Once and for all: Respirators that pass the seal tests with beards?

javand

javand

Joined
Oct 17, 2010
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I know we've discussed this off-hand in some other respirator suggestion threads, but I'd like to discuss it and consolidate it here.

What full face respirator do you use, that passes both the inhale and exhale seal test?

I'm looking to get one myself, and I'm certainly not going to pay retail, I also feel guilty going into a retail outlet looking to see which one fits/seals and then saying "ok, going to go shop for a real price online, thanks for your time!", so let me know which ones work for you.

Also worth mentioning is your "beard status", i.e. how beard is your beard, or how big is your beard! :D

I'd classify my beard as medium length. It's definitely trimmed, but it's also not down to my belly, about collar bone length, and a little bushy.


So far I'm eyeballing the 3M 6000 series (6800 is a medium I think?), since they can be had at relatively good prices (sub $100) on ebay pretty easily.


Thanks guys!
 
I have a short trimmed beard and use a 3M 6900 Full Face Large. It passed the tests.
 
I too am looking for a beard friendly respirator - Preferably a supplied air type. I am currently using AO Safety model with a large HEPA filter running in shop.

Does anyone have experience with Turbine Products Breathe-Cool model? Thanks. -Doug
 
There is probably a reason firefighters don't have beards but I could be wrong (it happened once before:) If you are serious about getting a good seal - quickly, easily and under all facial muscle contortions, get a razor and use it regularly.
 
There isn't such a thing !!! You can pretend but any workman's compensation group will tell you no such thing. Pulp mills can have some serious killer gases in times of accidents. Masks are tested by providing a strong very unpleasant scent close to your face. All guys with beards get the mask off in a hurry. Frank.
 
Frank Niro said:
There isn't such a thing !!! Masks are tested by providing a strong very unpleasant scent close to your face.
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There is such a thing.
I know due to the fact that I did go through the testing procedure when working at Windsor Regional Hospital.
The teasting person thought that the beard would make it so it wouldn't seal, but they were also wrong.
I passed the mask fit testing despite the supposed "fact" that I wouldn't.:)
 
A beard to mask seal is inferior to a bare face to mask seal under all conditions. Your reasoning is flawed. People pass tests every day and are no more qualified to do whatever the test tests than they were before taking the test. Travel any public roadway and observe all the tested drivers if you doubt what I say.

stabman said:
There is such a thing.
I know due to the fact that I did go through the testing procedure when working at Windsor Regional Hospital.
The teasting person thought that the beard would make it so it wouldn't seal, but they were also wrong.
I passed the mask fit testing despite the supposed "fact" that I wouldn't.:)
Click to expand...
 
BMK said:
A beard to mask seal is inferior to a bare face to mask seal under all conditions. Your reasoning is flawed. People pass tests every day and are no more qualified to do whatever the test tests than they were before taking the test. Travel any public roadway and observe all the tested drivers if you doubt what I say.
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The only test of a respirator fit I have ever seen was the banana smell test. If you can smell bananas while wearing a large bag over your torso to maintain the odor near your face the fit test is a no go. If you can't smell it then your fit passes. Since we each have different levels of smell acuity just like eyesight and hearing this test is very subjective. If you want more representative results round up several people with the same face and beard profile and have each one take the same test, but even this would not eliminate all the variables.

Odor standards are still today developed by using the human nose and panels of testers are always used for this reason. Ventilation is a more surefire method for ensuring safety with the proper ventilation and a positive pressure supplied air mask being ideal.
 
If you have a beard, you're best bet may be a full face or PAPR unit.
 
Mitchell Knives said:
If you have a beard, you're best bet may be a full face or PAPR unit.
Click to expand...

I find the North respirator works just fine if you tighten it down.
It will also depend on just how much of a beard a person has...there's many different degress of beard.
 
I think the full-face respirator is a given.

I'm not going to comment on the other testing procedures personally, and I'm not trying to get into a debate about it. I'm also not cutting my beard for a respirator, and yes, I acknowledge the risk.

The testing method I'm concerned with is the two step approach thus: Without cartridges, seal vent holes with hands and 1) inhale deeply, see if vacuum is created, 2) exhale, see if mask stays pressurized and no air escapes.


I've never been able to pass those tests with a half-mask personally. If a full face job does the trick, I'll consider that sufficient. Flawed? Maybe, but as mentioned, it's completely subjective. Consider the above my "baseline".


