A Walk Down Riot Street
- Thread starter D7reamers
- Start date
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- Aug 22, 1999
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- 90
Hit the gas and start running over people.
I'm serious. I read Lofty Wiseman's book SAS Urban Survival and he recommends staying in your car and riding it out. That's bull. We've all seen what cars look like after riots. You want to be in that car after that? I don't think so. When people have surrounded your car, are beating on the window, and start shaking it... turn the engine on, lay on the horn, and accelerate hard! Your life is in danger, and the police will be too busy to pull you over and arrest you. Then haul ass outta town.
If you are on your feet, get to higher ground such as trees, fire escapes, even lamp posts. If you're in a crowd that is running, run WITH the crowd instead of against them or you'll get trampled. Search for side alleys that aren't full of people (hiding in dumpsters in an alley might work).
-Travis
I'm serious. I read Lofty Wiseman's book SAS Urban Survival and he recommends staying in your car and riding it out. That's bull. We've all seen what cars look like after riots. You want to be in that car after that? I don't think so. When people have surrounded your car, are beating on the window, and start shaking it... turn the engine on, lay on the horn, and accelerate hard! Your life is in danger, and the police will be too busy to pull you over and arrest you. Then haul ass outta town.
If you are on your feet, get to higher ground such as trees, fire escapes, even lamp posts. If you're in a crowd that is running, run WITH the crowd instead of against them or you'll get trampled. Search for side alleys that aren't full of people (hiding in dumpsters in an alley might work).
-Travis
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- Sep 27, 2001
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Dont get into a situation that could get ugly. You may probably have some pre warning of conflict, keep your eyes open. For example everyone knew the QUebec riots were going to happen in 2001, i was there like a month before and already the police were putting in Grand Prix walls. Try to always plan how to get out of anywhere, for many situations like fire, terrorism, or natural disaster which probably have a higher chance of occurring.
Getting out, depends on wether you are in like a third world city or a first world city. In a first world city the police will respond pretty efficiently and in a third world city good luck!!!! Get out that 870 and a case of shells, you'll need them
.
Getting out, depends on wether you are in like a third world city or a first world city. In a first world city the police will respond pretty efficiently and in a third world city good luck!!!! Get out that 870 and a case of shells, you'll need them
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I love a lawless society, only the strong survive.
If you are serious about this question I will need some specifics because you are asking for a book.
If you are serious about this question I will need some specifics because you are asking for a book.
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In events such as these, you must "throw the law out the window." I would post warning signs around my perimeter and make a few improvised remotely detonated claymores in addition to "visiting" a few friends, one of whom works at a gun shop .
.Originally posted by solid_soldier
In events such as these, you must "throw the law out the window." I would post warning signs around my perimeter and make a few improvised remotely detonated claymores in addition to "visiting" a few friends, one of whom works at a gun shop
I can't tell if solid snake is seious or not, but if he is I must wonder whether he *wants* to go to jail.
There's a joke in Northern Ireland that in every riot there are is a group of politicians waiting with microphones waiting for the violence to abate so that they can get up on their soapboxes. Riots do stop, and when they do, the Police will use video footage and other methods to prosecute everyone they can. They don't take kindly to citizens setting up 'defensive perimeters' either.
Apologies to snake if he was joking.
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If the question is how to "escape it".......
IMHO: Navigate the crowd as best you can(mock your favorite NFL Runningback) , avoid the hottest spots and at all cost "get home to the wife and kids"!
If it is coming to you fast and traffic jams are making evacuation impossible, get the family on their Mountain Bike's and Get Out. The "VC" did wonders with'em. Let insurance take care of the rest.
$.02
IMHO: Navigate the crowd as best you can(mock your favorite NFL Runningback) , avoid the hottest spots and at all cost "get home to the wife and kids"!
If it is coming to you fast and traffic jams are making evacuation impossible, get the family on their Mountain Bike's and Get Out. The "VC" did wonders with'em. Let insurance take care of the rest.
