Rant about a thread over in the training section...

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Jebadiah_Smith

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Munk, Yvsa, Howard, If I'm wrong in posting this please delete it, but this really makes me angry...

Please read it before you read my rant:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3170431#post3170431

I dont even know where to begin.

If you are going to whine about rounded tips, why post a picture of a WWII model? The only model with that characteristic. Then to top it off, show something that looks EXACTLY like a roughly done M43 and tout it as your super khukuri.

Such a blatant, underhanded, knock at HI coming from him just makes my blood boil.

Then some supporter of his just happens to join up today to tell "you less educated people" that if we disagree with the criteria its all just "UNDERSTADBLE DEFENSIVERNES" because we love our simple chopping tools that are on par with a $2.50 Chinese axe. Well, maybe I haven't "LEAernt" as much as them, but what do you call a cho, if not a cho?

Anyways, what I wanted to discuss was, do you think that any of his listed "signs of a poor quality khukuri" are in fact signs of a poor quality khukuri?

Straight Handle- I just dont understand why this lowers the quality. Whats the problem?

Habaki Bolsters- some may think they are ugly, but I kinda like them. But that is moot because we see khuks from most models without them anyways.

Cho Creep- Unsightly, but no cutting is done using this area. Besides, even without the cho, this area is not hardened, making it a less than perfect area for cutting. I have never had a cut on anything fail due to the cho being further up the blade.

Too Thick a Spine- Are you serious? Heck, I'd love to have a khuk with > 1/2" spine. The thicker the better. They cut just as well as a thin blade with a convexed edge.

Too Rounded a Point- Only the WWII is that rounded. The WWII clearly been set up to look like junk according to the bogus criteria that was presented.

Thats my rant :mad: , I'm all finished now. :)
 
Jebadiah_Smith said:
If you are going to whine about rounded tips, why post a picture of a WWII model? The only model with that characteristic.
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Because it allows you to support your strawman arguement. When you can't make an arguement based on facts you obviously have to invent some.

And besides SPeaKing In Partial Caps with funkay spellink is a SIGN that you rally knew what u have leart, khurias make cut cats, rally.

-Cliff
 
I hear ya, Jeb. I was a little mad seeing some of that garbage. First off, weren't there places IN NEPAL that were using the pics right off the HI website as finished products of their own khuks? Rounded points a sign of a bad khuk in nepal? Forgive me if i am wrong, but i think most of the noble people of Nepal are smart enough to know that it doesn't matter what a khuk looks like as long as it holds up and gets the job done. We westerners are WAY more picky about the finish of our blades. I wouldn't sweat it too much. The competition only attacks you when you are gaining ground or they are losing it. It was an obvious and desperate attack out of frustration because Simon has to play the "a$$ kicker" card to sell his "battle blades". Who the "f" cares? HI khuks are GREAT. Khuks and SAKs are the only blades i buy. They work great for me. Notice i said "work", because that's what i use them for. Look, as much of a disappoint as it may be, i think i am going to have more branches to trim, crates to destroy, and firewood to cut in my boring life than ninja attacks where i will need a "propper" khuk to get things done and lop heads. I think the one thing that really truly honest to God makes me mad about his ridiculous dribble is that fact that he had to actually wait until Bill was no longer here to be so obvious, so pig headed, so tactless. we all know that Uncle Bill wouldn't have said anything. The man was a force of nature. The mere mention of his name STILL eclipses anything that Simon can ever hope to do. The bottom line is this: At the end of the day where does the money go? Does it go into the pocket of some "expert" in "Khukuri history" or does it go back to the people of Nepal. The people that know how a khuk should work for every day activities?
Simon, good luck to ya buddy. Congrats, you just put the nail in your own coffin on forums. Who buys khuks?...knuts, that's who. We LIKE khuks..no, wait, we LOVE khuks. There is plenty of demand for the product without getting brutal and underhanded. Now NO ONE from this forum will probably buy from you again.

