Thinking of buying a Hinderer

[Hotshot10]

I'm used to carrying ZTs, but lately looking at the For Sale forum has me thinking of buying a slightly used Hinderer XM-18. Am I going to notice differences between the two?

The major difference that concerns me is my wife noticing how much more a Hinderer will cost me. Seriously, though, I can't decide to drop the extra $150 or so.

 

[Aquaholicc]

After previously owning one and selling it. My opinion is they are not worth the “extra $150”. Sure the little stallion head on the blade is kick ass, but to me the knife just didn’t carry/perform like I wanted it to (I owned the Xm-18 3.5 Slicer grind).

Now I will say I don’t believe there is any loss if you do decide to buy a Hinderer as you can easily sell it for what you paid, give or take a few bucks if you don’t want it sitting around.

I say go for it, but make sure whichever Hinderer you do buy, they have swapped out the Teflon bushing with bronze

 

[rye_a]

I have both ZTs and Hinderers (both a 3.5" XM-18 and a Jurassic). Honestly, they are all fantastic knives and I can't really say that I think that my Hinderers are head and shoulders better than ZT in terms of quality. I still really like the Hinderers, and even prefer them to the ZTs for no other reason than that they are the originals. That is obviously subjective and opinion based, so take it for what it is worth.

 

[halden.doerge]

Hinderers have a different feel, there's really no other way to put it. Whether it will be worth the extra cost to you can only be figured out one way: buy it and see if you like it.

To me, they are worth it. They are another level of precision and durability than ZT, even though from the standpoint of bang for your buck, ZT's are objectively offering more. Knife collecting is pretty inherently unobjective, I reckon.

 

[sixate]

I went through this dilema last year. I finally bit the bullet and got an XM 3.5 warncliffe. It was a beautiful knife. I loved the look of it, loved the way it felt in my hand, but the lack of detent and crappy flipping action made it horrible. I kept it for a while, but dumped it cheap on the exchange. I have since handled at least 8 different XM's and none of them had a detent or flipping action that rivaled my ZT's. I'll never try another Hinderer again as I feel ZT makes better Hinderers.

Another deal breaker for me on any knife is the pocket clip. I simply won't carry a knife unless it has a deep carry clip. I have since sold nearly all my pocket knives and only carry/use my ZT 0562CF or 0452TI.

With that said I say buy one and form your own opinion. If you don't like it, sell it and get nearly all your money back.

 

[sharp_edge]

I have/had 10+ ZTs (all regular production folders) and only two Hinderers: xm-18 spanto and xm-18 bowie, both gen 4 I believe. Both brands are high quality products no question about it. Aesthetically however the hinderers are more attractive to me. The hardware of Hinderer is also with better quality and looks/feels better. Hinderer xm-18 has perhaps the best ergonomics among all folders that I have tried. My two Hinderers have excellent flipping action - can be flipped open in any direction without any wrist movement. They are not as snappy as ZTs on ball bearings but I kind of prefer the hydralic feeling of opening them.

All in all, ZT is not Hinderer. If you are curious about Hinderer, you just have to try it out.

 

[sXePhenomenal]

You wouldn’t be disappointed I have a 3” and 3.5” (just arrived today) and man I love them got both off the exchange now I just need a XM-24 skinny.

 

[Hotshot10]

Hinderers have a different feel, there's really no other way to put it. Whether it will be worth the extra cost to you can only be figured out one way: buy it and see if you like it.

To me, they are worth it. They are another level of precision and durability than ZT, even though from the standpoint of bang for your buck, ZT's are objectively offering more. Knife collecting is pretty inherently unobjective, I reckon.

That's interesting. Some knives, like firearms, just seem to fit with one person and not the other, and cost isn't necessarily the deciding factor.

I have/had 10+ ZTs (all regular production folders) and only two Hinderers: xm-18 spanto and xm-18 bowie, both gen 4 I believe. Both brands are high quality products no question about it. Aesthetically however the hinderers are more attractive to me. The hardware of Hinderer is also with better quality and looks/feels better. Hinderer xm-18 has perhaps the best ergonomics among all folders that I have tried. My two Hinderers have excellent flipping action - can be flipped open in any direction without any wrist movement. They are not as snappy as ZTs on ball bearings but I kind of prefer the hydralic feeling of opening them.

