The Marvelous New Second Gen BK02 Sheath System

[Bladite]

so, tonite, i was fiddling with the second gen BK02's sheath system

did you all know that the new BK02 Campanion sheath is MODULAR? no?

KaBar isn't really pushing this angle for some reason, but wow... this sheath SYSTEM is amazing. really is.

so. i took the sheath apart. four screws and four inserts. sweet!

observations:

o the strap retention system is attached to an offset piece of plastic with 4 whole in the corners, and there are two slots (for webbing?) as well. the hole are countersunk on BOTH sides. mmm. INTEResting as they say.

o there's a thumb ramp on the sheath itself for pushing against and massive leverage. sweet.

o there are 10 HOLES with rivet points, and 4 slots capable of accepting webbing. there's a ton of places to lash or bolt things on. pouches. other sheaths.

o one can reverse the strap system for lefties. one could even INVERT it. might be possible to do a sidedraw/ranger mode, but it could be a bit dangly/balanced challened. you'd want spacers ideally.

o or just leave it off entirely. looks possible to now enclose the sheath in leather, and then bolt on the straps, or something else.

o KaBar screws are universal slot/phillips style.

o comparing to a Camillus BK11 sheath, there are two many combinations of sheath holes lining up in pleasing ways to be coincidences. ideally, you'll want spacers to keep things flat, but really, wow. i am surprised? no ;P delighted? yes! you have to beg for this in custom sheaths sometimes. so, yes, you can be packing your BK11 mechanically fitted to your BK02. i imagine the sheaths will get upgrades as KaBar runs out of the older Camillus styles. count on it.

o the aluminum threaded inserts are almost EXACTLY like TekLok types, except the thread patterns are different. same size, and physical characteristics, such that one could swap the threaded insert/screw sets around as desired.

o some of the holes in the sheath line up perfectly with the large TekLok i had to compare with. the BK02 sheath is much wider, so one would have to pick a side, *or* an orientation (sideways/ranger draw anyone?) through two holes only. if they make an X-large TekLok, you're probably all set. i had to use the rubber spacers for best fit, but that's typical with many TekLok applications.

pictures are iffy i'm sure - new lens - improvements as i have time and skill to practice

Bladite

 

[akthor]

Yet some people STILL don't like the new sheath??? From what I've seen the new one is whole hell of a lot nicer.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

That does it. We're getting rid of Bladeite and finding someone with REAL camera skillz!

 

[Bladite]

That does it. We're getting rid of Bladeite and finding someone with REAL camera skillz!

issuing infractions

i need a light box... and more time

fortunately, the gear is lining up... mmm...

course, the pros could step forward...


Bladite

 

[Esav Benyamin]

I don't know if you've had the time to look in on the new Photography Discussion forum. I liked the threads bulgron has going:

TUTORIAL: Displaying your photographs on BladeForums
Playing with my softbox

 

[Bladite]

I don't know if you've had the time to look in on the new Photography Discussion forum. I liked the threads bulgron has going:

TUTORIAL: Displaying your photographs on BladeForums
Playing with my softbox

cool - thanks - bookmarked for later...

i know what i need to do, but time... to get the truly awesome levels i'd like to achieve, will take effort...

unfortunately, these busy Becker people want instant gratifications. now now now.

so, we aim to please


Bladite

 

[Esav Benyamin]

we aim to please

I hope so ... they have all these big knives

 

[Bladite]

I hope so ... they have all these big knives

i have more and my aim is pretty good


Bladite

 

[willworship]

Yet some people STILL don't like the new sheath??? From what I've seen the new one is whole hell of a lot nicer.

That it is. I don't think there is any comparison with the previous one. The lockup is tighter, the mounting options are better, and the blade doesn't move at all when it's in place. One guy has commented that his blade edge is rubbing on the interior, but that seems to be an exception.

 

[frontline29]

Thanks for the pictures! I was looking to see if it would work with a tec lok like that!
The new sheath really is awesome tho. It makes a great knife even better.
In fact I was happy my old sheath broke when it did

The first thing I did when I got it in from Kabar, was take the belt loop attachment off and ran some para cord through the lashing holes for belt carry.
It works good like, that but I'm sure a large Tec Lok is the cat's a$$ for this sheath.(for me anyways)

IMHO if the blade is getting dulled by the sheath while taking it out, then your edge is too thin for what the knife was designed to do.

If you need a razor sharp edge for close up detailed work, put it on the BK11 and use it.

 

[akthor]

Thats a good point. I haven't got my BK2 back yet from the sheathmaker but I have chopped and batoned with my tracker and pybar, tracker 1/4" thick and the prybar is probably at least an 1/8" thicker than that (.318" whatever that is) and after a few chops and batons I could feel no difference in thier edges. Perhaps people complaining of the sheath dulling their knives have done just that made the edge too thin. I have a kydex sheath for another EDC I have and unless I really pay attention the edge rubs the sheath when I pull it out, all my knives rub their leather sheaths too. So could be these guys would be screwed no matter what sheath they use.

