Emerson Fit and Finish Addendum

E

Ernest Emerson

Joined
Apr 5, 1999
Messages
459
Dear Members,

It's interesting when a post seems to develop a life of its own. This post on fit and finish seems to be one of those.

I appreciate all the comments back and forth, some directed at me, both pro and con and some between members.

I would though, like to add the following regarding various comments on my connections and my direct involvement with the Government and the Special Operations Community. You may question why I feel the need to do this. And honestly I don't really need to. But, I'm a bit tired of individuals saying things like Emerson is full of Bullsh*t, or the accusatory nature of questioning of my comments regarding my knives and their regard in the community.

For those of you who have an axe to grind, an agenda, or dislike of me or my manner, I will say this; I’ve never said anything about anyone anonymously, in print or “behind someones back.” I don’t hide behind a screen name on any forum anywhere, in an attempt to hide my identity, my age, my affilations or opinions. If you ever hear me say “F~~k you,” you’ll know exactly who’s saying it and why. Those here that know me personally know these statements are true.

So for those of you who are honestly curious, I'll give you a brief on some history.

For almost 10 years I was the head instructor for a training company called GSGI-Global Studies Group International or (Incorporated) depending on the mask we were wearing at the time. The Company was founded by Harry H. (SEAL) and the chief Tactics and Firearms instructor, along with being my partner was, Dennis C. -Command Master Chief, Head of the Entire Navy SEAL BUD's training program – Plank owner ST6, Dev Gru, Red Cell etc. etc., along with a number of other "specialists" in Counter-terror activities.

I was during that same time, an instructor at Gunsight in the first edged weapons training program and was teaching with Chris C. - Plank owner ST6, Red Cell etc. etc. and Hershel Davis - UDT, SEAL, etc. etc. And for those of you who do not know, civilians were only one aspect of the training conducted at Gunsight at that time.

I was also contracted by Blackwater in the 90's to initiate an edged weapons and Hand to Hand training program. Interesting enough, Black Water was started by Eric P. - SEAL and the Director of Operations in charge of training was Gary J. - SEAL both of whom I have known and worked with for many years. At that time almost all trainees at Blackwater were military or Government personell.

And in addition to that, when a certain Government entity was hiring and training very special operators for very special and specific tasks through Blackwater, who do you think was the first and only edged weapons instructor that was called?

I have been a regular and welcomed visitor to NSWG headquarters in Coronado over the years and have been there dozens of times and have had the privilege of training at the base with Mike F. - SEAL who was the head of all hand-to-hand combat fighting courses at that time.

I've had the privilege and honor to share a beer with now Admiral Eric Olson at Mc P's, a time ago at a special event. Now Four Star Admiral Olson became the Commander of United States Special Operations Command, USSOCOM.

"Coincidentally", I have officially been at times contracted to teach classes at MacDill where SOCOM just happens to be located.

I am an official DoD contractor who has been contracted to several Navy SEAL Commands under Emerson Combat Systems, to teach courses of instruction on base (that's important) to the teams.

Our logo - the Emerson Bad Intent skull was and is to the best of my knowledge, the only civilian logo ever incorporated into a platoon patch. These were active duty SEALS on deployment in theater. Do you know what that alone says about the level of our involvement? No other knife Company; hell no other company has ever had that honor in any branch of the military.

For several years, every graduating BUD's class purchased Emerson knives with their class insignia and graduating class number engraved on the Blades.
In the very beginning of his company I got a call from Mike N. – SEAL asking me if I could get his stuff into Dev Gru through my friends. Mike was just starting Blackhawk. Fancy that, a former SEAL asking me to make the contact for him. Mike is still a close friend, I made the call.

I am personally invited to every SEAL team reunion both East and West Coasts every year.

I've been the guest of honor at the SHOT show dinners with dozens of SEAL's in attendance along with other "special" attendees in the crowd.

And I will also address some specifics that were brought up in the fit and finish posts.

It was actually, a SOAR pilot who cut himself out of the downed helo. I have a jacket given to me by him with my name embroidered on the name tag as a CWO, in appreciation. I don’t care if someone’s Dad didn’t know who I was. We’ve made plenty of knives for them over the years.

The dog used in the OBL take down was not just a Belgian Malinois. It was close to the breed but something distinct and a little different. I know some of the actual canine trainers.

My knives were definitely on board with operation Red Wing. Hell, I knew some of the operators in that tragic operation.

This is just the short list and there is more, a lot more and I could go on with this brief but I've got other things to do and frankly some of my involvement will never see the light of day.

And these little bits of information only cover my involvement with the Teams and not the Marines, Air Force the Army or any foreign entities.

