"Carl's Lounge" (Off-Topic Discussion, Traditional Knife "Tales & Vignettes")

Headwinds said:
Gary - I was hoping you would join in, given that math is your field of expertise. I find the errors in basic arithmetic to be the most puzzling aspect of the whole situation, as in the second solution I was given - "Therefore, a 7-foot piece would weigh 7 * 5 = 41.7 pounds." :rolleyes:
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I agree that AI making these simple errors is puzzling. We've had technology available for years that can accurately count stuff and carry out precise calculations. Part of "HI" (human intelligence) is knowing when and how to take advantage of tools and resources that can perform certain tasks better (faster, more accurately, cheaper, etc.) than a human can. So I'd think the AI "machines" might be trained to find resources that are specifically designed to do specific parts of whatever the AI is trying to do. For example, there are all kinds of "letter frequency" apps online that ChatGPT could have consulted to count letters much more accurately than ChatGPT can apparently do it. Similarly, seems like the designers of ChatGPT must be aware that it's not a reliable arithmetic calculator, and they'd build in some "look-up routine" ChatGPT could use to outsource calculations to a reliable calculator app.

- GT
 
5K Qs said:
I agree that AI making these simple errors is puzzling. We've had technology available for years that can accurately count stuff and carry out precise calculations. Part of "HI" (human intelligence) is knowing when and how to take advantage of tools and resources that can perform certain tasks better (faster, more accurately, cheaper, etc.) than a human can. So I'd think the AI "machines" might be trained to find resources that are specifically designed to do specific parts of whatever the AI is trying to do. For example, there are all kinds of "letter frequency" apps online that ChatGPT could have consulted to count letters much more accurately than ChatGPT can apparently do it. Similarly, seems like the designers of ChatGPT must be aware that it's not a reliable arithmetic calculator, and they'd build in some "look-up routine" ChatGPT could use to outsource calculations to a reliable calculator app.

- GT
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Choosing the right approach to solve any given problem would require an enormous jump beyond where AI is right now. If you ask ChatGPT a question about some calculation (like the weight of 2x12s) it may tell you how it is going to solve it, and then give you an answer, but those two items (method and solution) are not necessarily related. A Large Language Model (LLM) like ChatGPT is not doing the math, it's trying to put words in a row in a way that matches the kinds of patterns it was trained on. It has much more in common with Autocorrect than it does with a calculator. It does not understand what the words "mean", and no one really knows how to quantify understanding and somehow get an LLM to incorporate understanding. But without understanding, there isn't a clear path to having an LLM split off queries to use different tools (like a board-foot calculator) to compile answers.
 
5K Qs said:
These examples don't make me feel very confident about corporate America rushing to adopt AI to improve the performance of many tasks required in their specific areas! :eek:

- GT
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Join the club. The decision makers in those publicly traded corporations primarily have a finance background. They lack the knowledge to actually evaluate whether some new technology will benefit their company. There is a lot of "monkey see, monkey do" in corporate America. "That other company is doing it, so it must be the correct thing to do." This is further driven by the fact that the corporations are judged on their performance by stock analysts, who are even less technically competent to make decisions on what is good for a company than the people who run the corporation. They merely evaluate certain markers. And said markers may, or may not actually indicate whether a corporation is making wise decisions.

But I'm not bitter.

waynorth said:
Board feet are measured nominally (rough dimensions, before machining smooth), not by actual size!!
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Right you are, sir. My father spent a goodly number of years in the lumber industry.
 
Tyson A Wright said:
Choosing the right approach to solve any given problem would require an enormous jump beyond where AI is right now. If you ask ChatGPT a question about some calculation (like the weight of 2x12s) it may tell you how it is going to solve it, and then give you an answer, but those two items (method and solution) are not necessarily related. A Large Language Model (LLM) like ChatGPT is not doing the math, it's trying to put words in a row in a way that matches the kinds of patterns it was trained on. It has much more in common with Autocorrect than it does with a calculator. It does not understand what the words "mean", and no one really knows how to quantify understanding and somehow get an LLM to incorporate understanding. But without understanding, there isn't a clear path to having an LLM split off queries to use different tools (like a board-foot calculator) to compile answers.
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You SOUND like you know what you’re talking about, but how do I know you’re not a ROBOT??? 🤣🤣

That is actually very helpful, though, and will save me wasting time attempting to make AI do things it just can’t.

I also asked AI how AI could be useful in my profession, and the only realistic things it returned were things software companies are already including in their products, with varying degrees of success. For me as an end-user there wasn’t anything really.
 
Rather than ask a robot, I place my trust in the knife community!! If anyone can help, I would appreciate it!! I have been trying to find a title for the (upswept drop-point) blade in this Russel, and Evan's renditions of it!! One person called it a "veterinary" blade, but with no published back-up reference!!!
If anyone can help me find an established name or description, I'd be grateful!!two Barlows 1.jpgCurved Barlows 4.jpgCurved Barlows 3.jpg
 
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black mamba said:
Charlie, I would call it a trailing point skinner, because the tip is higher than the spine and the belly is tight for skinning.
It would make a terrific caping knife for precision skinning of hunting trophies.
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Trailing point skinner!! I like that one, Jeff, thanks!! I can visualize it working, making long, careful cuts!!
Maybe you or I will have to publish it and christen (or rechristen!) it!!! 😁
 
Just Tom. said:
ChatGPT in particular regularly hoses basic math, so your results don’t surprise me at all.

