Zpd-189

Orangeneck said:
It depends on the HT. It should be at least 64-66 as in the A.G. Russells Acies2. But the Al Mar Eagle HD Cutlery Shoppe Exclusive has the ZDP-189 at only Rc 57-59 (I assume its not a typo). I deleted it from the shopping cart after seeing this Rc.
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Of course every knife depends on the heat treat, but ZDP is special in that it is stable at that higher hardness. Most knives would be too brittle at that high of a hardness. Also, this is a Spyderco sub-forum, so all of this discussion has been centered around their hardness levels. I have know idea, but would not be surprised if ZDP is around 57 in its annealed state. I would say that is a typo as that would be an absolute waste.
 
nccole said:
...Also, this is a Spyderco sub-forum, so all of this discussion has been centered around their hardness levels. I have know idea, but would not be surprised if ZDP is around 57 in its annealed state. I would say that is a typo as that would be an absolute waste.
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I only used non-spydie examples as spyderco doesn't generally list the Rc of their knives. I agree that the lower Rc 57-59 values would be a waste, but would like to point out that sometimes the lower Rc values were found in higher end steels such as the S110V in the ZT 560CBCF due to their use of Cu-brazing in the composite blade.
 
Orangeneck said:
I only used non-spydie examples as spyderco doesn't generally list the Rc of their knives. I agree that the lower Rc 57-59 values would be a waste, but would like to point out that sometimes the lower Rc values were found in higher end steels such as the S110V in the ZT 560CBCF due to their use of Cu-brazing in the composite blade.
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No problems mentioning other knives, nobody gets all upset about it :) Just pointing it out that the discussion was assumed to be about Spyderco's, and some people do not always realize they clicked on a Spyderco sub-forum thread esp. if coming from the "what's new" page. I also kind of mentioned that because if Spyderco uses a higher end steel, they push the heat treat limit farther than any other production knife maker. Only custom makers push the limits more than Spyderco imo. Benchmade from what I have read is close with some of their M4 and M390. Alos, if that knife is made and heat treated in Japan like most Japanese steeled knives are, I would bet that is a typo and it is heat treated properly.
 
I think bm's first m4 runs were way softer until people started complaining, now they are supposedly right on level with spyderco. maybe a hair lower ;) :p

does zdp seem rarely used because they aren't willing to export, so only makers with factories in Japan are the only ones using it?
 
goodeyesniper said:
does zdp seem rarely used because they aren't willing to export, so only makers with factories in Japan are the only ones using it?
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That is my understanding, and also the Japanese are very proud, and see their steel as the best, and won't use a non-Japanese steel on a knife they make. You can find Japanese steels used on knives assembled in other countries, but very rarely.
 
The 1st Endura I got was back in 1992 and has served me very well with the ATS-55 blade steel , a few months ago I pulled the trigger on the Endura with ZDP as one of my EDC's . I can attest that Spyderco's ZDP is amazing steel and keeps a sharp edge for a very very long time and if sharpened properly can match the Rockstead ZDP very close for sharpness , which is very very sharp . Keep em sharp boys !!.
 
I just got a ZDP-189 stretch. It will be my new EDC. Why I waited so long to get a knife with ZDP-189 I'll never know
 
I have several William Henry B-15's and Spyderco Enduras with ZDP-189 blades. I haven't had to to bust out the diamond "stones" on any of them. The Vanadium Carbides in steels like S-30, S-60, S-90, S110, and S125 Rockwell at 82 on the C scale. Tungsten Carbide tool bits Rockwell at 72C. They can be sharpened easily on SiC (Caborundum) stones. Aluminum Oxide stones are harder than 67 HRC. If your ZDP knife takes a little longer to sharpen, rest assured that edge produced will last much longer.
 
I really have enjoyed my BRG Spyderco Stretch, in ZDP-189. it's held up to a myriad of task without being, chipped or anything like that, it's not something you want to drive screws, or pry with, but mine has displayed that it will hold a fine edge for some time, and a working edge for a very lengthy amount of time. I sharpen mine with a Lansky, and diamond hones. I sharpen it 20 degrees per side, with a hint of a 30 degree micro bevel. Works for me, but may be too thick for many. Not the most corrosion resistant steel I've used, it's actually forming a sort of light patina in some areas, and I personally think it's cool.

 
spyderco lover said:
Well zdp-189 is an incredible high performance steel. if you're thinking about it, just pull the trigger and thank me later. That being said, it is an EXTRAORDINARILY fine grained steel, always comes hair splicing sharp and can take a beyond scalpel sharp edge. Zdp is also the hardest knife steel period, I believe spyderco runs their around 65 RC but it can be taken up to 68 if I remember right. If you let it get dull (which would take forever) its a nightmare to reprofile and fully sharpen. That being said, if you touch it up continuously, strop it, and keep that hair splicing edge, it'll be by far the most insane steel you've ever experienced. I'm told its not as good as M390 or CTS-204p, however I cannot attest to that. Only other gripe I ever hear is some people saying their ZDP rusted due to its super crazy high carbon content. I've never had zdp rust but I'm careful with knives and oil them constantly
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I humbly beg to differ on the "always comes hair splicing sharp" bit. I got a delica in ZDP-189 a couple of years ago and it came dull as a butter knife. It was the only knife I've actually contacted the manufacturer to complain about. The response was basically tough, but they would be happy to charge me for sharpening the knife. I still love Spyderco's, but that piece of "customer service" still irritates me.

Kristopher
 
I have my ZDP Endura at 22/30. It gets sharp. :D

EDC4-12-13_zpsb6b41c74.jpg
 
What's the factory angle on the edge for the Caly 3.5 or the Dragonfly then? I'm wondering if I should be using the fine stone on the Sharpmaker at 30 or 40 to touch up?
 
The factory angle is set by hand to my knowledge. So every knife will be slightly different. I use the 40 for touch ups. What you end up with is a 40 microbevel because the vast majority of the time Spyderco's come steeper than 40. What I like to do is set a 30 degree edge with diamonds and then come back with the SM @ 40.
 
nccole said:
The factory angle is set by hand to my knowledge. So every knife will be slightly different. I use the 40 for touch ups. What you end up with is a 40 microbevel because the vast majority of the time Spyderco's come steeper than 40. What I like to do is set a 30 degree edge with diamonds and then come back with the SM @ 40.
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Thank you! I haven't touched the edges on any of my ZDP-189 folders yet but by the advice given I should really touch them up now rather than pay the piper later. Thanks again!
 
ZDP-189 isn't a nightmare to sharpen. It is just a very hard steel, so it takes more strokes to abrade the metal. Don't make the mistake of bearing down with more force - that will cause burrs and chipping. Just make twice the number of strokes you might use for the same knife in VG-10, and you are in the ballpark. A light touch and patience will pay off.

But ZDP does hold its edge for a long time. I have to sharpen mine half as often as many other S30v and VG-10 blades...

TedP
 
All this talk of ZDP blades is making me want to go out and get one!!! I've been sitting on the fence as I don't "need" one but who am I kidding, of course I need one. Hearing all of the experienced opinions here it certainly sounds like a steel you can't really go wrong with if you stay up on maintenance.
 
Hi Spyderco Lover,

Welcome to our forum and thanx for the interesting thread.

sal
 
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