Thoughts on Calphalon Knives

[samuraistuart]

John, that is my understanding as well. They are not "fully forged" as is claimed in their own literature. "Fully forged" apparently means they forge weld the bolster on to strip steel.

 

[jdm61]

Who is this John character? Wusthoff flat out says that the old drop forging method is no longer efficient or precise enough for their purposes. In their video, they say "this is how we used to do it." and they show a video clip of the old forging press. Although they didn't show it close up, if i had to guess how the do the bolsters, I would say induction heating.

John, that is my understanding as well. They are not "fully forged" as is claimed in their own literature. "Fully forged" apparently means they forge weld the bolster on to strip steel.

 

[aighaid]

There are more reasons than given above not to burden yourself with Calphalon products. The company that used to sell and honor the warranty no longer does so, and gets testy when questions are asked. My Calphalon 8" Chef knife snapped 1/2 inch below where the handle meets the blade: no reason, other than rust caused by a poor sealing. The rest of the knife is as bright as the day I first used it, but the interior is as rusty as metal can get--it flakes! When I called to initiate a warranty exchange, the phone did not answer for 1-1/2 hours. That was all the time I had that day, so I called intermittently throughout the week--nights, mornings, early and late to see if anyone would ever answer the phone. Finally, I called the sales number, where I was told the company no longer handles the WARRANTY department--she didn't say they won't SELL you another knife, but claimed the "company has moved the warranty department to another company." The only number for the 'other company' is the number listed that does not answer. It looks as though Calphalon has abandoned any pretense of honoring the warranty. Two emails were also sent to the website and they went unanswered. Knowing this, if anyone buys anything from Calphalon, you are unlikely to ever get your product repaired or replaced--it looks as though they are being dumped on the market at stores than handle liquidated merchandise.

 

[flphotog]

Their own factory tour videos and in the case of Wusthof, their own statements contradict you. The knives that you consider to be "full forged" have the bolster material forge welded to a long strip of blade steel and are the profile stamped to shape with big dies. The official Wusthof video even shows the blade steel being feed into the machinery from a big roll.

I don't know about Wusthof but Henckels still makes fully forged kinves in some lines not all. Many of the Zwilling J.A. Henckels are fully forged as is the J. A. Hendkels International Series Knives.

Edit: Looks like the Wusthof Classic Series is forged as is the Classic Icon, don't have time to look at all of them now.

 

[jdm61]

Watch their video. Markus Balbach was on here the other day showing a line of VERY expensive drop forged kitchen knives made by one of the smaller firms in Solingen using his stainless damascus. i asked him how many knives were made in German these days using the drop forging machines and he said not many. Most of these "integral" full tang knives are made using induction heating of the bolsters and only the part of the strip of blade steel necessary. If you want to split hairs, even the ones that are still drop forged are not "full forged" All off he are stamped out into their final shape on big presses.

I don't know about Wusthof but Henckels still makes fully forged kinves in some lines not all. Many of the Zwilling J.A. Henckels are fully forged as is the J. A. Hendkels International Series Knives.

Edit: Looks like the Wusthof Classic Series is forged as is the Classic Icon, don't have time to look at all of them now.

 

[flphotog]

Watch their video. Markus Balbach was on here the other day showing a line of VERY expensive drop forged kitchen knives made by one of the smaller firms in Solingen using his stainless damascus. i asked him how many knives were made in German these days using the drop forging machines and he said not many. Most of these "integral" full tang knives are made using induction heating of the bolsters and only the part of the strip of blade steel necessary. If you want to split hairs, even the ones that are still drop forged are not "full forged" All off he are stamped out into their final shape on big presses.

I agree not fully forged as in the old days but certainly a lot better than stamped. I'll still stick by my German knives as I've tried a couple of asian knives and I simply don't like them.

 

[Vinifera]

Many years ago the German manufacturer's touted a forged knife as a better, "higher quality" blade. This isn't necessarily the case now. This is from a post by Mark Richmond in response to a customer who inquired about Konosuke knives. Mark sells kitchen knives from a well-known website which will not be mentioned because I don't believe the site is a dealer member.

In the old days "forged" was a sign of quality and "stamped" was a sign of cheap crap since several decades ago there were very few good stainless steels and even when they were using descent steel they were heat treating poorly. The big German companies tried to differentiate themselves by telling everyone that their knives were better and cost more because they were forged and that was why they cost more. This distinction has evaporated since most of the best steels in the world are now made out of thin rolled steel that is not really stamped out anymore but rather cut by lasers or water jets or plasma cutters. Knife makers then heat treat the knives and shape the blades from blanks made in this manner and there is no quality difference.

Now many small blacksmiths in Japan and maybe a couple in the USA (I can only think of Murray Carter) are still using bar stock and forging their knives by heating the steel and hammering them out on a pneumatic hammer. They tend to use carbon steels but some use good stainless steels as well. The Fujiyama blacksmith does knives in this manner. The blacksmith that does the [Konosuke] HH and HD and white #2 are using the former method.

There are ways to differentiate between good and bad knives but this is no longer a way to do it.​

Wusthof has even modified some of their knives to reduce the bolster which has always been a problem with forged knives after many sharpenings, i.e. the bolster must be ground down as the blade is reduced in height and the blade becomes shorter than the bolster. I use a non-forged Messermeister Japanese Chef's knife (vegetable cleaver) which features a thin blade profile and a Konosuke HD laser gyuto, which I prefer to any German style forged knife for vegetable and protein cutting. I use my older German Chef's knives for breaking down chicken and other similar duties where the heft and thicker blade is preferable.

 

[jdm61]

But they are "stamped" out to their final shape just like some hand forged Japanese knives are technically speaking. To be fair, some of the other Japanese had made knives are sheared to shape. Only lunatics like us American custom makers forge blades to within 95% of final shape and them clean them up on a grinder using $12 a pop ceramic belts. Remember that you get get other steels in coil form like AEB-L. I have the sneaking suspicion that the Germans still use that X55CrVSTLwhatever steel not only because it is inexpensive but also because it "machines" more easily which is to say that it stands up to whatever abuse they heap upon it in their manufacturing processes with minimal fuss and requirement for hand work.

I agree not fully forged as in the old days but certainly a lot better than stamped. I'll still stick by my German knives as I've tried a couple of asian knives and I simply don't like them.