Trail Day!

Lorien

Lorien

Nose to the Grindstone
Moderator
Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Dec 5, 2005
Messages
26,579
Well another year's come and gone. A little older, probably a little wiser, but definitely older.

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Usually I'd go for a ride with my friends, but this year I decided to spend a little time with my brother from another mother, working on a trail that I'm proposing for the local Scouts camp property. It's a beginner/intermediate mountain biking trail that's around 2.5 kilometers, and it goes through some really spectacular Vancouver Island forest. Lots and lots and lots of cutting along that 2.5km.

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We got a ton of work done, cutting in the corridor, and getting things ready for the power tools. I prefer avoiding hauling my brusher and power saw along a trail alignment before it's rough cut. It's just way too tiring. This way, it's way easier to work my way through the bush, meaning it's less tiring, and you don't wanna be too tired when you're working the saw.

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Russ, aka Bigredpig, helped dial in CPK's logo, and for his efforts he received a LightChopper. It's amazing watching what he can do with this knife. At 270 pounds, he is twice my weight and not only that, he competes in the Highland Games so he's incredibly strong.

I brought The North Sword, (by Dan Keffeler) along with us, and here's Russ just casually wreaking havoc;


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We started out pretty strong, and I was chopping like a demon within the first fifteen minutes, so I got tired- little older, not so much wiser- in aiming to snip off a branch, the LightChopper flew out of my hand, flew through the air 15 feet and stuck, tip-first, into the ground a couple feet from Russ' foot. We put lanyards on our knives after that.

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I usually do this kind of work solo, and prefer to not use a lanyard since I'm usually on the move with knife in hand. If I slip and lose my footing, I want to be able to get that knife away from me when I'm falling, and having it attached to my wrist presents a risk. But when cutting with others, one must always be mindful of 'The Circle of Death'

Lots of this kind of stuff, which is where the LC really shines-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8KZe5ApFeA

Time for a little cake break

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While we were resting, a strange mist settled around me

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I started noticing things in a different way, particularly the beauty of the area. Must've been something in the air.


Because I was on point, I was able to watch Russ cut his way through, which is pretty awesome

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I got my cuts in, too.


Sometimes you find the limits of the tool you use, which is why it's good to have several, different tools for the job


It was a great day! I'm hella tired today, and have no injuries. That in itself is a win in my book, but coupled with the fact that we are opening up terrain to new generations of riders- well, that's what keeps me stoked!

Cheers!
 
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super impressed by how well that thinly ground RLC has held up and by its amazing performance. That knife, by the way, came back to me from Justin, and is paired with a set of terotuf scales courtesy of Casino
 
Lorien said:
super impressed by how well that thinly ground RLC has held up and by its amazing performance. That knife, by the way, came back to me from Justin, and is paired with a set of terotuf scales courtesy of Casino
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You are very welcome and glad to see that those are being put to perfect "use" ;)

I wish that you'd be getting an LC-4V from Nathan at some point to test it in your trail building adventures and to compare to other tools in your bag of tricks because quite honestly, I think that Nathan-just-being-Nathan, undersold the prowess of his own LC-4V for putting it to hard use :eek:
 
Casinostocks said:
You are very welcome and glad to see that those are being put to perfect "use" ;)

I wish that you'd be getting an LC-4V from Nathan at some point to test it in your trail building adventures and to compare to other tools in your bag of tricks because quite honestly, I think that Nathan-just-being-Nathan, undersold the prowess of his own LC-4V for putting it to hard use :eek:
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Agree with you on the 4V. Very close to putting mine in to use as I sold my 3V user so I’m left deciding between the RLC or 4V, or maybe MC?! What will the pre-order be...

Lorien has more hours swinging a LC than anyone I know. Would love to see how they compare according to him. I can tell you for sure I’d never baton with the RLC or 4V the way I did on the LC so maybe MC?!

Here I go derailing another thread.
 
JustinFournier said:
Agree with you on the 4V. Very close to putting mine in to use as I sold my 3V user so I’m left deciding between the RLC or 4V, or maybe MC?! What will the pre-order be...

Lorien has more hours swinging a LC than anyone I know. Would love to see how they compare according to him. I can tell you for sure I’d never baton with the RLC or 4V the way I did on the LC so maybe MC?!

Here I go derailing another thread.
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I don't know as to what the odds are of Lorien getting an LC-4V. No idea as to how many "creek" protos exist or if Nathan would even want one of those outside the compound!