$.02
Here is my $0.2 on the mater
1. remain indoors if you learn about any nearby rioting or civil unrest. If you hear gunfire or explosions tray to find out where it's coming from. Turn on the TV or radio fore latest updates
2. if you believe the crisis is threatening to your life plan to leave to city/state/country.
3. Determine the safest route to airport, embassy, police station and leave the building through any safe exit. Note before travelling to the airport make sure that it's open.
4. Exit in the opposite direction from gunfire or mobs. Use windows, vents, or roofs to escape undetected.
5. Escape as a group, hay you never know; teamwork is important it gives the enemy smoothing else to shoot at.
6. Dont run if you just slowly and casually walk out of the crowd you wont attract any attention. But if its an emergency RUN for your ****ing life!!!
7. If you travel by car be prepared fore evasive action. Drive on back streets not main roads. Remember your car is a 2,000 pound weapon. If a Molotov cocktail hits your car speed up it may burn out as you gain speed. Its also useful to pay a local to drive you if you dont know the aria that well.
8. If you run into a police roadblock bargain your way out.
9. Get to safety as soon as possible.
Note: if there is a danger of riots have a BOB handy.
1. remain indoors if you learn about any nearby rioting or civil unrest. If you hear gunfire or explosions tray to find out where it's coming from. Turn on the TV or radio fore latest updates
2. if you believe the crisis is threatening to your life plan to leave to city/state/country.
3. Determine the safest route to airport, embassy, police station and leave the building through any safe exit. Note before travelling to the airport make sure that it's open.
4. Exit in the opposite direction from gunfire or mobs. Use windows, vents, or roofs to escape undetected.
5. Escape as a group, hay you never know; teamwork is important it gives the enemy smoothing else to shoot at.
6. Dont run if you just slowly and casually walk out of the crowd you wont attract any attention. But if its an emergency RUN for your ****ing life!!!
7. If you travel by car be prepared fore evasive action. Drive on back streets not main roads. Remember your car is a 2,000 pound weapon. If a Molotov cocktail hits your car speed up it may burn out as you gain speed. Its also useful to pay a local to drive you if you dont know the aria that well.
8. If you run into a police roadblock bargain your way out.
9. Get to safety as soon as possible.
Note: if there is a danger of riots have a BOB handy.
CJ, is this comment made with scarcasm, or is this the way you will run this forum: "I love a lawless society, only the strong survive." ?
I guess that's a fine idea - if you are one of the strong. There are however, several people here that are in various states of frailty due to age or injury, and would probably not appreciate that attitude.
I guess that's a fine idea - if you are one of the strong. There are however, several people here that are in various states of frailty due to age or injury, and would probably not appreciate that attitude.
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The Urban Jungle may not be for everybody, but I see no reason for anyone to take tremendous personal offense at CJ's remark...after all, this forum IS about living in a Jungle!
As a Professional Warrior for the United States, and a Peace Officer for state and local entities, I'm sure it cannot be doubted that CJ has the credentials and experience which support a devout respect for people, property, and humanity...remarks off the cuff are not complete testimonials to someone's views or character, however salient they might be.
Let's keep this thread real my jungle friends...no need for a debate here.
Now....back to the RIOT about which this thread started.
As a Professional Warrior for the United States, and a Peace Officer for state and local entities, I'm sure it cannot be doubted that CJ has the credentials and experience which support a devout respect for people, property, and humanity...remarks off the cuff are not complete testimonials to someone's views or character, however salient they might be.
Let's keep this thread real my jungle friends...no need for a debate here.
Now....back to the RIOT about which this thread started.
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Slip: Yes, I was joking about the claymores, but I would still get a few guns for the members of my home.
Also, don't underestimate the diversion capacity of "safe and sane" fireworks.
Also, don't underestimate the diversion capacity of "safe and sane" fireworks.
