What was considered great knife steel years ago that is now considered cheap or not good?

Frotier76 said:
Most of them look like this...

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HA! Love Trevor Wallace.
They're more like this....

guy is a comedic genius, Kyle Mooney. Love him, SNL picked him up. Love these subtle impersonations that you can hardly tell he's faking.

This is more of us than we wanna admit
 
TC said:
If it was a great knife steel a few years ago, it is still a great knife steel today. Why wouldn't it be? A knife is still a knife.
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Because technology evolves, and there are 'better' things available. An old steel isn't necessarily bad, but when the majority of the market moves on, you start to wonder why you're paying new steel prices for the older model. While most of the flavor-of-the-month "super" steels are not necessarily improvements for most users (they're mostly ultra edge retention focused, while sacrificing toughness), some (most?) of the "basic" steels have been outclassed by newer ones.

Example, one company still uses 154CM in most of it's models, while some manufacturers have long since moved on to CPM-154, which is objectively better. But the first company keeps raising prices. That shouldn't be acceptable these days.
 
Reswob said:
Because technology evolves, and there are 'better' things available. An old steel isn't necessarily bad, but when the majority of the market moves on, you start to wonder why you're paying new steel prices for the older model. While most of the flavor-of-the-month "super" steels are not necessarily improvements for most users (they're mostly ultra edge retention focused, while sacrificing toughness), some (most?) of the "basic" steels have been outclassed by newer ones.

Example, one company still uses 154CM in most of it's models, while some manufacturers have long since moved on to CPM-154, which is objectively better. But the first company keeps raising prices. That shouldn't be acceptable these days.
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There's also the "bait and switch" meaning you pay the same price and get a lower quality steel...

*SOG used to use ATS-34 and went to VG-10

*Buck about 10 years ago were substituting 154CM with Sandvik 12C27 Mod on the Pro models of the Alpha Hunter Series and keeping the price unchanged.

*ATS-55 was a low-batch steel (no fluctuation in element content) and since it was a proprietary steel by Hitachi for Spyderco it probably costed more. VG-10 is a high volume steel and a Spyderco Steel Chart will show the range in elements varies.

*440A used to be the common steel on USA made cutlery brands. When 420HC was developed and those brands turned to it in the 1990's the prices didn't change.

It's all about profit.
 
Well, MagnaCut was considered really hot like a week ago. Now there is a new, trendy super steel, but I forget its name. No matter, though, it'll be considered too old in a month.
 
Reswob said:
Because technology evolves, and there are 'better' things available. An old steel isn't necessarily bad, but when the majority of the market moves on, you start to wonder why you're paying new steel prices for the older model. While most of the flavor-of-the-month "super" steels are not necessarily improvements for most users (they're mostly ultra edge retention focused, while sacrificing toughness), some (most?) of the "basic" steels have been outclassed by newer ones.

Example, one company still uses 154CM in most of it's models, while some manufacturers have long since moved on to CPM-154, which is objectively better. But the first company keeps raising prices. That shouldn't be acceptable these days.
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Starting from the top: the thread is about a steel that once was tops that is now “crap”. There are better steels than steels from ages past, but what made them good knife steels in the first place is still in tact. They may not be “as good”, but they still aren’t crap.

As for the mystery company in the second part of your reply, the assumption here is that everything you’ve ever bought amounts to the cost of the sum of its parts? The price for everything has been steadily increasing in the knife world for a time now. It’s safe to assume even basic steel has increased in price and also increased the cost to the consumer. These two things combined explain a price hike. Whether or not that’s “acceptable” to you is irrelevant to the people buying said company’s knives. I just don’t understand how people almost seem personally insulted by EKI’s business practices. They’re not resetting a collective market; you’re not suffering from their price hikes unless you’re specifically buying their knives.
 
I see alot of people seeming to cold shoulder s30v.
I have s30v and it has been good to me.

Wait this comment needs pics right ?
GZlSpG3.jpeg

There... my right now carry.
 
Locutus D'Borg said:
Well, MagnaCut was considered really hot like a week ago. Now there is a new, trendy super steel, but I forget its name. No matter, though, it'll be considered too old in a month.
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Very true. Sometimes with all the steel bickering I feel like I'm sitting in Doyle Hargrave's living room...

 
The only S30V knife I have is a Yojumbo, and I figure it'll be a great steel, other than sharpening. The steel, that is, supposedly sharpening a straight Wharnie is easy. I bought a Tramontina sheepsfoot in preparation to sharpen this.
https://imgur.com/a/Wj0KSQx

I want to get S90V because I figure, what the hell, it'll be a pain to sharpen anyways, may as well get all the cutting I can. That logic kind of extends itself all the way through my super steel purchases, "I got this ZDP Endura for 150, what the hell, it'll need diamond anyhow, let me get some Maxamet". With the exception of some stuff like Cruwear which is supposed to be great to sharpen, or Vg-10 or BD1N, all of which I still call super. Blade profile goes a lot into stuff, too. I got a Chaparral today, dull, you can see light on edge. Still slices like it's sharp because of how dang thin it is.

I have, use, and intend to use, 440c, 420TY, 420HC, 1075, 1095, Victorinox steel, XC75 (Opi, Douk, Otter-Messer carbon) and 12c27, Tru-Sharp, 3cr (Spyderco), 5cr and 8cr, (really curious to see how quality heat treat 5cr sharpens up, lol, it's Cold Steel), Mora steels, Tramontina carbon, AUS-8 and 8a, AUS-10a, VG-10, BD1N, XHP, D2, Cruwear, Rex 45, S30V, S35VN, S45VN, Maxamet and getting even more! I love them all even if I don't know them all yet, gonna use them all for different purposes, just like I use my thin hollow grinds and thick saber grinds for different things.

I have no Bohler-Uddeholm, bring on a fixie in N690 for me! Bring on some K390 lightweights, bring on an M390 Microtech... Bring on some more German steel, some older Spydie steel, lemme try that ATS-34 and 55. I'm just excited for steel. I just think it's neat.
 
Locutus D'Borg said:
Well, MagnaCut was considered really hot like a week ago. Now there is a new, trendy super steel, but I forget its name. No matter, though, it'll be considered too old in a month.
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It's hardly out yet... I get what you're saying, but it's an exaggeration.
I remember thinking AUS-8 was a "super-steel", ordering an S30V PM2, and then just being tickled pink at the S45VN CQI that came. I wouldn't have scoffed at the S30, though, it's a marginal, but better, change.

Diminishing returns, and all that.
 
I love to see the continual advancement of steel composition and heat treatment specialised to the use of hand held knives! Like cars or planes, or computers they just get better, stronger and more effective as time and tech evolves, and specialised steel, gets cheaper and more available!
But!! a good machete/ thin bladed chopper out of somethin close to 1050-1060 vaguely near 50 to 60 rockwell has served people well for hundreds of years!
Kitchen or butcher knife of the same, let us step up out of the bronze age!.
Knives and steel get better exponentionally every year, as tech and communication gets better.
For most people, knowing how to use and sharpen a knife is more important!
Its a small community of "nuts" like us that care about carbide volume, grain structure, and alloy content...
A good design in a simple steel will serve most people well...everyone loves Scissors an SAK's
 
ex Vento said:
Hashishiin Hashishiin
Here you have something to read about S60V
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I’ve owned a Kershaw Random Task 440V for many years and ive always been disapointed with the edge holding. I believe Kershaw was one of the companies mentioned in that link that was running the steel soft, around 56rc, which would explain why it never performed well for me.
 
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