IIRC, there were something like 20 x LC-4Vs sold on here by Nathan and maybe another 5 or so at most, elsewhere. Some of those 4Vs have already been turned over to new owners, but still would LOVE to see one which is not mine :D in Lorien's capable hands.
 
as much as I'd love to try out every iteration of every knife I designed, made by Nate and Jo and Mark, it wouldn't be fair or practical from a business standpoint for me to consume too many. Since I'm part of the team, my bias may be perceived as too strong to give Jo Public the assurance that my testing is objective, which is why any of the testing you'll see from me doesn't generally leave this forum or my Loriendesign social media homesteads.

The North Sword is made from PD#1 and it corrodes pretty fast. I imagine 4V isn't too much different, since it's so chemically similar. But edge holding...wow. You can see the energy going into that North Sword, not to mention all crap and dirt it's cutting through, and it'll shear paper without hanging up now. No problem. Nate and Jo sent me a 4V test piece EDC, and although the corrosion thing is definitely a thing, its abrasive resistance is phenomenal. An easy thing to test, since I'm constantly dealing with double wall corrugated cardboard and all kinds of plastic and foam packaging. Couldn't tell you definitively how it acts wrt impact energy, since I haven't used that exact material in the same conditions as others. But, like I said with the PD#1 being so analogous I'll bet you five bucks it lends perfectly to the LC from a shear performance standpoint. I would love to try one out, but it might be splitting hairs between it and D3V, since that stuff is already ridiculously good, (with the added benefit of superior corrosion resistance).

One thing I've learned over the years regarding edge holding is that cutting native vegetation is very different from cutting kiln dried dimensional lumber. A fast growing tree, like alder or cottonwood, carries a lot of dirt as it grows since it grows so quickly. It's not like cutting through sandpaper, but you do drive the edge through a lot of abrasive media. Even though the wood itself isn't very hard, you lose an edge pretty quick through abrasion. It'll scratch your knife up pretty good, which is all the evidence you need of the theory, imo. This is the kind of shit that Keffeler and I talk about when we talk about this stuff. He's one of the few people that I know who tests his blades the way that I use mine, and when it comes to that stuff we totally understand each other. When he starts going off on metallurgy and heat treatment processes, he loses me pretty quick. Nate actually loses me in seconds- I pretend to understand but his knowledge is so beyond mine that I might as well be listening to an alien, (which I might be, now that I think of it ;) )

And, for the LC- I really really really hope it doesn't get permanently retired. Pound for pound, it's the best knife of its type on the market, in my experience. Just heavy enough to create a good amount of impact energy, and just light enough to be nimble for carrying, and easy on the bod for long periods of use. It pairs really well with an axe, or if you're nuts like me, a big badass bush sword. While it may not chop through lumber as fast as a heavier knife, it'll hold its own for that type of use, and kick a heavier knife's ass all day long doing just about everything else.

Sorry for the long post:oops:
 
Lorien said:
as much as I'd love to try out every iteration of every knife I designed, made by Nate and Jo and Mark, it wouldn't be fair or practical from a business standpoint for me to consume too many. Since I'm part of the team, my bias may be perceived as too strong to give Jo Public the assurance that my testing is objective, which is why any of the testing you'll see from me doesn't generally leave this forum or my Loriendesign social media homesteads.

The North Sword is made from PD#1 and it corrodes pretty fast. I imagine 4V isn't too much different, since it's so chemically similar. But edge holding...wow. You can see the energy going into that North Sword, not to mention all crap and dirt it's cutting through, and it'll shear paper without hanging up now. No problem. Nate and Jo sent me a 4V test piece EDC, and although the corrosion thing is definitely a thing, its abrasive resistance is phenomenal. An easy thing to test, since I'm constantly dealing with double wall corrugated cardboard and all kinds of plastic and foam packaging. Couldn't tell you definitively how it acts wrt impact energy, since I haven't used that exact material in the same conditions as others. But, like I said with the PD#1 being so analogous I'll bet you five bucks it lends perfectly to the LC from a shear performance standpoint. I would love to try one out, but it might be splitting hairs between it and D3V, since that stuff is already ridiculously good, (with the added benefit of superior corrosion resistance).