Having just been IN a riot I have a few points I might add here. I should note that this riot was in Kosovo where I am presently employed and that a Special Police Unit (SPU) was on the scene BEFORE the riot started as it began as a large demonstration/protest which is often how these things get going. Second, I should note that I was there in a civilian capacity and have become the lead negotiator on the issue on which the protest was organized (and which led to the riot). At the time I was called to calm the crowd, but the riot erupted before I was able to speak. Even though I am in civilian gear I have military experience and 18 years in martial arts. My daily carry includes an Emerson Commander, A Spyderco Civilian and a 16" ASP baton - none of which I used during the riot. Due to my attempt to speak to the protestors I was less than two feet from the front line when the riot broke out - actually in front of the "breakers" for those who know about riot response procedures.
The first advice I have is know exactly where you are. If there are police or other "good guys" on the scene, try and get behind them and then continue out. The problem is that most people do not have anything that identifies them and it is just as likley that you will get conked by a police officer as the next guy... AS was mentioned earlier - go with the flow, whichever direction, until you can find a safe area or a viable exit.
Second, be aware of the changing feel of a crowd. if you can avoid the situation, great, don't be there. If you have no choice, like me, then know what is happening. Be aware of who is around you, where you can exit or move to and which directions are "no go" areas. Be aware of the people - some may have makeshift weapons and you don't want to be around them. You also may not want to stay around police as they are usually the targets of said weapons.
Third, move. A riot is constantly in flux. If you stand still you will be hit or trampled. Always keep moving and try and have some purpose or direction to your movement. Practice good evasion skills and try not to clash with people. If you do, work on your re-direction and move them out of the way. In my case I was able to deflect a few people and navigate myself behind the police lines and continued through til I was out of the clash. I then continued stright to my HQ.
Be prepared for major events such as the launching of tear gas, or explosions. If this is a real riot then it is likely that CS gas or perhaps on a lower level, pepper spray, will be used. It is also possible that some protestors may have explosive devices such as glass bombs or the classic "Malatov Cocktail". Be ready for this. Be aware of thigns coming your way - as I said, be aware of what is around you. Keeping your head down may protect your face, but it makes it difficult to see what is coming from above. Look up occassionally. Be prepared to deal with gross physical reactions to CS, or "tear" gas. Your eyes WILL water, you will likely vomit - it is not pleasant. The SPU who were present in the riot I was in launch CS as a standard first response when the situation passes a certain point. As I mentioned, I was in front of them - prime location for a nice dose of gas. It was nasty, but I kept moving and I was ready for it. I saw it coming and prepared. Covered my mouth and nose with a bandana and tried to sheild my eyes (didn't work so great) and I KEPT MOVING. Just like in many survival or defence situations - you have to move through the physical pain.
I suppose if you were in a car this would all be different, but many people will be caught in this type of thing on foot and I have to add that I am not sure how many people are willing to actually run over others in their flight. Just look at footage of the LA and other riots - it just doesn't work that way. What if there was a traffic jam? Maybe you would run people over, but if the ten cars in front of you and on the other side of the road would not then you are in trouble - and trapped.
Well, just my little bit of on-the-job learning to add to the rest. Looking forward to hearing more from others.
CJ, welcome to BLade Forums and let me compliment you on your choice of Forum - timely and useful, just what the doctor ordered. I'm looking forward to following this one. Let me narrow the field on this question for you, since I have no doubt that you could indeed write a book on it:
What would you do if you were in a position similar to mine. You are a civilian, for whatever reason you find yourself in the middle of a riot in a foreign city. Police and protestors are clashing. CS gas is being used. You have nothing identifying you as being with either "Side"... Looking forward to hearing from you.
The first advice I have is know exactly where you are. If there are police or other "good guys" on the scene, try and get behind them and then continue out. The problem is that most people do not have anything that identifies them and it is just as likley that you will get conked by a police officer as the next guy... AS was mentioned earlier - go with the flow, whichever direction, until you can find a safe area or a viable exit.
Second, be aware of the changing feel of a crowd. if you can avoid the situation, great, don't be there. If you have no choice, like me, then know what is happening. Be aware of who is around you, where you can exit or move to and which directions are "no go" areas. Be aware of the people - some may have makeshift weapons and you don't want to be around them. You also may not want to stay around police as they are usually the targets of said weapons.