Cheers!
 
I bet there is an inverse relationship between the lethality of an environment and the number of bearded men wearing face sealing respiratory protection in that environment.
 
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I am interested in what tests you use to conclude that a mask is safe. I work in a research area where my guys have to process equipment that can carry pathogens or have carcinogens/ debris, etc...

Every year they have to go to be fit tested for the appropriate mask. We are told that the guys have to have everything completely shaved that will touch the perimeter of the mask or they will not pass and it is not safe.

They use a dummy mask with a nipple on the end and it is hooked to a machine by airline tubing. The machine puts off a saline vapor and the entire unit is hooked to a computer.

There are multiple tests that they have to take IE:Turning head side to side, up and down,leaning forward, speaking, etc... Each of the tests lasts a few minutes and you get a pass or fail for each section.

I have seen guys go through 5 or 6 masks until one passes the testing regime. Funny, there is a metal guard at the nose area of the mask and it is very specific how you mold it to the face. It needs to be done from either side of the nos and not pinched from the top or the seal is broken.

Sorry to ramble I was just curious as to how you guys determine proper fit. It seems to be quite a science in my industry.
 
javand said:
I think the full-face respirator is a given.

I'm not going to comment on the other testing procedures personally, and I'm not trying to get into a debate about it. I'm also not cutting my beard for a respirator, and yes, I acknowledge the risk.

The testing method I'm concerned with is the two step approach thus: Without cartridges, seal vent holes with hands and 1) inhale deeply, see if vacuum is created, 2) exhale, see if mask stays pressurized and no air escapes.


I've never been able to pass those tests with a half-mask personally. If a full face job does the trick, I'll consider that sufficient. Flawed? Maybe, but as mentioned, it's completely subjective. Consider the above my "baseline".


Cheers!
Click to expand...

That's the test I use, but with the cartridges installed.

The full face has heavy straps with solid ratcheting system, giving a much better seal than the half mask flimsy elastic bands.

A beard will prevent proper fit, but a full face mask, will give a different sealing ring pattern than the half mask
You may be able to shave to fit inside that mask and tuck it in.
I would definitely go to a store and try one on instead of taking a $100 gamble that it will work.


If you really want to keep the beard then maybe you have to look at the more expensive powered masks.

3M PAPR
Resp-O-Rator
3m Breathe Easy
Trend Airsheild
 
I couldn't get a proper fit with a half mask. My test for the full mask was to duct tape off the cartridge ports, put the mask on and inhale through the nose, SLOWLY. If the mask sucks down on your face and stays vacuum sealed for as long as you can hold your breath, it works well enough for what I do. I am not concerned about pathogens or most gasses. I work in a well ventilated area grinding steel and natural (non-stabilized) wood.
 
As a former Certified Industrial Hygienist, I've had a bit of experience in respirator fitting, but I've been out of the biz for over 20y so I am not up to date on current technology.

In my mind, what you are protecting yourself against is the primary consideration. You evaluate the hazard, and, first, see if engineering controls can be used which may eliminate the need for a respirator.

Just because it's an OSHA regulation does not mean it is the best or even right thing to do. The regs used to require nothing at the sealing surface that would interfere with the seal, including facial hair, so, by regulation, you can't fit a person if they have facial hair at the sealing surface.

If you are in a workplace, you have to do what your employer is required to do.

If you are in your own shop, you do what is prudent.

There are qualitative and quantitative fit tests. Using tear gas, iso-amyl acetate, or another challenge medium depends on the person being fitted. In quantitative fitting the concentration of the challenge aerosol is measured inside and outside the mask and a protection factor is calculated.

One's protection depends on a number of things: Is the mask appropriate for the material at the concentrations encountered? Is the mask worn correctly? Has the mask been maintained properly? Has the person wearing the mask been trained, fitted, and aware of the properties/hazards of the material?

Respirator use lowers the risk. It doesn't eliminate it.

PM me with questions if you want to.
 
I like the Resp-O-Rator. It requires that you breath through your mouth and the filters are particle not chemical. But, it is light, comfortable, cheap, doesn't fog my glasses, allows me to use whatever safety eyewear I want, doesn't make my face feel like it is in a sweat lodge, works with all beards, takes in air from behind you, and I find it doesn't sit on the shelf as much as my other respirator. If you are going to be doing something that will be putting off gases that could knock you out you will want something else, but for keeping out grinder dust it seems to do a good job.
 
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