

Again, spend your money however you want.
 
The $40 Microtech clones you can get from AliExpress is lightyears ahead of the $40 Lightning OTF you can get from places like Grindworx. Move up to the $160ish range and you’re getting comparable quality to $400-500+ Microtechs. The production quality on the Vespa Ripper (not a clone, but made by a high-end cloner) is amazing, and their Microtech clones are supposedly just as good.

As for OP’s question: do it if it makes you feel good, but nothing is going to happen if you report a counterfeit on AliExpress. Maybe eBay will do something, but DHGate and Ali don’t care.
 
I report clones on the bay regularly after almost falling for one when i first got into this hobby. (ZT 0562). Luckily i didnt pay right away. after looking a little closer at the pics and the email replies from the seller were highly suspect as well. The red flags started going up so i requested to cancel and threatened to report which the seller obliged right after that. Luckily i havent been burned yet and nowadays i have handled enough knives to spot even well made clones from just pictures. The only clone i own is a ken fong 42 bali acquired in a package deal which i use to practice flipping. Otherwise i dont support clones nor does anyone on this site. Report away i say.
 
The holt clone is a new one, coming from the same that cloned the sham, while I despise clones and people making them, reporting them on aliexpress is almost worthless from experience, but on ebay it seems to do much more, if you start or know of something dedicated to reporting clones, count me in, also Reddit is a big market, just google sham clones, there’s a guy, one in particular who pushes them
 
Monofletch said:
Have you ever gotten a clone that was better than the real one?? I probably couldn’t spot one if I tried!!!
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I was pissed, but then realized the reason I didn't spot it as a counterfeit was it is a better made knife than the authentic version. It was a DHGate clone of a classic switchblade.
 
I think it's useless to report them since China doesn't care...

I don't support counterfreiting and I personally won't purchase such products, but also - I'd say that there's a chance that counterfreit Gerber might be better than original Gerber.

Lots of companies started to sell junk for high prices after they built their brand name...
 
Going after a retailer is fine but,
going after a buyer is very uncool in my book. Unfortunately it seems to happen way to often here on the forums.
 
Grandmaster said:
The holt clone is a new one, coming from the same that cloned the sham, while I despise clones and people making them, reporting them on aliexpress is almost worthless from experience, but on ebay it seems to do much more, if you start or know of something dedicated to reporting clones, count me in, also Reddit is a big market, just google sham clones, there’s a guy, one in particular who pushes them
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the ChineseKnives subreddit has a lot of clones and discussion of which ones are good and not so good.

The Specter clone makes me a little sad, because even though I’m willing to give the Holts $700+ for a knife, I’ll probably never get the chance to buy a new one. I’ll keep throwing my name into the lotteries, but if the reviews on the clones come back positive, I’ll probably get one to play with.
 
Here we go again , another thread with people trying to justify buying counterfeits , clones and knock offs. Father I didn't steal it, all I did was buy it . :eek:
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Clones are a cheap problem that will never go away as long as people are either too dumb and cheap to realize what they are buying fakes at an excessive price, or they like to brag to others about the steal they got on a good knife.
 
robgmn said:
China is not bound by US laws on counterfeiting. What benefit do you think will come of reporting to a Chinese company that another Chinese company is counterfeiting a product?
The US isn't the world's lawmaker.
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China has their own anti counterfeiting laws. They just don't enforce them until enough people die.
Cheap meds anyone?
 
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