Third, move. A riot is constantly in flux. If you stand still you will be hit or trampled. Always keep moving and try and have some purpose or direction to your movement. Practice good evasion skills and try not to clash with people. If you do, work on your re-direction and move them out of the way. In my case I was able to deflect a few people and navigate myself behind the police lines and continued through til I was out of the clash. I then continued stright to my HQ.
Be prepared for major events such as the launching of tear gas, or explosions. If this is a real riot then it is likely that CS gas or perhaps on a lower level, pepper spray, will be used. It is also possible that some protestors may have explosive devices such as glass bombs or the classic "Malatov Cocktail". Be ready for this. Be aware of thigns coming your way - as I said, be aware of what is around you. Keeping your head down may protect your face, but it makes it difficult to see what is coming from above. Look up occassionally. Be prepared to deal with gross physical reactions to CS, or "tear" gas. Your eyes WILL water, you will likely vomit - it is not pleasant. The SPU who were present in the riot I was in launch CS as a standard first response when the situation passes a certain point. As I mentioned, I was in front of them - prime location for a nice dose of gas. It was nasty, but I kept moving and I was ready for it. I saw it coming and prepared. Covered my mouth and nose with a bandana and tried to sheild my eyes (didn't work so great) and I KEPT MOVING. Just like in many survival or defence situations - you have to move through the physical pain.
I suppose if you were in a car this would all be different, but many people will be caught in this type of thing on foot and I have to add that I am not sure how many people are willing to actually run over others in their flight. Just look at footage of the LA and other riots - it just doesn't work that way. What if there was a traffic jam? Maybe you would run people over, but if the ten cars in front of you and on the other side of the road would not then you are in trouble - and trapped.
Well, just my little bit of on-the-job learning to add to the rest. Looking forward to hearing more from others.
CJ, welcome to BLade Forums and let me compliment you on your choice of Forum - timely and useful, just what the doctor ordered. I'm looking forward to following this one. Let me narrow the field on this question for you, since I have no doubt that you could indeed write a book on it:
What would you do if you were in a position similar to mine. You are a civilian, for whatever reason you find yourself in the middle of a riot in a foreign city. Police and protestors are clashing. CS gas is being used. You have nothing identifying you as being with either "Side"... Looking forward to hearing from you.
".....some of us may not be strong"
Is that to say that even though there are physical handicaps a person cannot be strong??? I find it refreshing to think that at some point in their lives, a human will actually have to prove why he believes he is the "King Of Beasts". It is said that what puts us ahead of the animals on the food chain is our intelligence. This is a unique strength. As anyone who has watched his videos, attended his classes or perhaps has been lucky enough to personally ask questions to Mr. Caracci, it is understood that "The mind controls the body, the body does NOT control the mind". I think this speaks volumes on what is truly meant by the words "only the strong survive".
And Thank you Mr. Prisco for putting us back on track, now back to the riot issue.......
Is that to say that even though there are physical handicaps a person cannot be strong??? I find it refreshing to think that at some point in their lives, a human will actually have to prove why he believes he is the "King Of Beasts". It is said that what puts us ahead of the animals on the food chain is our intelligence. This is a unique strength. As anyone who has watched his videos, attended his classes or perhaps has been lucky enough to personally ask questions to Mr. Caracci, it is understood that "The mind controls the body, the body does NOT control the mind". I think this speaks volumes on what is truly meant by the words "only the strong survive".
And Thank you Mr. Prisco for putting us back on track, now back to the riot issue.......
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Funny you should mention this, as CJ is preparing an explanation to this end, which will be posted quite soon...glad to see someone picked up on this automatically.
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- Sep 28, 2001
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- 84
WOW,
Lets all come down; can't we all just get along?
I will need you all to hang in there on this one because I plan to respond to most of you.
D7 First of all, I really did not take this question seriously, obviously others did. You see this is an extremely complex issue and truly requires a direction otherwise I could write volumes and would have to conduct some contemporary research and that could take years and result in hundreds of lives, total anarchy (Dogs and Cats sleeping together that sort of stuff).
