Stainless Steel Chart Comparison EDC Knife Blades v5.5

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I appreciate the effort, KW. Interesting discussion, although I'd like to see more constructive comments on how the comparison might be improved. Subscribed...
 
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If you switch your chart to mill recommended working hardness range, published corrosion resistance, abrasive/adhesive wear resistance, carbide volume and average size, and impact toughness all at given hardness and heat treat protocol, then the complaining ought to stop.
 
I thinks It's a pretty noble attempt to get a black/white understanding of knife steels ,but a lot of this type of comparisons are very tough because so many people expect different things from the same or diff. knife steels.There are so many different results people experience from the same steel even from the same manufacturer and even custom makers aren't immune to these differences.example: of a well known manufacture of mostly carbon steel knives including A2,52100,etc..some people swear they are the greatest and I have had good experiences with them ,however I have heard and have seen of poor performance from these very knives,anyhow that's just one facet of what you are up against.In the end the best method may be through personal experience,but at least I think you are on the right track.Maybe on a different part of the chart you can break the steels down to activity i.e. hunting/skinning(ats-34,cpm154);filleting/fishing(vg-10,440a,s30v);field use military(1060 - 1095);bushcraft(01,5160);rafting/ watersports(s30v,440a,h1) these are just some of the steels I would consider but maybe not the best but at least it would be a start.
 
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KennethW said:
Stainless Steel Chart Comparison for EDC Knives v2.4

steels3.png


*more steels and measures will be added to the chart in future, as well as toughness, wear resistance and sharpness attributes.

x-axis = price
y-axis = rating


Disclaimer:
This post is based purely on my opinion and my analysis of various resources both cited in my references and through my experience with the steels. I apologize beforehand if any of the below information has any inaccuracies. I am no Engineer, nor pretend to be one, I am in fact a Government Statistician, but I have a love for knives and blade collecting. Therefore, please use this post purely as an FYI, and NOT as a resource or guide. :)

Methodology:
Each attribute is ranked from best to worst, and given a numerical value/rating between 1-10 based on its rank in the chart, rank is determined by a combination of the general consensus (and also Rockwell and CATRA tests) from resources cited in my references. The rating is then divided by the number of attributes measured, as more attributes are added to the chart in future, the individual attribute ratings will change accordingly. All attribute ratings are then aggregated into a total rating for that steel. The maximum sum of all attribute values will always equal to 10. While this post is a crude and oversimplification of the steels mentioned, it should provide an idea of how the specific steels perform when compared to others.



For the purpose of this post, we will only be looking at Stainless Steel, as it is the most common steel found in EDC blades today.

Steel is an alloy of primarily iron and other trace compounds. Carbon has been the main material used in most steel alloys, however other alloying elements like Vanadium, Tungsten, Chromium, Manganese, Molybdenum, Silicon, Boron, Sulphur, Nickel, Aluminium, Cobalt, Copper, Cerium, Niobium, Titanium, Tin and occasionally even Zirconium are used to manipulate Strength, Hardness, Toughness, Wear Resistance, Corrosion Resistance, Edge Retention and Sharpness.


Here is a brief example of the different element types and how they affect Stainless Steel:


Element / Primary function

Carbon (C)
  • Increases edge retention and raises tensile strength.
  • Increases hardness and improves resistance to wear and abrasion.

Chromium (Cr)
  • Increases hardness, tensile strength, and toughness.
  • Provides resistance to wear and corrosion.

Cobalt (Co)
  • Increases strength and hardness, and permits quenching in higher temperatures.
  • Intensifies the individual effects of other elements in more complex steels.

Copper (Cu)
  • Increases corrosion resistance.

Manganese (Mn)
  • Increases hardenability, wear resistance, and tensile strength.
  • Deoxidizes and degasifies to remove oxygen from molten metal.
  • In larger quantities, increases hardness and brittleness.

Molybdenum (Mo)
  • Increases strength, hardness, hardenability, and toughness.
  • Improves machinability and resistance to corrosion.

Nickel (Ni)
  • Adds strength and toughness.

Nitrogen (N)
  • Used in place of carbon for the steel matrix.

Phosphorus (P)
  • Improves strength, machinability, and hardness.
  • Creates brittleness in high concentrations.

Silicon (Si)
  • Increases strength.
  • Deoxidizes and degasifies (if thats even a word) to remove oxygen from molten metal.

Sulfur (S)
  • Improves machinability when added in minute quantities.

Tungsten (W)
  • Adds strength, toughness, and improves hardenability.

Vanadium (V)
  • Increases strength, wear resistance, and increases toughness.


