Swords - big frighin knife - Legal in WA?

M

MikeSD

Joined
Oct 8, 2023
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I'd like to understand whether there are any specific laws preventing someone, from carryong a sword in their vehicle (i.e. plainly visible, to avoid concealed laws. But hidden when im not in vehicle).

I've read the laws and I can't find a definitive answer if swords are illegal. There are even exemptions saying this law does not apply to self-defense, implying that a sword used in self-defense is legitimate use

The single catch all is this. But it also applies to guns, and I know guns are legal.

"(1) It shall be unlawful for any person to carry, exhibit, display, or draw any firearm, dagger, sword, knife or other cutting or stabbing instrument, club, or any other weapon apparently capable of producing bodily harm, in a manner, under circumstances, and at a time and place that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons."

But this is very vague. "Time and place" , "manner", "display", "draw", "exhibit". Whatever applies to swords applies to firearms. "In a manner" seems to be the relevant part.

I would think having a sheathed sword, with no attempt at drawing it, would be ok. But I don't trust that mearly having one with you wouldn't be seen as illegal, under this law.

More relevant to the point of my question is the case where I have a sheathed sword on the back seat of my jeep, or an ATV, or even slung across my back, while out in the woods.

Does anyone know of any law that makes that illegal, in WA.?
 
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MikeSD said:
either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons."
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I'm not a lawyer , but I think this has more to do with simply not "brandishing" a weapon .

I don't think it's relevant to permissible carry .

In a world of firearms , pulling a BAK or sword , even if justified for SD , is a great way to get shot .
 
DocJD said:
I'm not a lawyer , but I think this has more to do with simply not "brandishing" a weapon .

I don't think it's relevant to permissible carry .

In a world of firearms , pulling a BAK or sword , even if justified for SD , is a great way to get shot .
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I wasn't asking because I wanted it for self defense. I have firearm for that. Just trying to figure out the laws.
 
MikeSD said:
I'd like to understand whether there are any specific laws preventing someone, from carryong a sword in their vehicle (i.e. plainly visible, to avoid concealed laws. But hidden when im not in vehicle).

I've read the laws and I can't find a definitive answer if swords are illegal. There are even exemptions saying this law does not apply to self-defense, implying that a sword used in self-defense is legitimate use

The single catch all is this. But it also applies to guns, and I know guns are legal.

"(1) It shall be unlawful for any person to carry, exhibit, display, or draw any firearm, dagger, sword, knife or other cutting or stabbing instrument, club, or any other weapon apparently capable of producing bodily harm, in a manner, under circumstances, and at a time and place that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons."

But this is very vague. "Time and place" , "manner", "display", "draw", "exhibit". Whatever applies to swords applies to firearms. "In a manner" seems to be the relevant part.

I would think having a sheathed sword, with no attempt at drawing it, would be ok. But I don't trust that mearly having one with you wouldn't be seen as illegal, under this law.

More relevant to the point of my question is the case where I have a sheathed sword on the back seat of my jeep, or an ATV, or even slung across my back, while out in the woods.

Does anyone know of any law that makes that illegal, in WA.?
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Back in the 80's, there was a dude who used to wander around Capitol Hill with a huge sword on his back. Never seemed to get in any trouble about that I could see.
 
DocJD said:
Sword carry implies weapon use , if not for SD ...what then ? :confused:
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See, there-in lies the problem. You assume if a sword is carried, it's for aggression, which is the point of the law. And exactly the reason I asked.

I think I made it clear. I was trying to understand the law. There are reasons to have a sword with you that have nothing to do with self-defense.

* merely transporting
* bringing some place to show someone
* using as a tool (as in machete)
* practicing sword handling for cultural reasons
* ceremonial reasons (i.e. funerals)
* Halloween costume, if you want silly

All of these require a sword in one's possession.

I could go on and on but the point of the question was understanding the law.
 
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I don’t see SD as aggression, although you may need to be aggressive. 🤣

I trained with swords in martial arts training for many years and transported them up front when going/coming from classes. When a LEO asked me about a Katana I had, I told him I was going home from teaching a class and he was fine with that. I used to hike with a waki instead of using a machete, so I do understand carrying for other reasons.

To me, the wording of the law opens up a can of worms because intimidation can be caused by so many things. Someone could feel intimidated despite you having no bad intentions.

Try not to cause undue attention, use common sense, and stay safe.
 
If you are transporting it in a car then wrap it or put it in a box and then it does not fall within "exhibit, display, or draw," end of story. This also takes it outside of "carry," b/c prohibited carry (under this statute anyway) must also involve doing so "in a manner . . . that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons.". There is no potential intimidation if it is not visible.

Now if you have it visible, for instance in the woods, you could find yourself in trouble if you approach others, however if others see you but you are not trying to make contact with them, then it's pretty impossible to prove you were intending to intimidate them. Same with proving that there was a warranted fear for their safety. Now proof is an issue for the prosecutor not the cops; they might well come investigate a report of "dude with sword." The other variable is whether there are any other laws at play, like municipal ordinances - probably not an issue in the woods, if in the boonies -- but if you were wandering the paths of Carkeek Park in Seattle with a katana on your back, expect LEO interest.
 