All in all, ZT is not Hinderer. If you are curious about Hinderer, you just have to try it out.

The flipping action is important to me. I like folders that open easily with a single hand.

You wouldn’t be disappointed I have a 3” and 3.5” (just arrived today) and man I love them got both off the exchange now I just need a XM-24 skinny.

As I recall from the one time that I saw them in person, the XM-24s are considerably larger than the 18s.

 

[GermanyChris]

You wouldn’t be disappointed I have a 3” and 3.5” (just arrived today) and man I love them got both off the exchange now I just need a XM-24 skinny.

I’d like to have an XM24 spanto but they live in a price range that’s bad for me, little more gets custom or low production.

 

[tyyreaun]

The major difference that concerns me is my wife noticing how much more a Hinderer will cost me. Seriously, though, I can't decide to drop the extra $150 or so.

I misread this at first - I thought you were comparing used vs. new Hinderers, not ZT vs. Hinderer.

I haven't checked prices recently, but the second-hand market for Hinderers has been very buyer friendly. I've seen 3.5" XM-18s in great condition go for barely over $300 - sometimes even less than $300, if the seller wants to move it fast.

 

[archieblue]

I don't find the ZTs appealing at all. Even the hinderer designed ZTs are lack luster. There are just so many subtle differences that I prefer on the XM-18.

 

[anthonycastorena2014]

^^ That is all.

 

[sXePhenomenal]

^^ That is all.

If one ever pops up on the exchange specifically the all black or helmet etched one is buying it

 

[Keypper]

The ZT0392 series is without a doubt in my head the best of the best that ZT has to offer that won't cost you up in the thousands such as the 777, 888, and 999. Being that the 0392 is based off the Eklipse model, I think it'd be a pretty good comparison too. I currently own the 0392BLK and it is flawless. Nicely tuned detent that allows for a very commanding "thwak" when you flip it open. Everything about this knife is the same as the Hinderer except for the 0392 runs on bearings, comes stock with a front titanium scale instead of the g-10+titanium liner combo, and the exclusive blade shape only found on the 0392. So in that respect I do feel like owning a 0392 is significantly better value than the Eklipse if both knives are priced around 450. The 0392 does flip better as well compared to my Eklipse, but the Eklipse does have a more... Old school washer flipper feel to it that somehow makes it feel a little tougher (but that might just be me). I'm also sure that the washers are going to hold up significantly better than the bearings so if you find yourself using your knife in grimy situations, so that's also something you can consider.

On the Hinderer end, I'd have to say the newer generations of Hinderers do flip significantly better than the earlier models. The first Hinderer I owned was a 3" xm-18 and man was that knife outrageously average. Didn't flip that well and the stone wash finish wasn't to my taste so I sold it off. But since then I've given Hinderer another chance and currently own a gen 4 (I believe?) XM-18 3.5 and it flips and flips and flips. The detent is way too strong for my thumb to use the thumbstud, but it flips out very easily and closes shut with little effort after the lock bar is released. The fun part about owning a Hinderer might be the option of customizing it however you want with aftermarket parts and scales. The not so fun part is how all these aftermarket parts cost an arm and a leg as well. My xm-18 has a cf scale and black hardware on it and that alone costed 180 dollars (40 dollars off of a 0609 or a 0393) and I'm sure if I were to sell the knife on the secondary market I'd be selling at a significant loss... which might be why I see myself holding on to this knife for a very long time. But then again, I do enjoy the knife a lot and the idea of selling it probably won't come up.

I cannot vouch for ZT's latest line up of 0609 or a 0393 since I haven't had the pleasure to experience them yet, but from multiple reviews that I've watched and heard, it does sound like the 0393 is a very close iteration of the 0392 at a more friendly 220~ price point. In addition to that, it is a lot more customize-able with makers out there coming out with custom cf "inlays" and custom anodized titanium frames.