So you see, I don’t just know a couple of SEALs or a couple of Marines, PJs or CAG guys. And, you can just call all this bragging. I don’t give a sh*t. No other knife company can do what we do and we’ve earned the right.

I know where I go, I do know where my knives go, and I know the guys who take them where they go. Emerson knives is not just some guy who had an interest in knives and started a company or some guy who inherited his Dad's Knife Company. There is no other knife company like us and I can truly say I practice what I preach.

Like it or not we’re doing just fine.

My Best Regards,

Ernest R. Emerson
 
Well said Mr. Emerson. I carry my Emerson with pride, not just because it is a bad ass knife; but because of the man behind the company, his experience, and the confidence that those who go in harms way have in your knives. Keep up the great work sir, jeff standerfer, springfield, Illinois.
 
Thanks for taking the time to address these concerns Mr. Emerson.

Unlike a lot of folks I care not as much, who has used these knives, but that they work for me.

Tostig
 
Pretty cool stuff. Thanks for the info. Definitely sets your knives apart. I am in the market for a CQC-15. Make them faster please.
 
Thank you for the reply Mr. Emerson. This explains everything.

However might I ask; will you ever make some more framelock knives like the HD-7 and Comrade Folder? If the prices were reasonable I sure as hell would pick up a couple.
 
Hear, hear! Make a Ti framelock, in S30V or S35V, wave opener, v-grind, with the usual blade shapes and handle offerings, and I'd buy one. But only if my SEAL buddies tell me it's cool. Relax, relax, just a little levity. :D I think we're all a little too serious about this fit/finish and where-my-knives-have-been thing.
 
Thankyou Mr. E for explaining your connections to our military and thank you for making cool folding knives. Now explain how you know that no other brands of knives were present at the missions described in your "Fit and Finish" post. Maybe you just got carried away in the moment. Some of your posts are out of the ordinary. Such as your post on your web site about the possibility of the Chinese attacking a U.S. aircraft carrier during the '08 Olympics. I believe you posted this under the section titled "The way I See It." I think that you are a contributing American and your admiration of our Navy personnel is very honorable. What you post though is a reflection of your character. Congratulations on your success and I hope to read your reply.
 
Dear Wunderbar,

Sorry if what I'm about to say seems abrupt, but I don't think you understand my position and what I do besides being the owner of a knife company. In fact, I usually don't respond to questions that are so easily vetted with just a little research by the one posing the query. I usually just leave them lay.

For example, there was a question, nay an attempted rebuttal, posed by one on this forum that was basically, "Aha! Zarqawi wasn't captured or taken alive, he was killed by bombs. See he's lying." When indeed, he was taken alive, dying in American hands. This information is not classified and only required a couple of internet clicks to verify, yet the haste to prove me wrong overtook the vetting process that is taught to every investigative journalist, every police officer and every intelligence operator from the beginning to the end of their service. Unfortunately, this happens often here and at times from those who come in, make one post, and are never heard from again.

When I am called to give a brief, a seminar, a lecture or write a paper on terrorism, counter-terrorism or the Muslim threat and its effect on U.S. Security, it's not because I've read a couple of Tom Clancy novels.

The threat during the 08 Olympics was very real indeed and was being gamed by the Pentagon, Rand and the CIA. The threat level was just below Defcon 4 anticipating that the Chinese would use the opportunity to attempt an invasion of Taiwan. Why do you think there was a battle group in the area? To protect against a terrorist bomber inside a foreign country - China?

Do you really think that my statements are just my opinions alone? Or do you think I pull this stuff out of thin air? Perhaps it would help you to understand my statements over the years if you watched the counter-terror lectures I gave at the BLADE Show this year. Albeit is a scrubbed version for a civilian audience, it may give a clue to my sources and background.

I can understand your uninformed naiveté on clandestine and security matters. I sometimes forget that some of my audience is not as informed as others.

However, I myself learned long ago not to ever, rebut, deny, accuse or make light of anyone's statements or opinions until I have armed myself with the proper background intel to confirm or deny those statements. It certainly can make someone feel good at the moment but as I've said before, in the eyes of those who are informed it just makes the accuser look very foolish. To respond to such easily vetted accusations is usually not quite worthwhile except that they are at times, accompanied by an overt or veiled character smear. In which case I may reply or may not.

My statements are never given lightly and they are not opinions unless I state them as so. And in that case, they are, informed opinions, based on either firsthand experience or thorough research and analysis of the subject matter.

I've had my life threatened on several occasions due to the subject matter and nature of my discourse.

I'm not talking about some internet guy threatening to "kick my ass", either but real credible threats to myself and those around me. In lieu of the seriousness of those incidents do you believe for even one moment that I would make statements about issues, subject matter that I cannot or will not stand behind?