OOPs there I go again, lighten up some of you.
Many of the people who commented constructively all had good advise for the most part but it really depends on your situation.
I have been in a few riots in south Florida, and handled other positions as a covert operative during some demonstrations and civil disobedience scenarios. I have lived and worked through several hurricanes and one flood, (our house had 11" of water on the second story) and we were lucky, we still had a house. I was loaned to Dade County in Miami during the Andrew hurricane and it was a pretty lawless state on all of these.
Most of these experiences were in official capacity, one; the flood was my house as a kid.
In another walk of life I had to get out of some countries that were closed down, so please, understand I could go a million ways here.
I do by the way perform better when all hell is breaking loose around me, frankly, I feel in my element in these environments.
This subject really is mostly common sense, although one issue that disturbs me is the Reginald Denning (the guy in the semi from the LA riot) proposed mentality, why would one stop, (TRAV mentioned something here I believe) because one would think they wouldn't bother me? I have done nothing wrong, I can reason with them. This is the same mentality that afflicts a lot of people; they think it isn't going to happen to them, WAKE UP!
On a slightly different note, how about the female jogger in NY (God Bless Her Heart), her life style was not going to be altered by crime so she was going to run in Central Park at night anyway.
She was savagely attacked!
Please, first know that it can happen to you and you cannot always reason with someone with a gun a psycho, if you know what I mean.
If any of you think this forum is about political correctness than I assure you, I will offend you sooner or later, and if you haven't caught on by now my world is about life and death. If you want to be the best warrior you can be, or if you want a leg up on survival hang in there.
If you are looking to read some flowered up crap that says everything is ok, it's not going to happen here, don't waste my or your time.
Some four years ago I was approached by NorthWest Airlines to train their people in how to handle unruly passengers. After I created an outline and explained my position, they felt it best to have their in house SWAT team instruct it, and probably with my outline. Why? Because there was a negative stigma attached to having someone with my background (SEAL) train their people.
What do you think they are thinking now?
Your mind set is critical. The limitations of the body are far to widely known but who can say what the limits to the mind are!
In reference to RHs weak and handicapped statement.
I have trained people of all ages and many handicapped people as well, none of them would refer to themselves as such, but they and I would like you all to know that, "STRENGTH IS NOT PHYSICAL, IT IS A STATE OF MIND." Forgetting that suggest that one has already lost the battle.
Now back to the subject.
I don't believe this is all going to go away. We as a nation will live with these new threats like everyone else have. Let's be realistic the Israelis have been pounding the Palestinians for years and where has it got them.
The first thing you must do is PLAN AHEAD. This is one of my main fundamentals in anything. The "survivor" man gave you a go by list, keep it along those lines but just think about what you need to accomplish. I for one, just do not like to hang in crowds, even when I am providing security for someone I will always keep them away from popular areas whether they are a celebrity or not.
I try to always be aware of exits and alternatives. One must know where you are going and where you came from in the likely hood of any problems. When I am even remotely concerned of such an issue I don't wonder if it is going to happen I wonder when it is going to happen.
As Joe citizen, you may not have the hooks (friends) that I do, but you can look up the State Department web site for travel advisories, etc. on your own.
Someone mentioned driving and in all seriousness, this is an art and more important than shooting a gun, is learning how to drive through these type of situations.
Worst Case scenario for this one is the book "Black Hawk Down", they don't spell out the driving so much but believe me, that was a riot (to the infinity power), and the book is very close to how it happened. I had some strong contacts with the people that were there.
The list certainly goes on, give me specifics and it will be easier for me to answer them.
Lets all come down; can't we all just get along?
I will need you all to hang in there on this one because I plan to respond to most of you.
D7 First of all, I really did not take this question seriously, obviously others did. You see this is an extremely complex issue and truly requires a direction otherwise I could write volumes and would have to conduct some contemporary research and that could take years and result in hundreds of lives, total anarchy (Dogs and Cats sleeping together that sort of stuff).
OOPs there I go again, lighten up some of you.
