Custom Knife Orders that NEVER Appear?

Thank you to all of you veterans adding input, this has been the trickiest part of how to go about business, I dont know that I would have even been off the ground without all the wisdom being shared here.
I have settled on a wait list of names only. That way price/materials/design only need to be discussed once the knife is ready to be started and I try to deliver within 6 months. Especially with kitchen knives, it seems that trends come and go very quickly, I cant stay relevant if I am building what people wanted a year or two ago.
 
Don Hanson III said:
Hi Win, I like to hear from clients occasionally and in the case where I lost so many contacts with the computer crash, those who contacted me got their knives. Communication is key here and goes both ways.
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I have followed up, like when I was moving in 2005, I called all the makers I actually thought might deliver. I think maybe one came back to me. These include some fairly famous makers, ABS and Guild. I've had makers that wanted written confirmation, like Bob Loveless, you ordered, sent a letter and a year or so later you had your knife. It's not my job as a customer to baby sit an order, I'm active in the community and would hear if some tragedy or other event effected a makers ability to deliver.
 
Win Heger said:
I have followed up, like when I was moving in 2005, I called all the makers I actually thought might deliver. I think maybe one came back to me. These include some fairly famous makers, ABS and Guild. I've had makers that wanted written confirmation, like Bob Loveless, you ordered, sent a letter and a year or so later you had your knife. It's not my job as a customer to baby sit an order, I'm active in the community and would hear if some tragedy or other event effected a makers ability to deliver.
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Win, I sure do understand where your coming from.
There really is no good excuse for bad communication from either side.
 
Only buy knives from the makers table, among the selections that he brings to a show to sell and you won't ever have this problem.
 
2knife said:
Only buy knives from the makers table, among the selections that he brings to a show to sell and you won't ever have this problem.
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yeah, if you want to quadruple, (or more) the price! It's not cheap for someone like myself to get anywhere near most of the makers I'd like to deal with, especially for those who are located on other continents
 
2knife said:
Only buy knives from the makers table, among the selections that he brings to a show to sell and you won't ever have this problem.
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I know some collectors would hate to give up ordering knives from their favorite makers, me included. Besides, some collectors have very keen design skills and them partnering with
talented knifemakers can result in REALLY SPECIAL knives.
 
Several years ago a maker here mentioned an idea that I thought sounded like a nice compromise. He had a page on his website titled "ideas seeking a patron" or something to that effect. In other words, he had a couple design ideas he was kicking around at any given time, and posted a rough sketch on that page. He would not necessarily take a firm order from somebody, but maybe it would be easier to decide which one to build next, by gauging the level of interest.
 
I feel like I should chime in here as well, just because I've also fallen behind. I have a few orders that are now years past my original estimated delivery date and I feel absolutely terrible about it. The primary problem for me is that I've failed more than once now to build in a proper cushion for all the unforeseen issues that inevitably pop up. I've probably also overestimated my ability to recover from these setbacks. As has already been mentioned, in a one man shop there's no one to cover for you when you're sick or get called away, and there's no one to help you when you hit a dead end.

Moving to Germany was a much bigger deal for me than I'd expected. I basically had to start over from scratch; new tools, new machines, new steels, suppliers, etc. and all in a different language. Seriously try finding a good epoxy in a non-native tongue. Heck it took me months just to find a decent grinder, and several more months to find a guy who would make cubitron grinding belts in the right size for it! I bought my hydraulic press from a couple of Italian engineers at a knife show in Belgium, negotiated the price in French and English, and delivered it back to Germany two days later. I bought my heat treat oven in the Netherlands, my forge came from Slovenia I think, and it sucks... I need to build a new one already.... then I got a weird batch of steel that liked to microfracture when quenched in my fast oil but only revealed its issues at about 400 grit after I'd already forged, ground, heat treated and polished out four large blades...

And then I got dysentery! Gah!

But these are excuses, and no matter how valid they may be, no one likes to hear them!

So I put my nose to the grindstone and work on it, and if I've exceeded my delivery time, I try my best to also exceed expectations. Latest knife out of my shop had a bunch of free upgrades and the customer told me it was worth the wait. "Better than I could have imagined" were his words. That's about the best I can hope for, and I'm grateful for his patience. Truly.

As has also been duly mentioned, communication is key. For so many of us, the most rewarding part of this journey is the relationships we make along the way, and communication is an important part of any relationship. If you're a customer and you haven't heard from the maker in a while, send an email. If he's missed his estimated delivery date you're due an explanation at the very least. If your circumstances or tastes have changed, you're also well within your right to cancel the order. No harm, no foul. In the end, all we can really hope for is that both parties come out of the experience happy.

And yeah, no deposits :)
 
SharpByCoop said:
Regarding Shows:

I learned long ago, that Shows are a necessary inclusion for the maker's promotion and extended viability. If you want this maker to survive, you need to allow this.

Every single one of us knows the value of actually handling a knife, and actually shaking a hand, and how that impacts (most effectively!) the experience.

It's hard for a maker to do both: create a small tableful of clever knives for immediate sale, and to have to tell his client his 'special order' is still pending.

A savvy maker should/can/ought to address this in his communication. And.... the savvy maker can use these knives as a means of exploration. Here's a knife I wanted to make, with new techniques, and it's up for grabs.

