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- Jun 29, 2014
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Cheers Will. :thumbup:
Thanks for fixing the thread title, Gary. :thumbup:
As the subject's come up again, I might as well add a few notes, having recently travelled around Ireland with this question in mind.
I was interested as to whether there might be some different regional patterns of agricultural knives or folding knives from the pre industrial era.
These Irish Iron Age blades would fit that description.
(Apologies for the photo quality here: these pics were taken with my phone camera for my own reference.)
Note the knife blade at the back, which is smaller than most sickles, and is possibly a shape which gradually evolved into the pruner/hawkbill style blade.
The knife blade at the front appears to be similar to a leaf shaped spear point, although not knowing how much material has been lost from the edge area, it could also have been a straight edged blade.
The stones in the middle are whetstones.
I could well imagine that farming families in isolated pre-Famine settlements like these in County Donegal, could have still been using similar, locally smithed patterns.
These interesting knife handles were salvaged from Spanish Armada wrecks off the west coast of Ireland. They are not traditional Irish patterns, of course, but it just goes to show how the vagaries of history can potentially introduce tool patterns and techniques from one culture to another. These would date from the late 1500s.
Moving into industrial times, I think the long entanglement with English governance since the mid 1500s, and the close proximity to Liverpool and Yorkshire would have meant many cutting tools would have been of English manufacture, for those that could afford them.
I spent some time in some pretty heartland type of republican areas, including making some visits to a woodworking shop run for and by republican ex-prisoners, and there was never any discrimination regarding English manufactured tools that I could see. They had some very nice Sheffield chisels at the woodworking shop, in fact.
I also was fortunate to be invited to camp with the Irish Bushcraft Club and again, there was no xenophobia about tool country of manufacture there. It was just about quality and value. Those lads mostly had Moras and custom Puukko and Woodlore type knives. One had a William Rodgers Woodlore type knife, with the 'I Cut My Way' stamp on the blade.
This is a linen weavers belt, belonging to a Mrs Agnes Otley of the Falls Road in Belfast.
It's difficult to tell whether her knife (on the left of her tool belt) is purposely shaped that way, or is a repurposed bit of broken off blade from another knife.
This is a nice H. M. Slater clasp knife marked 1940, I picked up at the St. Georges Market in Belfast. I like to think, that given its proximity to the Belfast docks, it may have been owned by someone in the maritime trades.
This is a dagger made in prison by Rory O'Connor, an anti-Treaty republican, who was executed in 1922 during the Civil War.
It was interesting to see that most of the country towns and cities still had family owned hardware stores, which is a rarity in Australia.
The ones that had decent traditional knives usually had a selection of Opinels, Helles, Bucks, SAKs and some of the modern Sheffield brands.
I did wonder, given how much of the country is rural, what the modern farmer might have in his pocket.
Probably a Leatherman, or something like this!
Regarding carrying pocket knives in Ireland, in the North it's the same standard as the UK - you can carry a non-locking folder with blade length less than 3". In the Republic, it's basically the same as my state in Australia. You need to have a lawful reason to carry any knife - work duties and recreation both being implicitly taken to be lawful reasons.
Not an Irish Traditional Knife, but a Traditional Knife in Ireland.
Thanks for fixing the thread title, Gary. :thumbup:
As the subject's come up again, I might as well add a few notes, having recently travelled around Ireland with this question in mind.
I was interested as to whether there might be some different regional patterns of agricultural knives or folding knives from the pre industrial era.
These Irish Iron Age blades would fit that description.
(Apologies for the photo quality here: these pics were taken with my phone camera for my own reference.)
Note the knife blade at the back, which is smaller than most sickles, and is possibly a shape which gradually evolved into the pruner/hawkbill style blade.
The knife blade at the front appears to be similar to a leaf shaped spear point, although not knowing how much material has been lost from the edge area, it could also have been a straight edged blade.
The stones in the middle are whetstones.
I could well imagine that farming families in isolated pre-Famine settlements like these in County Donegal, could have still been using similar, locally smithed patterns.
These interesting knife handles were salvaged from Spanish Armada wrecks off the west coast of Ireland. They are not traditional Irish patterns, of course, but it just goes to show how the vagaries of history can potentially introduce tool patterns and techniques from one culture to another. These would date from the late 1500s.
Moving into industrial times, I think the long entanglement with English governance since the mid 1500s, and the close proximity to Liverpool and Yorkshire would have meant many cutting tools would have been of English manufacture, for those that could afford them.
I spent some time in some pretty heartland type of republican areas, including making some visits to a woodworking shop run for and by republican ex-prisoners, and there was never any discrimination regarding English manufactured tools that I could see. They had some very nice Sheffield chisels at the woodworking shop, in fact.
I also was fortunate to be invited to camp with the Irish Bushcraft Club and again, there was no xenophobia about tool country of manufacture there. It was just about quality and value. Those lads mostly had Moras and custom Puukko and Woodlore type knives. One had a William Rodgers Woodlore type knife, with the 'I Cut My Way' stamp on the blade.
This is a linen weavers belt, belonging to a Mrs Agnes Otley of the Falls Road in Belfast.
It's difficult to tell whether her knife (on the left of her tool belt) is purposely shaped that way, or is a repurposed bit of broken off blade from another knife.
This is a nice H. M. Slater clasp knife marked 1940, I picked up at the St. Georges Market in Belfast. I like to think, that given its proximity to the Belfast docks, it may have been owned by someone in the maritime trades.
This is a dagger made in prison by Rory O'Connor, an anti-Treaty republican, who was executed in 1922 during the Civil War.
It was interesting to see that most of the country towns and cities still had family owned hardware stores, which is a rarity in Australia.
The ones that had decent traditional knives usually had a selection of Opinels, Helles, Bucks, SAKs and some of the modern Sheffield brands.
I did wonder, given how much of the country is rural, what the modern farmer might have in his pocket.
Probably a Leatherman, or something like this!
Regarding carrying pocket knives in Ireland, in the North it's the same standard as the UK - you can carry a non-locking folder with blade length less than 3". In the Republic, it's basically the same as my state in Australia. You need to have a lawful reason to carry any knife - work duties and recreation both being implicitly taken to be lawful reasons.
Not an Irish Traditional Knife, but a Traditional Knife in Ireland.
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