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Issue with member “Archer59”

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BM-EDC

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I recently liquidated my Benchmade collection, and sold a knife to member “Archer59.” That is his name here according to his email. All of our comms took place through email, so I don’t know if that is true or not.

The short of it is that I am being accused of knowingly selling a defective knife as sealed NIB. He is demanding a refund and making other threats.

I purchased a 417gy-1901 from a large retailer. I liquidated my collection within a week or so of receiving this knife and never opened it. Some here, the rest on eBay.

I never opened the knife and it was factory sealed. I listed it that way, with pictures and sold it to “Archer59” somewhere outside the US through a third party, who I sent it to stateside who then forwarded it to “Archer”.

Here is my listing with description and pictures.

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/10-benchmades-le-ritters-users-free-stuff.1651628/#post-18893497

Apparently there was some defect and the user is accusing me of opening the knife, seeing the damage, resealing it, and selling it.

This is completely asinine from my point of view.

The user refuses to deal with BKC warranty to fix the issue. The user claims BKC does not seal their knives in the pictured manner. I have no idea what the users trusted middle man did or how he shipped it. I do know that I shipped the knife 100% as pictured.

As far as I’m concerned the issue is 100% between BKC and the user. I sold and shipped the knife 100% how I described it and stand by that.

I’d be happy to provide all of the emails to any mod/staff who handles these issues.

A refund or any monetary compensation from me is 100% unacceptable and unreasonable from my perspective.
 
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@Benchmade could you verify based on my pictures that is how knives are sealed?

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I received this email:

Hello Robert,

Concerning the Benchmade Fact 417GY-1901 you sold me about a month ago through a US third party, a friend of mine actually.
The knife is defected, it has some kind of cutout or depression in one of the liners, probably a factory issue as the knife seems like it was not disassembled (see pictures I have attached) this is un acceptable, I payed top dollar for a knife from you that sells for anywhere from $220 - $250 brand new on the secendary market , the blue box is only worth about $16 but that was my choice to make.
You should have been up front about it and bieng a knife collector with dozens of succesful transaction under my belt , my bet is you knew about it but sold it off as totaly emmaculate.
I were dishonest is all I can say, as a member of a number of knife and gun forums but more important as a member of the human bieng community I expect you to take responsibility make it right somehow and no, I will in no way send it to BM under warranty on my account of time and money, this is/was your responsibility.

Gideon


He did include pics and the liner has a defect. I COULD NOT HAVE KNOWN THIS BECAUSE I NEVER OPENED THE KNIFE.
 
My response:

Honestly I take high offense to you questioning my integrity in such a manor. Accusing me of knowingly selling a defective knife and hiding facts about it is complete bull**** considering I was clear that the knife was unopened and 100% untouched since it left the factory. That was in my description. I know for a fact I sent it out sealed. That’s 100% on you for not reading the ad clearly.

It’s completely out of my hands, especially considering you’re out of the country. If you don’t want to send it to Benchmade and have them fix it I don’t know what you want me to do. I’m not being a middle man for you. I also have zero inclination to refund you anything after your rude accusations.

Don’t know what else to say. Enjoy the knife, or don’t.
 
Here is his most recent email. At this point I am ceasing private comms through email and am only dealing through this public venue.

You can take any offence you want, you're full of s**t and a scammer,
get of the righteuos idignation high horse bullshit, I've been doing
knife deals for over twenty years, BM never seals their boxes with
cello tape, you did that, a knife enthusiast always but always inpects
his knife, i've dealt with scammers before ,yes even in the big and
far away US.
What I want you to do? take the knife back on your expense and refund
me the money, or you can experience first hand how scammers are dealt
with, I don't make idle threats, trust me.
Is it worth to you $300? The keyboard is powerful tool, trust me on that too.
The ball is in your court now, think hard and deep how you really want
to handle this.
 
I’d also be happy to provide proof (to mods/staff) of over 200 positive feedback in well over 10’years of membership on AR15.com as well as my eBay feedback since my integrity has been called into question in such an inflammatory manor.
 
It’s the dumbest thing to accuse someone of doing. Why the F would I knowingly sell someone a defective knife and risk blowback when I could have sent it in to be repaired (for free!) myself before selling? Makes zero sense.
 
Seems to me that buying a knife in an unopened box is at the risk of the buyer. The seller made no representations other than it was new in a sealed box. Where the buyer also introduces a third-party middle-man to the equation, that just complicates it further. I believe I'd tell the buyer to pound sand, notwithstanding his silly internet threats.
 
BM-EDC said:
@Archer59
Click to expand...

Weird, that tag goes to a different user by the name of "Archer".

A Archer59 posted in your thread with his email address. Should be easy to match up if this is the same person. If this is the right guy, it'd be good to hear his side. If not, sorry for tagging you.
https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/10-benchmades-le-ritters-users-free-stuff.1651628/#post-18892243



For future reference, DO NOT put your email into your sales thread. Anyone perusing the internet can swing by and see it, fish it or contact you to try and scam you.
Those with a paid membership can PM you. Those without a paid membership can leave their email on your profile as a Profile Post. Profile Posts are semi-private. You must have a user account here to access someone's profile. They can edit it out after private contact is made.

If someone without a paid membership does not want to post their email then don't deal with them. You paid for the ability for private contact and they did not, so the onus is on them to make that leap. Or pay for a membership.
 