Sorry for the rant. i just hate it when people practice underhanded business techniques, get CAUGHT, then LIE and say that they were just doing some BS service for the public on what is "right".

jake
 
Anybody with something to sell is going to attack another's product. (sigh) I'll put my HI khukuris against anyone else's any day of the week. Having a quality product and doing business with honorable people means a lot to me. I've beaten the crap out of my khuks and they are still superb.

Hey buddy, ya want to let me work one of yours over?

Ice
 
I don't think Bill Martino was much bothered by mosquitoes.


Of course, there's always that reputation scale thingie which allows one to address one's response to a post without contributing to flaming.

Justa thought.
 
would have let the khukuris speak for themselves. And the blades from HI have spoken. They've spoken volumes. Let the upstart talk his trash. He's not making HI look bad, he's making himself look bad.

Frank
 
I don't think ignoring him is always the best path because others can read it and be misinformed, just post some facts and let the readership decide.

-Cliff
 
The thing that irritates me the most, is that Simon could have, with JUST A LITTLE modification of his post, made the whole point non-controversial. If he had simply pointed out that the WWII is non-traditional, probably people's blood pressure would have remained normal.

He's done a lot of interesting research in the past, so discounting his words out of hand is difficult for me. Too bad.

The fawning response from the guy who likes CAPS was a bit much, though. And, as Cliff points out...
 
It's just Simon's opinion. I don't see how any one person's opinion will bring down H.I.'s sales. If anything, it might drive others to go ahead and "try it for themselves".

I have purchased khukuris from nearly a dozen different sources. Find what you like and support it.
 
Kismet said:
Of course, there's always that reputation scale thingie which allows one to address one's response to a post without contributing to flaming.

Justa thought.
Click to expand...

Starting a thread debunking his goofy criteria seemed more effective than trying to turn some silly little box next to his name red.

I haven't mentioned any names, or personally attacked anyone.
 
Jebadiah_Smith said:
Munk, Yvsa, Howard, If I'm wrong in posting this please delete it, but this really makes me angry...
Click to expand...
Jebadiah_Smith said:


Please read it before you read my rant:



http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3170431#post3170431



I dont even know where to begin.



If you are going to whine about rounded tips, why post a picture of a WWII model? The only model with that characteristic. Then to top it off, show something that looks EXACTLY like a roughly done M43 and tout it as your super khukuri.



Such a blatant, underhanded, knock at HI coming from him just makes my blood boil.



Then some supporter of his just happens to join up today to tell "you less educated people" that if we disagree with the criteria its all just "UNDERSTADBLE DEFENSIVERNES" because we love our simple chopping tools that are on par with a $2.50 Chinese axe. Well, maybe I haven't "LEAernt" as much as them, but what do you call a cho, if not a cho?

Click to expand...




No problem in making a post commenting about this. The forums are about discussions. You have valid questions and I don't think your post qualifies as a rant.



The characteristic we know as "cho" also goes by some other names. The terminology we use serves its purpose of helping us talk about it.



I advise not becoming upset by condescending or insulting language. Heck, I already know I'm uneducated and not too bright.





Jebadiah_Smith said:
Anyways, what I wanted to discuss was, do you think that any of his listed "signs of a poor quality khukuri" are in fact signs of a poor quality khukuri?
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Jebadiah_Smith said:


Straight Handle- I just dont understand why this lowers the quality. Whats the problem?



Habaki Bolsters- some may think they are ugly, but I kinda like them. But that is moot because we see khuks from most models without them anyways.



Cho Creep- Unsightly, but no cutting is done using this area. Besides, even without the cho, this area is not hardened, making it a less than perfect area for cutting. I have never had a cut on anything fail due to the cho being further up the blade.



Too Thick a Spine- Are you serious? Heck, I'd love to have a khuk with > 1/2" spine. The thicker the better. They cut just as well as a thin blade with a convexed edge.