My EDC is 3/16" and shaving sharp BTW but it doesn't have a "thin edge" I see no adverse effects from the edge rubbing the kydex.

(

Thanks for the pictures! I was looking to see if it would work with a tec lok like that!
The new sheath really is awesome tho. It makes a great knife even better.
In fact I was happy my old sheath broke when it did

The first thing I did when I got it in from Kabar, was take the belt loop attachment off and ran some para cord through the lashing holes for belt carry.
It works good like, that but I'm sure a large Tec Lok is the cat's a$$ for this sheath.(for me anyways)

IMHO if the blade is getting dulled by the sheath while taking it out, then your edge is too thin for what the knife was designed to do.

If you need a razor sharp edge for close up detailed work, put it on the BK11 and use it.

 

[Bladite]

Thanks for the pictures! I was looking to see if it would work with a tec lok like that!
The new sheath really is awesome tho. It makes a great knife even better.
In fact I was happy my old sheath broke when it did

The first thing I did when I got it in from Kabar, was take the belt loop attachment off and ran some para cord through the lashing holes for belt carry.
It works good like, that but I'm sure a large Tec Lok is the cat's a$$ for this sheath.(for me anyways)

IMHO if the blade is getting dulled by the sheath while taking it out, then your edge is too thin for what the knife was designed to do.

If you need a razor sharp edge for close up detailed work, put it on the BK11 and use it.

there's a reason people buy $15 moras :> mind, the mora is WAY underpriced, and can't do some of the things a BK02 can do all day...

something like the mora? can do a few things easily that the BK02 can't do easily... i'd rather have more knives than just one.

each to their own


Bladite

 

[killa_concept]

there's a reason people buy $15 moras :>

I never said anything to suggest that a $15 mora was in any way superior - I was just pointing out that despite it's cheapness, the sheath didn't damage the edge. My mora has nothing on my BK-2... the BK-2 can easily transition from chopping and batoning wood to carving a fairly decent spoon. I can actually do this better with the BK-2 than I can with the Mora (tried it recently) - the tip on the BK-2 isn't as pointy which allows you to scoop out the depression MUCH easier:

Perhaps people complaining of the sheath dulling their knives have done just that made the edge too thin. I have a kydex sheath for another EDC I have and unless I really pay attention the edge rubs the sheath when I pull it out. . .

IMHO if the blade is getting dulled by the sheath while taking it out, then your edge is too thin for what the knife was designed to do.

Nope - the edge on my BK-2 is definitely not too thin.... it's convexed with a final edge angle that's a decent bit thicker than the factory angle. And that's not the only grind I've tried putting on it. In trying to address the issue with the sheath, I've tried plenty of other possibilities: resharpening at the factory 20 degrees a number of times, a v-edge with a probably a 22ish degree angle, a convex grind of just the edge, and finally a fairly steep convex grind with a stouter convex microbevel. Oh, and all these were tried in everything from 220 up to 2000 grit, just to factor that out. Even after all the metal I've removed through resharpening and even when I take utmost care to un-sheath it spine first, it still produces several small nicks on the edge that can be seen when held up to the light. The nicks don't really impact carving wood and such, but these nicked areas don't shave and also drag when cutting paper.

If you need a razor sharp edge for close up detailed work, put it on the BK11 and use it.

I picked one up about a week or two ago and it has the same sheath issue that I had with my BK-2. I've put a convex edge on it and sanded the inside of the sheath, which has helped somewhat: the nick produced is pretty insignificant compared to my BK-2. Despite the small problem, I'm VERY pleased with the knife and it's looking to be exactly what I was wanting. I've already decided that it will be permanently strapped to the shoulder of my MULE pack as an easy access bushcraft knife on hikes and such

That all said:
Does the sheath issue really impact practical performance? Not really. Does it aggravate my OCD when it comes to keeping my blades razor sharp? A tad bit - but it's more a nit-pick issue and definitely nowhere near enough to make me dislike Beckers in the least (alongside my HI kukris, they're my go-to work knives. Well built and very versatile in usage). What does bother me is how defensive you guys get over something I, and a few others, have presented as an issue. Constructive criticism should be taken as such and not broken down like you guys have chosen to do. "Clearly it's user error - and if that's not the case, then clearly you're expecting too much out of a sheath that comes with a $70 knife! If you're not pleased with it, lower your expectations and think of it as a packaging container - buy a custom made one" It's borderline fanboyishness and it has bothered me far more than the sheath issue - heck, my motivation to argue the point further stemmed largely from it.