Can you post a picture of the defect he sent you?

This guy sounds unstable. And yes that box looks like it's never been opened judging from the sticker.
 
Wow. Ya that ain't good. I was expecting much smaller and him just overeacting. Can't believe that one made it out the factory without someone noticing the defect.

Honestly don't know what I'd do if I was you. I'd probably feel guilty. But there's no way you could have known since never inspected. Tough call. Wouldn't blame you if didn't let him return it too you, but think I probably would. I've never seen a chunk taken out of a liner like that before. Crazy. He should really talk to benchmade before you guys go any further. Cause its BS that knife even made it out of the factory for sale. If they had any decency they'd compensate you guys for him sending the knife back to the states, to replace it, then you or the other party involved here ship the new one back to him, since they can't ship directly to him I don't think. Anyways, best of luck and hope you both come up with a solution.
 
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Once a knife becomes mine, via an online sale, or any other way, I feel I'm responsible, for the condition, of the knife, if I choose to sell it. Therefore, I open boxes, and personally inspect the knife, before I send it to its new owner. Why do I do this? Well, I do because I don't what happened to you, happen to me. The knife should be free of manufacturers defects, before it goes to somebody else, is how I feel. If it's not devoid of defects, then it falls on me, to send it in, to be fixed.

Therefore, I feel you should have him send you the knife, refund him, and you should have it fixed. Since he's out of the the country, I suppose that that complicates things, significantly. Exactly how this situation is to be resolved, I'm not too sure.

Obviously, I don't inspect knives that come in the clam-shell (I think that that's what it's called) type packaging. Honestly, I can't remember the last time I bought a cheap knife, from Walmart...

Just my thoughts, FWIW.
 
My last PM to the seller (Robert) must've hit a nerve since he decided to go public with this miserable situation, I was hoping really and honestly try to keep this situations private to avoid tarnishing peoples reps on forums boards until I know I've exhausted every last resource to resolve it quietly and if possible, amicably.

I am a knife and gun enthusiast and have been selling and buying knives over forums boards for over ten years, the one thing that characterizes the success of internet deals and what drives it is honesty with good doses of integrity and goodwill.

Over the years if a deal was about to sour for whatever reason even the smallest detail I've had people go far out of their way to make it right just as I have on my own personal expense, why? Because common decency demands it and you will never know when you will meet that person again, over some forum board, some gun show of which I have attended in the US over the years or anywhere else.

Based on my personal experience there is /was not "good faith, just a desire to make a quick deal and as profitable as possible and I stand behind my claims BM never cello tapes their boxes shut and a knife enthusiast never buys a cat in the sack, but I guess I did this time.

Like I said before, I am a gun and knife enthusiast have been one for over as long as I can remember, ex Israeli military for over twenty years with lots of joint operations with US servicemen, honorable men I was proud to serve with and where I got to hone my English.

I am by no means a wealthy man and a deal like the last one with international shipping and customs fees cost me over $400, that is the price I choose to pay for my weaknesses

Does it piss me off when someone does'nt take responsibility for the actions? of course it does.

As far as being unstable, seriously, we have online psycho analysis now ?

And pound sand? I did with my boots, with more mileage than I can count or care to remember.

As far as silly threats I don't have to make them anymore, the seller (Robert) opened up that can of warms when he decide to go public.

I still hope we can resolve this in a gentlemanly manner.
 
Archer59 said:
As far as being unstable, seriously, we have online psycho analysis now ?
Click to expand...

Came to that conclusion because of the "I don't make idle threats". Sounded like you were going to try and have the op harmed in someway. But perhaps read you wrong and you were just going to expose him as a supposed scammer? I know for an absolute fact Benchmade uses cello tape/clear sticker frequently if not always since the new designed boxes were released. The cello tape on that looks absolutely untampered so I believe bm edc did not know about the condition. Understand you being upset. I always inspect a knife when I get it and can't believe the op did not here, but I believe him. This situation is ugly, as no clear solution and guilty person. I honestly think I'd take the $50-60 dollar hit as the seller having you ship the knife back to me, having Benchmade replace it and send it back to you. But, I also understand the op cause isn't fully his fault. Maybe you should ship back to him at your cost, get it replaced by Benchmade, then he pays for the shipping back to you, meet on middle ground. I truly do think Benchmade should compensate you guys in some way cause its bulls hit that knife Ever made it out of the factory.
 
I understand this is a bad situation A Archer59 but I am assuming you paid the premium price because it was sealed in box, is that correct?

Really as Ulf has said this is @Benchmade fault actually so maybe they will step up and remedy this.
 
For all the seller knows the buyer had this identical knife already that's in disrepair and now trying to claim that the knife he received is the defective one to try and shift the broken one for a new one. I am not saying this is the case, this is completely hypothetical, but no one in this transaction REALLY knows each other or their integrity, you can claim integrity and honesty until you're blue in the face, this goes for both sides, but doesn't necessarily make it true. It would appear in this case that the seller truly did not know the condition of the knife as it was factory sealed and should have never been missed by @Benchmade QC inspection. Buyer bought the knife sight unseen as new in a SEALED box, meaning the buyer acknowledges the seller would have not known about any kind of defect the knife would have had. I'd say this is squarely on the buyer to remedy with Benchmade directly at this point. Buyer could have asked seller to unbox and document condition before the sale was finalized.
 
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