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Aussie here, ...c'mon mate!???
Concealed carry is a thing the "yanks" talk about. I know different states have different interpretations, but if a cop sees a sword in your vehicle, the last thing you want to start bleatin' about is "self defense" Cops hate weapons.
A machete or axe in the back of the ute might pass with a good attitude, but samurai sword racks in the hilux will get you car searched...everytime!
Be a collector, martial enthusiast, tool user, maker, cosplayer...just dont mention weapon, it really shouldnt be hard for someone, who thinks they are old enough and responsible enough to own a weapon, to grasp the concept...that the police see people carrying "weapons" as a threat, and will interpret the law to their own advantage.
 
elasmonut said:
A machete or axe in the back of the ute might pass with a good attitude,
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I own 30 acres of woods about a mile away from my home. I go there all the time to maintain the road (path), a hunting cabin and a small foot bridge to a very small pond.

I have 3 machetes in my truck today, laying in the back floorboard. I forget them all the time because they never leave the truck. I recently had to run down to Louisiana and forget and had one in the back. Luckily I wasn't pulled over perhaps, but I need them on an almost daily basis and they are not a weapon TO ME.

They are a yard tool.
 
It would seem that all that needs to happen for a sword to be illegal is for someone to think theirs of another person's safety is in jeopardy. Perception is what matters. And the sword holder is not the one making the call.
 
bbuck said:
It would seem that all that needs to happen for a sword to be illegal is for someone to think theirs of another person's safety is in jeopardy. Perception is what matters. And the sword holder is not the one making the call.
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If you're doing HEMA or Iaido I would think that all you'd have to do is explain that to the cops. A lot of cops are into weapons and stuff like that.
 
bbuck said:
It would seem that all that needs to happen for a sword to be illegal is for someone to think theirs of another person's safety is in jeopardy. Perception is what matters. And the sword holder is not the one making the call.
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I don't think so !

Usually the law is based upon what a "reasonable " person would perceive .

Although , I'm not sure how reasonable people are in some places anymore ?

There are people now , who will claim to be threatened by someone calmly and quietly opening a package or prepping a snack ...with a SAK ! :rolleyes:
 
If carrying swords became legal where I live, I'd probably be crazy enough to try it out for a while. Just for style points.
 
DocJD said:
I don't think so !

Usually the law is based upon what a "reasonable " person would perceive .

Although , I'm not sure how reasonable people are in some places anymore ?

There are people now , who will claim to be threatened by someone calmly and quietly opening a package or prepping a snack ...with a SAK ! :rolleyes:
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While that is true for many things that does not always apply to legality. Such as harassment. According to HR classes I have taken if a person feels they are being harassed then they legally are and management needs to take action or they can personally be held responsible. I can see where an average person could feel threatened to see some stranger holding a sword in what they considered a brandishing action. As the average person would never pull a sword out in public to start.
 
DapperDon said:
If you're doing HEMA or Iaido I would think that all you'd have to do is explain that to the cops. A lot of cops are into weapons and stuff like that.
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It can be a plain old citizen that called the police and wants to be protected and want charges filed.A quick Google of man carrying sword in Seattle shows it usually draws a quick response from the police
 
MikeSD said:
I would think having a sheathed sword, with no attempt at drawing it, would be ok. But I don't trust that mearly having one with you wouldn't be seen as illegal, under this law.

More relevant to the point of my question is the case where I have a sheathed sword on the back seat of my jeep, or an ATV, or even slung across my back, while out in the woods.

Does anyone know of any law that makes that illegal, in WA.?
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I live in Washington but I'm not a lawyer, so caveat emptor and all that. I agree the state law doesn't expressly make having a sword in your vehicle, or on you, illegal. But the bit about "warrants alarm" is a choice made by the people around you; if someone is alarmed, and reports you, I would expect problems to ensue. Personally, in the situations you're describing it seems unlikely folks would be alarmed.

In the places where state law is preempted by local laws (e.g., Seattle), it's just flatly illegal.
 
bbuck said:
While that is true for many things that does not always apply to legality. Such as harassment. According to HR classes I have taken if a person feels they are being harassed then they legally are and management needs to take action or they can personally be held responsible. I can see where an average person could feel threatened to see some stranger holding a sword in what they considered a brandishing action. As the average person would never pull a sword out in public to start.
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I might consider an unsheathed sword a potential threat , depending on context .

This type of legal question is central to justified use of lethal force, in self-defense .

Trouble with swords is that there are few innocent , non-threatening contexts for even carrying around a sword openly .

In my area , open carry of firearms is perfectly legal and not too unusual to see in public . Walmart etc .

Some people might not like it and even feel threatened , but it's not illegal unless brandished or used to threaten purposefully .

Normal type belt knives , not normally a problem either ...but some BA sword ?

Some cosplay or sword related event , yeah . Acceptable context .

Random sketchy stranger in public packing a real sword for no good known reason ...?

Except on my own private property , I almost never "open carry" anything that's primarily and obviously a weapon .
 
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