A Long Due Update to a Favorite - Ontario Rat 1

entropy1049 said:
I recently (Black Friday) grabbed two Aus-8 RAT 1’s at KC for 49 bucks and change. This is what made the R1 a great option; Value.

At the new price, there are simply better options.

Feels like a misstep.
Click to expand...
Yup, I think I paid around $30 for mine in D2 steel…. And don’t tell anybody, but S35VN isn’t going to be a huge upgrade over the D2 unless you live on the ocean.
 
My Rat 1 (Aus8) is a work horse. It's been the designated kitchen folder for around six months now (to save the food prep knives from hacking packaging) and even my girlfriend has commented about how well it handles cardboard. It's rare for her to say much about my knives other than do you have a knife on you because she needs one (validation), I haven't seen that one before (dangerous waters ahead), and how many knives do you have? (threat detected!). The main reason I don't see myself buying one is because there are already a bunch of other knives I want to buy more.

They're going to sell a bunch of the upgraded Rat 1s though, because people have a fondness of the knife, coming from a lot of reliable use, and are going to look at it as the next logical step in getting a new knife. It'll be a I like my Rat 1, this is an even better version, therefore I will buy this.

51755094386_e5718acf32_b.jpg
 
The Grendels said:
My Rat 1 (Aus8) is a work horse. It's been the designated kitchen folder for around six months now (to save the food prep knives from hacking packaging) and even my girlfriend has commented about how well it handles cardboard. It's rare for her to say much about my knives other than do you have a knife on you because she needs one (validation), I haven't seen that one before (dangerous waters ahead), and how many knives do you have? (threat detected!). The main reason I don't see myself buying one is because there are already a bunch of other knives I want to buy more.

They're going to sell a bunch of the upgraded Rat 1s though, because people have a fondness of the knife, coming from a lot of reliable use, and are going to look at it as the next logical step in getting a new knife. It'll be a I like my Rat 1, this is an even better version, therefore I will buy this.

51755094386_e5718acf32_b.jpg
Click to expand...
Not likely.
 
Taking a step back and looking at it, the price is in line with some other Taiwan made offerings from USA-Based companies. I'm specifically thinking of Spartan Blades' Bronze grade folders in G10 and XHP, which are both within $10 of this price. It's also right between some of Spyderco's Taiwanese and Japanese offerings, with the FRN ones generally being cheaper, and the G10 ones being more expensive.

Ultimately, I stand by the assertion that this is not the screaming value proposition that the RAT line is known for, but it's not an obscene price. It doesn't interest me, but it might get a lot of people who want to "upgrade" to something familiar but nicer.
 
The price would have to be right for me, and that would be a substantial drop from MSRP. That said, The Rat is one of my favorites, and even though the Aus8 fills my needs, I still would consider an upgrade.
 
It was stated yesterday MSRP will be $135 and the street price has yet to be determined.In the KnifeCentre youtube clip featuring Ontario's 2023 knives.


 
Last edited:
On the plus side, you could probably use any of the many aftermarket scale options. On the minus, it stacks on top of the $135. 🤦‍♂️

dirc said:
I'd pay that much for a magnacut rat - not s35vn ;)
Click to expand...

To be fair, I'd be okay with $135 for MagnaCut, S45VN, or Elmax in a Rat 1 or 2.
 
Silent H said:
... the price is in line with some other Taiwan made offerings from USA-Based companies...
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, S35VN is bog-standard in premium Chinese knives and most comparisons between outsourcing to China versus Taiwan will be more about politics than any quality of the knives being made. (People wanting to discuss that stuff should check out the political forum here.) For other companies having knives made overseas, the Tenacious in S35VN is $108 and Kershaw has a few models in 20CV right around $100.

Outside of the Walmart knife counter, all the competition matters. Did you check out that list of Civivi knives in S35VN I posted? They've got more going on at significantly lower prices. There is just so much competition in S35VN and other decent steels at this level. There are even titanium frame locks in S35VN at this price.

In the meantime, you can always get an American-made Hogue Deka in MagnaCut for $135.
 
I'm happy with the aus8 nylon scaled ones for low 30s bucks. had no interest in the d2, g10, assisted ones. no interest in this new red s35vn one either, and especially at that price point.
 
Silent H said:
I'll let you answer your own question here.
Click to expand...

Chronovore said:
Unfortunately, S35VN is bog-standard in premium Chinese knives and most comparisons between outsourcing to China versus Taiwan will be more about politics than any quality of the knives being made. ... For other companies having knives made overseas, the Tenacious in S35VN is $108 and Kershaw has a few models in 20CV right around $100.

Outside of the Walmart knife counter, all the competition matters...

In the meantime, you can always get an American-made Hogue Deka in MagnaCut for $135.
Click to expand...

As I said, we can't ignore the Chinese competition or the American companies having their knives made in China.

Speaking of, do we know if Ontario will be making this knife in Taiwan or China?
 
something about the presentation or maybe it was the presenter seemed off to me (maybe its me though).


Not too impressed with the square tipped blade profiles too. Not a economics professional myself, and don't really understand marketing in the knife industry . . .but how can they do a nice frame lock folder or $16 and a similar sized and speed fixed blade for over $200?
 
Silent H said:
Their website, which is linked in the original post, says Taiwan. Hence why I compared the price to other knives made in Taiwan by USA based companies. Ya know, apples to apples.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I missed it. I remember some kerfuffle about some of the Onario Rat knives being made in China a few months back. I'd love to talk about whether a company's decision to make a knife in Outsourcing Destination X versus Outsourcing Destination Y, all while making various products in both X and Y, makes any kind of meaningful difference or brings any specific value to a knife. Unfortunately, I suspect most of the answers will involve politics and will therefore be out of bounds for this section of the forum. If anyone wants to talk about that, I'd invite them to join me in the political subforum.

Like I said in my previous post, it seems dubious to exclude Chinese or Chinese-made knives in evaluating the bang for the buck on this knife. That's the market in which this product was released and that's how I'm evaluating it.

Look, it's cool that they released another version of a classic product here. This knife could be just the ticket for some people, fans of the model, fans of the brand, people it rubs the right way, etc. I'm a fan of the original Rat but unfortunately, the price for what this is will keep it out of my pocket. Frankly, that rubs me the wrong way. It's not exactly the same but it's kind of like when Kershaw or CRKT releases a new knife with a cool design, but they use 8Cr13Mov, make it assisted, and put a $50+ price tag on it.
 
I agree with what was posted above.. I think it's cool that Ontario is offering this, and I'm sure it will be some people's jam who just love the Rat.

But I personally would have a hard time paying triple for the same knife just with upgraded materials, especially if the og knife was a budget blade to begin with..

Just as an example, I love the CJRB Pyrite, imo it's one of the best knives under $50 and that is exactly why I love it so much. BHQ has since released an upgraded Pyrite in s35vn and fat carbon for $200, cool knife yea, but completely defeats the point of what was so appealing about the knife to begin with.. for me anyway, ymmv.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top