Too Rounded a Point- Only the WWII is that rounded. The WWII clearly been set up to look like junk according to the bogus criteria that was presented.



Thats my rant , I'm all finished now.
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As we know, each style of khukuri is different, and has different characteristics. Does my Malla have superior thrusting ability to my WWII? Yes, it does. Is a kobra quicker and easier to change direction than a GR? Yes, it is. Is a GR a more powerful chopper than a sirupate? Yes, it is.



A heavier khukuri will in general be slower and hit harder. Pointy tips will in general penetrate better than rounded tips. More mass forward, as in a rounded tip, will give greater chopping ability for a given mass.



We all have our favorites, should we deny someone else theirs? It may be that some martial artists who have trained with only the BAS style might be effectively defenseless with a khukuri with a straighter handle or a differently placed cho. Let's not deny him a favorite. There are HI models with all the listed "good" qualities, and there are as well many good Nepalese kamis who make good quality khukuris for export.



In my opinion, it is fruitless to argue who is "right" about preferences. I will also avoid arguing about the "real" word for cho, and what constitutes a "real" khukuri technique. These are the kind of arguments that are decided from authority. For these blades that I enjoy, I'll trust to my experiences and experiments. You guys on the forum have contributed immensely to my journey of exploration.
 
I had a few choice words and chose to share them. He's welcome to his opinion but needs to learn the definitions of 'tact' and 'decorum'.
 
Although I can't remember his name off hand, it seems that the gentleman from the Bando association prefers the HI WWII model and that is what he used in the video at the Khuk convention that I have. It wouldn't be my first choice, but then I don't have his expertise and experience. He must have a valid reason for his choice.
 
Simon's self promotion is obvious...and the troll than jumped to his defense is laughable.

What amazing news...some khukuri are better than others for MA application...wow <yawn>.

The bolster was an attempt to tailor the product for our use...and originally embraced by many here. The cho (or whatever you want to call it since there are different dialects) position is esthetic...as was said, that portion of the blade is not used anyway. Both thickness and tip shape are a matter of model selection.

Finally, any *expert* would know that these were not designed specifically as weapons...they were tools that were well known to their owners and carried along to war as we would carry shovels and ball-peen hammers. No regiment ever fell into formation to go to war armed only with their mess kits.

I have lost any sort of respect for Simon...he is a waste of bandwidth. It's a shame...he could have been a productive member of the community.

I call for a ban on him...his business practices do *not* reflect what I have come to expect of Bladeforums, nor do they reflect well on all of the honorable knifemakers I have seen here.

.
 
LEGAL NOTICE
I, Berkley B. Bettis, Attorney at Law from the Republic of Texas, coined, devised, authored, created and originated the term "CHO CREEP" on August 17, A.D. 2000, in a post on BladeForums. The misuse of this term by Brit dingbats is a violation of U.S. and international copyright laws, subjecting the violator to a public spanking! :grumpy:
 
Nasty said:
the troll than jumped to his defense is laughable.
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Are the Cantina Moderators allowed to run ISP # checks?

It would be interesting to see if Sirupate, kukrilove, and Ghurka are all one and the same.
 
Bill would have ignored Simon's post.

I did not, but I'm not Bill.

Everything is OK. Number One is always going to be challenged. That's part of being Number One.





munk
 
In the end folks, there is a reason why H.I has such a loyal following and experienced the success it has.

Bad products and bad management do not endure.

On a brighter note, my boss gave me 5 free days off. I'm going up to Northern Ontario to go hiking after TWO LONG YEARS of absense.

I cannot tell you my brothers just how happy I am to be going out, carrying my straight handled, habaki bolstered WWII. Any competitor can say what they want, in any context that they please. But my H.I khukuri has proved itself on numerous occasions on the field as die hard and reliable.

Let's face it. We Humans have no claws, fangs, or natural coat against the elements. One of the things that stands between us and nature is our equipment.

I go with what I trust and what has been proven.

Ain't no better endorsement then that.
 
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