This is long, so no harm in ignoring it unless you are interested in this topic:

At work we are being encouraged to experiment with ways to use AI to increase efficiency or at least automate some tasks where it makes sense to, while maintaining a healthy skepticism about the quality and accuracy of its output

I tried to get it to write a calculator program to perform some pretty simple geodetic computations, and it failed miserably, even after many attempts and much refining of the prompt. I even specified which web page to get the equations from, and that no, it did NOT need to convert degrees to radians first.

I gave up on that, and tried to get it to convert state plane coordinates to latitude and longitude and plot them in google earth. That seemed to work a little better - until it didn’t. Using the exact same prompt, in which units and coordinate system and coordinate file format were all clearly spelled out, it decided randomly that my points were several hundred miles to the west.

Ok, let’s try to get it to do some simple text file manipulation. Extract some data from long GPS data files and their corresponding processing reports and print a summary. My very specific prompt included the instruction to convert the (metric) orthometric height to US Survey feet using the formula “meters x 39.37 / 12”. Bogus results, but close enough to be believable at first glance. Ok, then “multiply the orthometric height by 39.37, then divide the result by 12”. Still bogus results - or at least mostly, with the occasional correct answer thrown in to keep you off guard. How can it get basic math wrong?

It did work pretty well making goofy pictures of coworkers, though.
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We've tried and tried to use it in our business to help out with monotonous tasks. It seems, at least for my company, we spent so much time hand-holding and correcting and retraining, that eventually it was cheaper/faster/easier to have one of our programmers create a custom Python script to do the job. In my experience, AI still has a long way to go before it is truly useful. Right now it's a great novelty for entertainment.
 
Seeing as how theres not going to be a😒😟😭 tube label this year...This looks like a golden opportunity for some Meako's Porchy Nonsense....although as usual I might be on to something with a skerrick of truth.
Recently uneathed parchments have revealed some compelling documentation regarding the merrie olde mediaeval Battle of Porchenberg .There were two main protagonists ...traditional enemies...Barlowshire and Ettrick Vally.
For years the neighbouring communities of simple cutlerfolk waged a tit for tat conflict of longwinded arguments and large hand gestures from the opposing banks of The River Etlow...meanwhile in the villages the orphans starved merrily in the gutters and traditions swung gaily from the gibbets, their crowpecked corpses strung up because sadly nobody had time anymore.
Barlowshire was famous for its Barlow knife and likewise for The Ettrick knife of Ettrick Valley. Meanwhile from the battlements of crumbling, raindrenched, storm lashed Porchenberg Castle...eyes were upon them . Dr.Nordweg retired to his hissing ,fizzling,sparking,gurgling laboratory.
A particularly loud thunderclap and lightning flash lit the tower and for a moment the miserable freezing Porchenberg clodhoppers stood in awe...their jaws agape...unable to comprehend their vision...dumbfounded
( a bit like the scene in Quest For Fire when Dawn Chong shows the trogs how to light a fire)...more lightning flashes showed the delerious Dr Nordweg astride the crenellations ...brandished high in his hand ...a pocketknife!

"Behold my creation Porchenberg! " cried Nordweg ,
"You will all live in peace...With This...
......."The Bartrick"."

At the storms height a final fork of lightning blasted the castle into ruins.Nordweg and his Bartrick disappeared through a trapdoor...and were never seen of again......Until now.
The Bartrick .
It has aspects of both Barlow and Ettrick.
Cheers.
 
meako said:
Seeing as how theres not going to be a😒😟😭 tube label this year...
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Every year I ask what time of last year the forum knife was finally announced, and every year I forget.
But that's nothing; yesterday I forgot to put the carafe in the coffee maker before turning it on.
Thanks to my cat-like reflexes, only a half cup or so was lost.
 
r8shell said:
I'ma buy an Opinel and put 2025 on it with a wood burner.
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Opinel will be happy to do that for you. ;)

Here's an Opinel pruner I had custom imprinted a few years ago for a friend of mine who was retiring. He owned a winery on the side that he called "Spanish Peacock" and was of Mexican descent. I had the handle engraved by Opinel with "Boss Peacock" in Spanish. It came out very nice. He loved it.
uaD5XkO.jpeg
 
knarfeng said:
Opinel will be happy to do that for you. ;)

Here's an Opinel pruner I had custom imprinted a few years ago for a friend of mine who was retiring. He owned a winery on the side that he called "Spanish Peacock" and was of Mexican descent. I had the handle engraved by Opinel with "Boss Peacock" in Spanish. It came out very nice. He loved it.
uaD5XkO.jpeg
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That Pruner is cool. I'm tempted to go with the Mushroom knife, just to have something really different.
 
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