Note of Caution: The Steel used is not the exclusively the only determinant in blade performance. One has to take into account if the blade has been properly Heat Treated, the design of the blade, the design of the handle, the dimensions, the weight, and the overall build quality of the entire product. :cool:


As mentioned above, there are several attributes that determine the Steel. Let’s take an in depth look at these attributes, and how they will play an important role in the choice of you blade.


Tensile Strength:
Strength or Tensile Strength which is the maximum stress the steel can withstand while being stretched or pulled before necking or deforming.


Hardness:
The stress applied to the tip or edge of the blade before the edge curls or deforms will dependent on the hardness of the steel. The harder the steel, the more resistant to deforming it is. The Rockwell test is commonly used to determine the hardness of steels.

Toughness:
The blades resistance to damage like chipping, cracking or breaking will be determined by its Toughness.

Wear Resistance:
The ability to withstand abrasion. Carbides distribution within the steel matrix is usually the main determinant of Wear Resistance.

Corrosive Resistance:
All steel, even Stainless Steel is not immune to corrosion. Oxidation at the surface of the blade steel will lead to rust formations.

Edge Retention:
The ability to stay sharp. Losing the edge on your blade can be attributed to several factors, mainly edge deformation, chipping, corrosion or oxidative stress. Knowing the task you will use your blade for, and selecting appropriate steel will help keep your blade sharp for longer.

Sharpness:
The ‘fine-ness’ of the grain will determine how sharp you will be able to sharpen your blade. The grain is affected by both the methodology in the forging process and the elemental additives used in the alloy.


“There is no such thing as ‘The Best Steel’, only ‘The Right Steel’. Knowing the primary function or use for the knife will help in determining the optimal steel to use for its blade.” :thumbup:



The Chart Explained:

420/420J2
At the lowest end of the spectrum on the far left and by far the cheapest steel in the range, we have the 420/420J2 steels. These are typically used in low cost China made knives or display knives and swords. Practical use of these blade steels is generally not recommended as they are very soft, very weak and not very wear resistant. They lose their edge really quickly from use. They are however, very corrosive resistant and sharpen like butter, which makes them good as disposable knives, and IMO is one of the better candidates to use in wet or corrosive environments.

x55CrMo14
This steel is used almost exclusively by Victorinox in most of their knife blades. It’s a tad harder, stronger, more wear resistant than and as corrosive resistant as the 420/420J2. It has a max Cr of 15% and can be polished to a mirror finish. It also has a 0.15% Vanadium which gives it a slightly better edge retention.

420HC/425M
The 420HC is probably my favourite of the 420 family. It is superior to 420J2 in almost every aspect, and is extremely good in terms of the cost to value ratio. It’s much harder, stronger, tougher, more wear resistant than and even more corrosive resistant than the 420/420J2. IMO is one of the most corrosive resistant stainless steel available today, albeit not as good as H-1. It has slightly less carbon than x55CrMo14, but has slightly more Vanadium which lets it keep its edge almost as well as the x55CrMo14. It is probably the most common steel on low end production knives available today.

440A/AUS-6
440A blades have had a bad rep historically due to cheap China knives labelling 440 on their blades. I would put this steel on par with 420HC and AUS-6. It is a little more wear resistant than 420HC, but is nowhere near as tough, as hard or as corrosive resistant. Many manufacturers used 440A before switching over to 420HC, which IMO is the better steel.

440B/AUS-8
440B and AUS-8 steels are comparable. 440B is very rare and is almost identical to 440A except for the 0.15% extra carbon, which gives it just a tad bit more strength and hardness. On the chart both 440A and 440B are equal; this is due to a rounding error, my apologies. :(

440C/AUS-10
Similarly with the previous 2 steels, 440C is comparable to AUS-10. It has almost double to the carbon content of 440A. It is much harder and more wear resistant than any or the steels previously mentioned, and can also hold an edge much longer when used. However, 440C also has its drawbacks. It’s not as tough as the other 440’s and 420HC steels, and not as corrosive resistant. 440C was considered a ‘Super-Steel’ for a long time by some before the emergence of higher end stainless steels.

CPM440V/S60V
440V or S60V is a very strange steel IMO. It works of the 440C formula but raises the carbon content to 2.15%and Vanadium to 5.5%. It has insane wear resistance for a stainless steel, best of all stainless steels IMO, but can be as soft as 420 steels to get an adequate toughness. A thicker blade geometry would be best to see this steel excel.

154CM/ATS34
154CM and its Japanese counterpart the ATS34 are almost identical. 154CM is harder, and tougher than any of the previously mentioned steels, and holds it edge extremely well, albeit not as well as the 440V/S60V. It is possibly the entry level steel for higher end knives. Almost every Emerson knife uses 154CM.

