What's with the freezer?

J. Neilson

J. Neilson

Joined
Feb 6, 2001
Messages
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I'm confused about using a freezer at the end of heat treating. I've been using stainless almost exclusively lately, but I'm starting to use more high carbon (1095, 5160) since I'm hoping to start making damascus soon. For carbon steel I've been doing the triple edge quench in "Goddard's Goop" and the triple temper. What will putting the blades in the freezer after tempering do to improve the knife?I look forward to any help or opinions.:D

J. Neilson
www.mountainhollow.net
 
Probably not much. The temperature has to be a minimum of 100deg., below zeroF. That usually means liquid nitrogen. There are other chemical ways to get close, like acetone and dry ice, but I don't recommend them. I knew a guy who had to rebuild his shop and garage because of a fire resulting from the fumes. He was lucky enough not to get injured. :eek:
Some say that houshold freezer makes a difference, but I don't think so. JMO.
 
Some are using dry ice and kerosene for this and avoid the explosive fume issue. Acetone fumes are nasty!
 
The way I see it is that it can't hurt.

I knew and old machinist that swore he got more life out of cutting bits that he made by freezing the cutter in a snowbank after tempering.

My blades go in the freezer after the first temper overnight usually.
 
I had found that the blades I would do in the winter months were out performing the ones done in the summer.The only thing done differently was to let the blades cool to the temperature outside as that is were I have my smithy and it isn't heated.So when I would let the bles cool overnight after the quench and before the first temper cycle they would freeze.So I tried sticking them in the freezer during the summer "before" the first tempering cycle,and it worked,better performance..
I have seriously thought about trying the liquid nitrogen.But with young kids in the family,I decided that I didn't want any unhappy accidents.You know how kids are they can get into anything and I would hate it if they froze a habd or finger,I worry about them around the shop as it is don't get me wrong,but they have figured out that a fire is hot,They wouldn't understand about the liquid..
Bruce
 
Bruce,
I believe Ed Fowler had similar winter experiences. The closer we pay attention to variables and the more we test, the better.

John
 
I'm waiting for Ed Fowler or R. J. Martin to chime in here with their experiences. From all I've read, just about any steel that contains chrome benefits the most. Other steels, maybe the benefits are not that great, but I believe it helps. It certainly cant hurt.
 
I've been cryo-treating my own blades for over a year now with nothing but great results.With the 154-CM I use it makes a big difference.It gives my blades a level of flexibility that most folks don't think stainless is capable of. I wouldn't consider using stainless steel unless I could cryo-treat it. I store my liquid nitrogen in an International Cryogenics 20 ltr. dewar.The fellas at the welding supply place where I buy my L.N. are amazed at how efficient it is. It is also much safer than the dry ice and acetone method. If any of you guys are interested in having just one or two of your blades cryoed for testing purposes drop me a line. I'm sure we can work something out.
 
Where should a man start looking for a local source of liquid nitrogen, or dry ice for that matter? What temp. is liquid nitrogen and dry ice (solid-state carbon dioxide I think)??

Roger
 
I'm not sure what the temp of dry ice is, but the temp of dry ice + acetone is -108 deg F.
 
Centaur,

Then, according to what I have found by those that seem to know, dry ice in a bath is where you want to be; right? Minus 100 F. for 10 - 12 hr. is what I've been reading on this forum for cryo blades.

Kerosine is the medium I think I'll use for that. Now all I got to do is find a local source for dry ice.

In the mean time I will continue to place my blades in the kitchen freezer because of claims that it may help and no claims I have yet seen that it hurts.

Thanks to all.

Roger
 
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