Those that know of what I discuss, know. Those that don't know may question and those that are looking for some way to disparage me, my knives or the work that I do for "our side" will just continue to disparage, regardless of verification by myself or others.

My Best Regards,

Ernest R. Emerson
 
While I've learned a lot about special operations, I still confused about the fit and finish issue.
 
Dear Mr Emerson,

Sir, I have to say that almost a decade ago, we could not get your knives in South Africa. I used to at every available chance get on the net and look up your blades. I envied owning one of them, found the pics of the old fixed blades you made and stored them on my PC, I loved the persian and could never aquire one. I Still love them and it will always be one of my dream knives.

Time comes and goes Sir, and 2 years or so back I bought myself a PUK fixed blade and carried it wherever I could, in my front pocket, yes it did have a very bad handle which was about 1 mil plus off, but that did not bother me at the time- I felt that to have this blade of a poor fit and finish was not a big deal, even though I paid $280.00 retail for it in Cape Town.

I will tell you when my Defcon 4 came; When there was a little spat on a thread that you started regarding how people were complaining about the fit and finish of the Blades and how they were so well engineered, blah blah blah. Well, I took a good look at my overpriced tool and gave it to my brother, who now loves it and could not care for anything, but just to have a good tool that I gave him.

You see, I just cannot support a manufacturer who attacks and treats his customers with such disrespect. I still love that Persian which I will never see, But not a chance will I support a person who treats his customers this way. Honestly, just how many Secret Squirrel guys can you make knives for? Surely the larger buying populous is entitled to its opinions when they shell out their hard earned money to support an American Company? Do companies not treat their customers with respect, and are they not entitled to their complaints?

Still love that Persian, I just know that if one was available, I would not purchase it.

All the best,
Guy Vanderveken
 
tokerblue said:
- Couldn't it be something as simple as the SEAL saying something like "I only carry Emerson Knives"?

I'm not sure what other answer you would expect.
Click to expand...

Any SEAL involved in Neptune Spear is not going to say ANYTHING about it to anyone who is not properly cleared along with a bona fide need to know, or who is not a former member of Dev. Doing so would put their own and their families' lives at great risk and would break the oath they sign pledging to never reveal information that would jeopardize past or present members or missions. I can attest firsthand, they take this oath VERY seriously.

Now if EE has a clearance, he probably knows a lot more than he'll ever be able to acknowledge. Admittedly, I know very little about his background, so for all I know, maybe he has worked in that realm beyond just supplier and trainer. If he has, he'd be darned foolish to reveal it simply to settle some meaningless argument on a knife forum. But if in fact he has been an operator of some type, I'd tend to take his claims at face value. If not, I think it's just a little smart salesmanship on his part, although he's kinda gotten himself tangled up in unsupportable claims.

Disclaimer: I own and like one of his knives, but also had to tweak it a little to get it up to my own very high mall-ninja standards. :D
 
*sigh* The same stuff, over and over. Respectfully veiled insults and no answers to simple questions. Mr. Emerson, I think I can speak for most everyone here by saying we are thankful for your service and your dedication to the success of our armed forces. You have been described by those who know you personally as a respectful converser and an overall friendly person. Why can't you do that here?
 
Look at the risk of sounding like an asshole, people who arugue over the internet both end up being losers.

So to that I say, if like Mr.Emerson and his knives than cool buy'em and enjoy them if not than don't for whatever your reasons are its really that simple.

Also I'm aware I'm both fairly new here and not a modrater so if I'm out of line, which I probally am, sorry in advance.
 
When I saw this tread I thought it was about fit and finish?! I really don't care if the knifemaker have walked on his bear hands to the north pole or whatever. If customers have issues with fit and finish, why not apology and do something about it, and not rant about seals and blackwater wich to me seems to be the only sales argument, since fit and finish and steel issuses is blown away as nothing. The emerson is off my shortlist and on my tacticlool list from now on.
 
What matters to me is the knife that is in MY hands. No disrespect meant but I do not really care who else uses the knives or where they've been. That sounds like a sales
pitch to me.
 
KBar666 said:
Look at the risk of sounding like an asshole, people who arugue over the internet both end up being losers.

So to that I say, if like Mr.Emerson and his knives than cool buy'em and enjoy them if not than don't for whatever your reasons are its really that simple.

Also I'm aware I'm both fairly new here and not a modrater so if I'm out of line, which I probally am, sorry in advance.
Click to expand...

You're not being an A-hole or out of line, just speaking your opinion. That's what the forum is for. And you did it without any backhanded insults. Good for you.
 
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