VG-10
VG-10 is a high end stainless steel, and quite expensive, but cheaper than 154CM/ATS34. Unlike any other steel discussed here, it uses Cobalt in its formula which makes its substrate stronger. IMO, VG-10 has the sharpest edge of any stainless steel. It’s tougher and more rust resistant than 154CM. Many Spyderco knives use VG-10.

CPM154
Identical to 154CM in terms of composition, but undergoes a different process. The CPM version has more evenly distributed carbides and a finer grain structure, with fewer weak spots. Given the choice of CPM154 or 154CM, go for CPM154.

CPMS30V
Considered a Super-Steel by many, IMO the best performing stainless steel for my EDC (Spyderco Native S30V, what a beauty! :D). Almost A-2 class toughness and almost S90V wear resistance, hardened to 58-61 Rc. Similarly with the CPM154, the CPM process gives it a very fine grain microstructure, and very evenly distributed Vanadium Carbides, allowing for a more consistent stainless steel that holds an edge like no other. "However, sharpening this blade can be a b!@tch. If you want toner triceps, CPMS30V is the way to go."



Recently Listed Steels: (more may be included into the chart in future)

D-2
Some would argue that this deserves to be in the stainless steel chart, however after looking through multiple sites, I decided to leave this out for now. The minimum level of chromium for stainless steels is 13% and D-2 has 12%. This makes it almost a stainless steel, but not really. That a side, D-2 is an excellent steel. It is much tougher than premium stainless steels like 154CM, and has greater wear resistance, but has not much rust resistance when compared to the stainless steels.

ZDP-189
It has a surprisingly simple formula of 3% carbon and 20% chromium, albeit 3% carbon is extremely high for a stainless steel. ZDP-189 can get very hard, harder and tougher than S30V. Some say it chips when used where S30V does not. It’s more expensive than S30V, but is less rust resistant. I did not list this steel as it is hard to come by and expensive. “If you think S30V is a b!@tch to sharpen, you aint seen nothin yet.” :eek:

CTS-XHP
More on this steel later…

H-1
More on this steel later…



References:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crucible_steel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alloy_steel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_steel_grades
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_steel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel
http://www.machinist-materials.com/stainless_table.htm
http://www.spyderco.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47155
http://www.leatherman.com/products/faq.asp?c=2
http://www.emersonknives.com/ekEK_FAQ.php
http://mantisknives.com/faqs.html
http://www.spyderco.com/edge-u-cation/steel.php
http://www.swissarmy.com/CustomerService/FAQs/Pages/pocket tools.aspx?
http://www.gerberuk.com/index.php/faq/cat_id/5
http://www.ausknives.com/
http://www.coldsteel.com/faqs.html#Made
http://zknives.com/knives/articles/knifesteelfaq.shtml
http://www.unitedcutlery.com/United.aspx
http://www.latrobesteel.com/assets/documents/datasheets/LSS_420_HC.pdf
http://www.survivaltopics.com/forums/knives-blades/5052-info-steel-quality-in-victorinox-knives.html
http://willamette.edu/~jgates/steelfaq.html
http://www.knivestown.com/ktown/blade_steels.asp
http://faq.customtacticals.com/steels/
http://bit.ly/lv4yeF
http://www.spyderco.com/edge-u-cation/steel.php
http://www.spyderco.com/edge-u-cation/index.php?item=3
http://www.foodieforums.com/vbullet...59-Hitachi-Steel-Spec-Sheet-(AS-ZDP-189-etc.)
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/368828-Steel-FAQ

-KennethW

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You certainly put significant time and effort into this and it is appreciated.
 
BITEME said:
....Maybe on a different part of the chart you can break the steels down to activity i.e. hunting/skinning(ats-34,cpm154);filleting/fishing(vg-10,440a,s30v);field use military(1060 - 1095);bushcraft(01,5160);rafting/ watersports(s30v,440a,h1) these are just some of the steels I would consider but maybe not the best but at least it would be a start.
Click to expand...

Heh?!? What does that mean? How is 5160 a "bushcraft" steel? 1095 isn't a "bushcraft" steel? :confused:
 
hardheart said:
If you switch your chart to mill recommended working hardness range, published corrosion resistance, abrasive/adhesive wear resistance, carbide volume and average size, and impact toughness all at given hardness and heat treat protocol, then the complaining ought to stop.
Click to expand...

I have updated the post and added wear resistance to the chart, more updates will come in the future.

I have reached the length limit of a post, and have divided the post into 2 sections.

Thank you for your feedback.
 
Still way too many mistakes such as this: about x55CrMo14
It also has a 0.15% Vanadium which gives it a slightly better edge retention.
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That number is too low to form any vanadium carbides and is used for grain refinement at that level. Wear resistance would not be affected by .15% V.