One thing I've learned over the years regarding edge holding is that cutting native vegetation is very different from cutting kiln dried dimensional lumber. A fast growing tree, like alder or cottonwood, carries a lot of dirt as it grows since it grows so quickly. It's not like cutting through sandpaper, but you do drive the edge through a lot of abrasive media. Even though the wood itself isn't very hard, you lose an edge pretty quick through abrasion. It'll scratch your knife up pretty good, which is all the evidence you need of the theory, imo. This is the kind of shit that Keffeler and I talk about when we talk about this stuff. He's one of the few people that I know who tests his blades the way that I use mine, and when it comes to that stuff we totally understand each other. When he starts going off on metallurgy and heat treatment processes, he loses me pretty quick. Nate actually loses me in seconds- I pretend to understand but his knowledge is so beyond mine that I might as well be listening to an alien, (which I might be, now that I think of it ;) )

And, for the LC- I really really really hope it doesn't get permanently retired. Pound for pound, it's the best knife of its type on the market, in my experience. Just heavy enough to create a good amount of impact energy, and just light enough to be nimble for carrying, and easy on the bod for long periods of use. It pairs really well with an axe, or if you're nuts like me, a big badass bush sword. While it may not chop through lumber as fast as a heavier knife, it'll hold its own for that type of use, and kick a heavier knife's ass all day long doing just about everything else.

Sorry for the long post:oops:
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Thanks for taking the time to write that up Lorien. Basically we’re in the same environmental conditions. But you get out more than me. The baby is getting bigger so that will change soon I hope.

While I do love me some LC, I am quite curious as to how the MC compares. I know Nathan said it's retired, but maybe it will come back at some point as it’s impossible Nathan ever reaches his goal of stock on the shelf if he discontinues patterns before they stop selling in secodns. I’m hoping he going through some things and settles on some greatest hits. Then makes more of those.

But with you’re commentary on corossion resistance, I have more than enough of that on 3V already so I think I’ll pass on 4V as a user in this climate.

Thanks very much again.
 
I think 4V might actually a better choice for this knife, considering its stability. Wrt corrosion resistance, I think a powdercoat or cerakote would be a great idea
 
^^^^^Powdercoat and cerakote would eventually wear off wouldn't they? I'll take mine just the way she is "Well done D3V";)
 
TommyGun56 said:
^^^^^Powdercoat and cerakote would eventually wear off wouldn't they? I'll take mine just the way she is "Well done D3V";)
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yes, they would. But here's my take;

If you use your knife a lot, the coating will eventually wear off, leaving steel exposed to corrosion. If you use your knife a lot, you probably will be maintaining it somewhat, but understand that looks degrade. So long as function is served, the aesthetic considerations are probably less of a priority. Whatever coating remains is just that much less steel to maintain.

If you don't use your knife, the coating might last the life of the knife. You don't have to worry much about corrosion apart from the edge bevel which can always be cleaned up. A collector can be comforted with the knowledge that, should you use your knife, it's made from one of the very best material available for the tasks the knife was designed and made to do.

I don't particularly care for coatings. My knives generally get cleaned and maintained after use, and I'm not overly concerned about a little degradation of the surface of the steel. 4V would be no problem for me, I've used all sorts of carbon steel knives and have had very few problems with corrosion since they get maintenance whenever they're used. It's when a carbon knife, as a collectible, is stored for long periods of time that corrosion can set in and become a big problem, especially when the knife is only inspected every few weeks.

A 4V LC with black cerakote and antique micarta....mmmm...
 
Lorien said:
yes, they would. But here's my take;

If you use your knife a lot, the coating will eventually wear off, leaving steel exposed to corrosion. If you use your knife a lot, you probably will be maintaining it somewhat, but understand that looks degrade. So long as function is served, the aesthetic considerations are probably less of a priority. Whatever coating remains is just that much less steel to maintain.

If you don't use your knife, the coating might last the life of the knife. You don't have to worry much about corrosion apart from the edge bevel which can always be cleaned up. A collector can be comforted with the knowledge that, should you use your knife, it's made from one of the very best material available for the tasks the knife was designed and made to do.

I don't particularly care for coatings. My knives generally get cleaned and maintained after use, and I'm not overly concerned about a little degradation of the surface of the steel. 4V would be no problem for me, I've used all sorts of carbon steel knives and have had very few problems with corrosion since they get maintenance whenever they're used. It's when a carbon knife, as a collectible, is stored for long periods of time that corrosion can set in and become a big problem, especially when the knife is only inspected every few weeks.

A 4V LC with black cerakote and antique micarta....mmmm...
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Understand and thanks for the reply:thumbsup:I still dislike coating's of ANY KIND on a knife, Just not my "Cup of Tea"
 
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