This also gives the SHOW the importance: Be there, and you may jump ahead five squares with a completed piece. :thumbup:

A table full of business cards is disappointing. :(

(While you are there don't let that one-of-a-kind knife get sold without a *pro photo*.... ;))
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Kevin Jones said:
Perhaps not from a legal perspective, however when a knifemaker takes an order he/she is basically giving their word or making a promise to the collector. So from a moral perspective they owe the collector a knife.



I don't think so Erik, as taking/delivering orders is a totally different aspect of your business than building knives for a show. I expect most knifemakers (especially full-timers) need income from both to keep their
businesses healthy.
By starting this thread, I'm certainly not suggesting that knifemakers stop taking orders, just that they should try to manage their order lists in a manner that allows them to fulfill their commitments.
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That is what I think. As long as I deliver fairly close to my promised time of delivery there should be no problem.
 
I've had two computers crash....fortunately there were 3 lessons learned from the first
one.....1) TRUST PAPER, 2) get ALTERNATE CONTACT INFO, &3) BACK UP TO a REMOTE DRIVE.

Today, all orders are logged on a 5 X 7 card with dates, preferences, and multiple contact info,
in addition to any other pertinent info.....makes things easier/simpler all the way around...
 
Computers crashing? Lost contacts? Lost files?

I have anticipated this for ten years. I've left 'backup hard drives' in their cartons, and opted for automatic cloud-based storage. (Carbonite: for $60 per year, I have 260 GB out there as I write. I signal which areas get backed up and every change I make it does so on it's own.)

(When my house burns down what good is my second hard drive?)

I use the MS Outlook email contacts program on my Mac. Files are saved locally. However, I also have a Gmail account and that saves EVERYTHING out there, even if I so rarely use it. You can save tens of thousands of text emails for free. You can direct ANY email to your gmail account. My SharpByCoop.com emails go there, too.

Your computer can crash (And then burn your house down, LOL!) Don't be caught with a computer ruining your books. Have a Plan B. Or Plan 'G'.
 
SharpByCoop said:
Computers crashing? Lost contacts? Lost files?

I have anticipated this for ten years. I've left 'backup hard drives' in their cartons, and opted for automatic cloud-based storage. (Carbonite: for $60 per year, I have 260 GB out there as I write. I signal which areas get backed up and every change I make it does so on it's own.)

(When my house burns down what good is my second hard drive?)

I use the MS Outlook email contacts program on my Mac. Files are saved locally. However, I also have a Gmail account and that saves EVERYTHING out there, even if I so rarely use it. You can save tens of thousands of text emails for free. You can direct ANY email to your gmail account. My SharpByCoop.com emails go there, too.

Your computer can crash (And then burn your house down, LOL!) Don't be caught with a computer ruining your books. Have a Plan B. Or Plan 'G'.
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Bingo, the cloud is the way.

Old timers and their back up drives :)
 
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My favorite customs are pieces I helped with

My recent Ko Wak from Mirabile

The Wheeler/Paranee Fighting Bowies

The Knight Khuks

The Hartsfield Katanas made to my specs

Just to name a few

I would hate to just by knives from dealers or from their tables
 
Cool thread, and very relevant. Just to add another data point to the spread, I am a part time maker, approximately 30 knives a year, I take orders but have closed my books anticipating a move at the end of the year. No shows as of yet, I take deposits and never had a complaint, patrons always give thoroughly satisfied feedback, and have been blessed to have a longest overdue order of only a month, granted I have not been in the game nearly as long as most. I have a solid schedule worked out with a dealer/purveyor and am able to keep with it alongside my direct orders. The only knife I have made that wasn't an order was just finished last week and has been a hunter that started in the summer of 16 and has inched along in my scraps of free time.

Been thinking about this topic recently, and thinking of scaling back my orders to less than 10 a year. Having a long wait list does absolutely take some of the love out of it, but it is a curse and a blessing. I cant bring myself to complain about having work when some folks cant sell anything.

Keeping track of the orders and maintaining that communication as being part of the gig is what I thought was common sense, and until now hadnt really heard of folks not receiving orders, but life can definitely get in the way. For now, though, as a supplementary income, the order side of knife making is more work than i'd care for, but if I were to go full time, I wouldnt hesitate to continue to take orders. Probably the best idea i've heard is to just take a name and then contact a month before the order arrives at the top of the que.

Thanks for the thread. I'll follow up on future comments if I have time and think of it.
 
The answer to almost every problem I've had with keeping track of orders and work flow in general, is a gigantic dry erase board on my shop wall. :D
 
JParanee said:
My favorite customs are pieces I helped with

My recent Ko Wak from Mirabile

The Wheeler/Paranee Fighting Bowies

The Knight Khuks

The Hartsfield Katanas made to my specs

Just to name a few

I would hate to just buy knives from dealers or from their tables
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I could not agree more! :)
 
JParanee said:
My favorite customs are pieces I helped with

My recent Ko Wak from Mirabile

The Wheeler/Paranee Fighting Bowies

The Knight Khuks

The Hartsfield Katanas made to my specs

Just to name a few

I would hate to just by knives from dealers or from their tables
Click to expand...

Thereally are probably thousands of us who read your threads who would also hate that.
 
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