Many of the people who commented constructively all had good advise for the most part but it really depends on your situation.
I have been in a few riots in south Florida, and handled other positions as a covert operative during some demonstrations and civil disobedience scenarios. I have lived and worked through several hurricanes and one flood, (our house had 11" of water on the second story) and we were lucky, we still had a house. I was loaned to Dade County in Miami during the Andrew hurricane and it was a pretty lawless state on all of these.
Most of these experiences were in official capacity, one; the flood was my house as a kid.
In another walk of life I had to get out of some countries that were closed down, so please, understand I could go a million ways here.
I do by the way perform better when all hell is breaking loose around me, frankly, I feel in my element in these environments.
This subject really is mostly common sense, although one issue that disturbs me is the Reginald Denning (the guy in the semi from the LA riot) proposed mentality, why would one stop, (TRAV mentioned something here I believe) because one would think they wouldn't bother me? I have done nothing wrong, I can reason with them. This is the same mentality that afflicts a lot of people; they think it isn't going to happen to them, WAKE UP!
On a slightly different note, how about the female jogger in NY (God Bless Her Heart), her life style was not going to be altered by crime so she was going to run in Central Park at night anyway.
She was savagely attacked!
Please, first know that it can happen to you and you cannot always reason with someone with a gun a psycho, if you know what I mean.
If any of you think this forum is about political correctness than I assure you, I will offend you sooner or later, and if you haven't caught on by now my world is about life and death. If you want to be the best warrior you can be, or if you want a leg up on survival hang in there.
If you are looking to read some flowered up crap that says everything is ok, it's not going to happen here, don't waste my or your time.
Some four years ago I was approached by NorthWest Airlines to train their people in how to handle unruly passengers. After I created an outline and explained my position, they felt it best to have their in house SWAT team instruct it, and probably with my outline. Why? Because there was a negative stigma attached to having someone with my background (SEAL) train their people.
What do you think they are thinking now?
Your mind set is critical. The limitations of the body are far to widely known but who can say what the limits to the mind are!
In reference to RHs weak and handicapped statement.
I have trained people of all ages and many handicapped people as well, none of them would refer to themselves as such, but they and I would like you all to know that, "STRENGTH IS NOT PHYSICAL, IT IS A STATE OF MIND." Forgetting that suggest that one has already lost the battle.
Now back to the subject.
I don't believe this is all going to go away. We as a nation will live with these new threats like everyone else have. Let's be realistic the Israelis have been pounding the Palestinians for years and where has it got them.
The first thing you must do is PLAN AHEAD. This is one of my main fundamentals in anything. The "survivor" man gave you a go by list, keep it along those lines but just think about what you need to accomplish. I for one, just do not like to hang in crowds, even when I am providing security for someone I will always keep them away from popular areas whether they are a celebrity or not.
I try to always be aware of exits and alternatives. One must know where you are going and where you came from in the likely hood of any problems. When I am even remotely concerned of such an issue I don't wonder if it is going to happen I wonder when it is going to happen.
As Joe citizen, you may not have the hooks (friends) that I do, but you can look up the State Department web site for travel advisories, etc. on your own.
Someone mentioned driving and in all seriousness, this is an art and more important than shooting a gun, is learning how to drive through these type of situations.
Worst Case scenario for this one is the book "Black Hawk Down", they don't spell out the driving so much but believe me, that was a riot (to the infinity power), and the book is very close to how it happened. I had some strong contacts with the people that were there.
The list certainly goes on, give me specifics and it will be easier for me to answer them.
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2001
- Messages
- 850
I think they are mumbling, "stuipit, stuipit, stuipit" while banging their heads against a wall.
Okay, I'll talk about certain types of riots I know of and how they are started.
- How do you survive a violent race riot, like an L.A. riot?
- Major Natrual Disaters riots. What do you need to prepare for one? How do you survive one if caught going back and forth to work without a BOB?(Tornados are common around where I live)
- Sport and Concert Riots. What do you do if your caught in a crowd gone bad and you not allowed to have anything on you at these places?