In conclusion, I wouldn't get a Hinderer for full price if you're looking for that magical 150 dollar worth of improvement over the ZT, cause it's not there. What is there is Owner's pride of carrying a Hinderer over a ZT if you believe in that stuff. Or go for a ZT0392 if you really want to experience the special offspring of the two brands. Or else a 0393 is probably going to satisfy your need of quality and experience of owning a "hinderer".

 

[Makael]

Buy one. No regrets, Hinderer makes great knives.

 

[skwave]

Currently, I have 5 Hinderer inspired ZT's; 560bw, 566bw, 393, 392blubowie, 392wc, and 2 real hinderers; a MP-1 and half track tanto. The MP-1 handles well, but it's basically a forgotten model as far as Hinderer is concerned; it's whole point was to show off it's changeable backspacers. Too bad that you can't get any for it.
All in all, I carry it ZT's far more often than the hinderers. Far more bang for the buck really.

 

[brandoak]

Try the Hinderer, you have nothing to lose. I bet you will be back on here saying how glad you are that you decided to!

ZT 566 and 392 are probably some of the best knives ever made (minus the bearings on the 392)
But if you want the added blade thickness and more robust pivot Hinderer is the way to go!

 

[Ironbut]

I have three ZTs that I really liked, but I don't think any of them have gotten carried since I got my first Hinderer about 1 1/2 years ago. I now have six Hinderers. Two of them I bought new. The rest came from the Exchange here. If you watch the Exchange you can run across some good deals, because, while Hinderer, CRK, etc owners may use their knives hard, they usually don't beat them up.

 

[sXePhenomenal]

Two ZTs Two Hinderers. The Hinderers are excellent but the 561 is just as good imo its an amazing knife for the money one of the best ZT has ever made. haven’t tried the 562 but I don’t have a reason to.

 

[ChazzyP]

Hinderers have a different feel, there's really no other way to put it. Whether it will be worth the extra cost to you can only be figured out one way: buy it and see if you like it.

To me, they are worth it. They are another level of precision and durability than ZT, even though from the standpoint of bang for your buck, ZT's are objectively offering more. Knife collecting is pretty inherently unobjective, I reckon.

I currently have 5 ZTs (0801 pimped, 0450 CF aftermarket, 0452CF, 0562 CF, 0909), and have owned two others (0350 BW, 0920). All seven are very good knives and you sure get a lot of bang for your buck with them priced below and above $200. They flip great, have excellent F&F, and use premium materials. All I have/had are well-designed by Rexford, Sinkevich, Hinderer, George, or Onion. I do like my current group and expect they're keepers, but when I go to my knife storage for any day's carry or go grab a few to play with or fondle, the ZTs rarely make it out of their drawer. It's hard to put my finger on exactly (flipper tab pun reference?), but there's something generic, maybe soulless, and un-exciting about them that keeps them out of my pocket and hand moreso than not only my RHKs, CRKs, Shiros and other mid-techs, but also my Sypdies and BMKs.

There's something about my Hinderers (XM18 3.5 Spanto, XM24 REK re-grind, MP1 Micarta, 2 G10 HalfTracks, and one XM3.5 Sparrow sold) that just appeals to me more. With one in hand, I just get a more palpable feel of craftsmanship. Mid-techs are definitely production knives too, but my RHKs have both a hand-made feel and a better feel in hand than my ZTs. There are subtle differences that speak toward a more individualized process of design and production that somehow appeal to me. There are definitely shortcomings too--RHK blades are thick and poor slicers; flipping action on my XMs is meh at best; the knives are heavy for their size and some are kinda pocket hogs; I had to do quite a bit of re-profiling to get my XM18 3.5 and MP1 edges to where I wanted them. Lots of guys that love Hinderers hate and change the Teflon washers, but mine are smooth as glass, more than quick enough for me with only one drop of liquid TriFlow added to each side, and seem in no way weak to me.

It really all just comes down to what appeals to you more. I also never look at these things as a question of value, as the knives cost what they cost and if you prefer one over the other then you have to pony up what it takes to buy one. I buy more knives on the Exchange than new from dealers and would suggest our OP do the same to try out a Hinderer. It's really the only way to tell--getting one in hand will let you know.

"Knife collecting is pretty inherently unobjective, I reckon." Right on, Halden.