S30V:
Almost A-2 class toughness and almost S90V wear resistance, hardened to 58-61 Rc.
Click to expand...
Not even close in either attribute.


440C:
It’s not as tough as the other 440’s and 420HC steels, and not as corrosive resistant.
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One thing 440C does well is in corrosion resistance. This would be incorrect.
440C was considered a ‘Super-Steel’ for a long time by some before the emergence of higher end stainless steels
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A common misconception and revisionist. We didn't even use the term then. The first "super steel" was 154cm, then ATS 34 after a batch of "dirty" ( inclusions and some bubbles which caused voids when ground out) 154cm gave Hitachi an opportunity to get their foot in the door. Aus 10 has a better grain structure, lower chrome, and vanadium so it takes finer edges, chips less, but has lower corrosion resistance.

IMO, VG-10 has the sharpest edge of any stainless steel.
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Well, you did state " IMO" , so you aren't stating facts. If you were it would be incorrect.
154CM is harder, and tougher than any of the previously mentioned steels,
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Nope.

Etc., etc. There are too many incorrect statements as well as the graph itself being a difficult to read construct of your imagination it seems,

Joe
 
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@ Mastiff:

Thanks for you feedback. I havent made any changes to the commentary in 2 years. Many of the statements mentioned were referenced from reputable sources on a few different forums at the time. I will go over them again and review more data points, to evaluate their accuracy. But I do agree with some of your feedback, and will work to rectify the inaccuracies you mentioned.

Many thanks again for helping point out inaccuracies. Will do my best to update this when I have the time.
 
ujtordai said:
Hello
Does anybody know where positioning the Uddeholm VANADIS-10 steel on these charts?
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Hi ujtordai, I've taken a quick look at that steel as promised. but cant add it to this chart as it does not have enough chromium to be considered a stainless steel. but thanks for asking, it does look like a great performing steel.
 
marcinek said:
Thank you, knifenut1013. You beat me to it. For those masters of steel in this forum, this chart is not common knowledge - its nonsense "junk science." For those who know nothing about steels, it only adds to the misinformation out there.
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Thank you KennethW for posting this very informative graph/ chart. Its very helpful for a newbie like me. I know what you are trying to do and share and honestly, what you did just now is just AWESOME! I fully understand your chart and your explanations. I do understand the numbers are merely representation of values compared to other metals described and I just cant understand why a lot of members here are trying to force you to put out exact numbers to quantify. Maybe they have a very hard time taking all the info in! Hehehe... It must be really hard for a lot of you as I understand (and seem to notice), a lot of you people are probably hardcore followers of a particular metal and are basically disappointed with the chart comparison and basically demand an explanation. A lot of you people are also completely NARCISSISTIC in just have no manners when voicing out your opinions. I really feel sorry for a lot you Narcissist who really got sore by the charts as I definitely understand what KennethW is trying to achieve. A lot of you people think youre EXPERTS and think you know everyrhing about knives and metals. But in reality, everybody has differing opinions about every type of metals and every type of knives. So really, no need to really be hyped about these simple things. Ive been researching facts about some of the particular metals mentioned and I believe the representation of the charts are basically correct. You may have different opinions, but believe me, in a forum where everybody thinks he's right, NOBODY CARES!! :)
 
bongsantos said:
Thank you KennethW for posting this very informative graph/ chart. Its very helpful for a newbie like me. I know what you are trying to do and share and honestly, what you did just now is just AWESOME! I fully understand your chart and your explanations. I do understand the numbers are merely representation of values compared to other metals described and I just cant understand why a lot of members here are trying to force you to put out exact numbers to quantify. Maybe they have a very hard time taking all the info in! Hehehe... It must be really hard for a lot of you as I understand (and seem to notice), a lot of you people are probably hardcore followers of a particular metal and are basically disappointed with the chart comparison and basically demand an explanation. A lot of you people are also completely NARCISSISTIC in just have no manners when voicing out your opinions. I really feel sorry for a lot you Narcissist who really got sore by the charts as I definitely understand what KennethW is trying to achieve. A lot of you people think youre EXPERTS and think you know everyrhing about knives and metals. But in reality, everybody has differing opinions about every type of metals and every type of knives. So really, no need to really be hyped about these simple things. Ive been researching facts about some of the particular metals mentioned and I believe the representation of the charts are basically correct. You may have different opinions, but believe me, in a forum where everybody thinks he's right, NOBODY CARES!! :)
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Thanks Bong, you are too kind. Glad it was able to help you. :)
 
I know this is an old thread, but i appreciate the ressurection...its a nice reference guide! Appreciate putting all the steel comparison charts and descriptions together in one post... I'd like to see some updates, maybe a link or reference to Ankerson's awesome "steel rankings by category" thread? Anyway, nice work!
 
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