Stabilized White Pine Scales?

E

EvilGemini

Joined
Apr 25, 2007
Messages
22
Hi folks,
I'm looking at making my brothers each a knife & was thinking on handle material.
We all grew up working a Christmas tree farm our grandparents had & the land is about to be sold. I was thinking of grabbing some of the pine, stabilizing it, then using it for handle scales.
I know that pine it a less than desirable handle material but wondered if stabilizing it might result in a decent material. My wood choice is purely for nostalgia & to carry a bit of our childhood with us. I'd appreciate all input & even alternative suggestions. Originally I thought about resin cast pinecones but thought that may be too industrious for a first project.
Thanks in advance,
-EG
 
I'm not sure how well pine wood would stabilize at home, even with a good vacuum setup. Do you have any pine wood with some figure in it? Otherwise it could be pretty plain. What might look good is to cut a couple of thin slabs and use for liners under black scales (micarta or African Blackwood).
 
Boxwood is hard and looks like pine

But I'd go the stabilised pine cone way.
You can buy them as scales don't need to make them
 
Ken H> said:
I'm not sure how well pine wood would stabilize at home, even with a good vacuum setup. Do you have any pine wood with some figure in it? Otherwise it could be pretty plain. What might look good is to cut a couple of thin slabs and use for liners under black scales (micarta or African Blackwood).
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Liners is a great idea! Thanks Ken!
 
Pinecone in resin looks pretty cool... https://www.knifemaking.com/category-s/1266.htm

Question about liners idea. Should you still be stabilizing the pine liner? I have one knife handle I did about 4 years ago out of buckeye burl that isn't stabilized. It's my everyday knife at work with me daily. I notice the way the wood swells on really wet days and everything doesn't quite match up at the pins and tang until it dries out. I figured I would use it this way until the day the handle breaks or comes lose and then I will redo it with stabilized wood. I didn't expect it to last this long. But I wonder how unstabilized might work sandwiched between materials that aren't going to swell.
I'm not an expert and there may be no concern. I'm interested in the answers of more experienced people.
 
I'm not sure I can be considered 'experienced' but here's my take: I would stabilize everything, including the liners. You're trying to make multiple pieces of the handle as close to a single piece of material as possible.
You are lucky the handle has lasted, especially if you can see the changes with swelling.
If you think about it, what you are seeing is movement of the materials in relation to each other and that usually leads to a failure of the adhesive. Which is why all outdoor adhesives that are going to be subjected to expansion and contraction have some silicone or other elastomer(?) built into them to allow for this motion.
 
I'd stay away from the pinecone deal if you are in wet conditions. I've had four kitchen knives where the pinecone is lifting out of the resin now that they are a few months old. I gotta re handle a set of three for a customer and the fourth one is ours. Its a beautiful material but I sure won't use it anymore.

Ours when the wife stole it out of some In Stock knives I made for Christmas:

GEjrZ8X.jpg


About six weeks later. This knife has never been in a sink of sudsy water or a dishwasher:

WMOQBvJ.jpg
 
In my mind I was thinking about stabilizing the pine liners. I really like the look of pinecones in resin (I've seen some really sexy pinecone 1911 grips) and I may grab some cones for a future project.
My brother's & I have a lot of memories about having to work the tree farm every weekend & over the Summers. Since the land is going to be sold off soon, I wanted to preserve some of those memories in working knives from trees we actually planted. SO while I do appreciate the suggestions of buying the materials it negates the purpose of the project. Too bad it wasn't a maple farm ;)
My original thought was to take some dirt from the property & mix it into resin for some part of the handle (like a bolster or something) but, assumed I'd just make a mess.
Thanks for all the input so far folks.
 
Having the pine stabilized for liners would be a great bet.
 
Horsewright said:
Having the pine stabilized for liners would be a great bet.
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Thanks Dave not only for your suggestion but the insite on the pinecones. We absolutely all play outside regardless of the weather. I never considered the effects of rain or processing fish & game on the cones.
 
Just to make sure you know - the wood needs to be completely dry before stabilization
 
Horsewright, Thanks for the pictures and the information about the pinecone handle.
 
Horsewright, if you don't mind me asking, how do you attach the copper guards on your knives? Are they pinned, pinned and soldered, etc. They look really nice. I have used copper as guards before and it sure heats up fast when grinding.
 
Tom Lewis said:
Horsewright, if you don't mind me asking, how do you attach the copper guards on your knives? Are they pinned, pinned and soldered, etc. They look really nice. I have used copper as guards before and it sure heats up fast when grinding.
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Howdy Tom
I pin and JB Weld all my bolsters, copper, nickel or brass. I use to solder but I am a firm believer that JB Weld is superior to solder and I soldered very well. I can say that because I see a lot of knives, I've made sheaths for about every maker you've ever heard of and lots ya've never heard of. I soldered well. However, I still had a couple of those fail. I've never had a JB Welded bolster fail. I do pin the mosaic pins too. They say ya can't but whoever they is, is wrong cause I've done several thousand now. Ya can peen mosaic pins. I do taper the pin holes too so its a mechanical bond besides the JB Weld. It has worked very well for me. Thanks for the kind words.
 
Horsewright, thanks for the information. I also have changed from solder to JB weld. You make beautiful knives, I always enjoy seeing pictures of them.
 
Tom Lewis said:
Horsewright, thanks for the information. I also have changed from solder to JB weld. You make beautiful knives, I always enjoy seeing pictures of them.
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Thank you sir. Interestingly I got to examine these two yesterday:

4sHA9by.jpg


They belong to a pro chef that was in town yesterday and stopped by to order some more knives. Although not as bad as our knife they too are starting to lift.
 
E EvilGemini I personally would cherish a knife with wood from the family farm even if not "the best" for a knife. I bet Brad at Knife and Gun finishing supplies would be happy to answer your questions about stabilizing them as K&G are one of the best and most used wood stabilizers for knifemakers.

This is just a guess, but I bet one issue with pinecones is getting them dry and then keeping them dry before stabilization. They have much more surface area to volume than a rectangular block, so maybe it's easier for them to swell and shrink. Stabilization helps a lot but doesn't necessarily make for zero movement in wood.
 
I have used the Masecraft pine cone handle blocks a couple times. They are done in alumilite resin. I believer the pinecones are stabilized first. They seem well impregnated and stable. I haven't used one in the kitchen myself, but have sold to folks nearby and not heard of issues.
 
These were from K and G. I hadn't heard anything either till I started contacting customers.
 
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