And BTW, despite my "complaint", I'm still picking up a Gen 2 BK2 - During his trip, my friend took a liking to the BK-2 I lent him and has pretty much decided that I'm selling it to him regardless of whether I want to or not. The changes made with the gen 2 look amazing and who knows, I might luck out and not have the sheath issue on this one. Don't misinterpret me guys: I love my beckers - just because I take one small thing to issue, it doesn't mean otherwise. Kabar/Becker are one of the few companies that take user feedback seriously and that's what makes them and their products great. If you're willing to turn a blind eye to a small issue and are completely unwilling to nit pick, then you're not helping improve the product and aren't actually doing the company as much a favor as you think you are!

 

[Bladite]

snerk - well - it might be user error to put that kind of edge on the knife? just kidding...

okay, so the sheath sucks for your application.

on the way home tonite, i thought about it. esp with the second generation sheath. drill out the rivets on the edge side of the sheath, insert a layer or two of chamois material, re-apply some rivets, or other bolts.

now, in theory, there should be NOTHING but air or chamois to contact the edge. voila.

if you want to go further, completely separate the halves of the shell, line with chamois (and glue?) or other very thin leather. perhaps even wet mold with blade in place, re-rivit or bolt. now you'll have a tension customized to your needs, with nothing contacting the blade of soft leather like materials, and silent but deadly draw.

i'm thinking of a half a dozen variations on this theme.

other thoughts: a mora has a rockwell hardness of infinity yes? the BK02 doesn't... i'd expect the mora to slice bits out of BK02 maybe that's why the mora, and some other such knives don't lose their edge so well. could also be sheath design. maybe KaBar cranks down on those rivets a bit much. perhaps they could put a wee spacer in there. perhaps they could provide an all bolt assembly system with adjustable tension too (especially at the neck). raise the prices too


Bladite

 

[frontline29]

It has nothing to do with being a fan boy...


Were talking about a hard use work knife here people.
It was designed to be used, and to be put to work out in the field. Like batoning wood for fire's, making shelter's, digging, making trap's, or whatever else you need a hard use knife in the field for.

It was not designed to sit on a desk cutting computer paper or for cleaning the dirt from under your finger nails.

The very first second that you take that knife out and USE it, the edge is no longer gonna be perfect anymore anyways...

I just don't see the problem in a work knife, that's gonna be used for it's intended purpose.

Edited to add: If it was a straight razor and you needed to have that absolutely perfect razor sharp edge, I would understand your concern.

 

[Bridgeman]

Yet some people STILL don't like the new sheath??? From what I've seen the new one is whole hell of a lot nicer.

Yes yes I know there is a trading forum, but doggoneit, these are my fellow Beckerheads. I bought two 2nd generation BK-2s with 1st generation sheaths and would LOVE to trade one of these unhappy people!

(Okay mods, don't slap me too hard. I've only been a member for...oh, 5 years.)
gulp

 

[akthor]

Maybe it IS just your OCD do you look at the edge with a microscope? You may just be too nitpicky, OCD is not a joke its a disease. Just reading the description of your sharpening process tires me out

Fanboys? Well this is the Becker forum. You wanna see real fanboy behavior go in the Busse section and write sumthin negative

I never said anything to suggest that a $15 mora was in any way superior - I was just pointing out that despite it's cheapness, the sheath didn't damage the edge. My mora has nothing on my BK-2... the BK-2 can easily transition from chopping and batoning wood to carving a fairly decent spoon. I can actually do this better with the BK-2 than I can with the Mora (tried it recently) - the tip on the BK-2 isn't as pointy which allows you to scoop out the depression MUCH easier:

Nope - the edge on my BK-2 is definitely not too thin.... it's convexed with a final edge angle that's a decent bit thicker than the factory angle. And that's not the only grind I've tried putting on it. In trying to address the issue with the sheath, I've tried plenty of other possibilities: resharpening at the factory 20 degrees a number of times, a v-edge with a probably a 22ish degree angle, a convex grind of just the edge, and finally a fairly steep convex grind with a stouter convex microbevel. Oh, and all these were tried in everything from 220 up to 2000 grit, just to factor that out. Even after all the metal I've removed through resharpening and even when I take utmost care to un-sheath it spine first, it still produces several small nicks on the edge that can be seen when held up to the light. The nicks don't really impact carving wood and such, but these nicked areas don't shave and also drag when cutting paper.




I picked one up about a week or two ago and it has the same sheath issue that I had with my BK-2. I've put a convex edge on it and sanded the inside of the sheath, which has helped somewhat: the nick produced is pretty insignificant compared to my BK-2. Despite the small problem, I'm VERY pleased with the knife and it's looking to be exactly what I was wanting. I've already decided that it will be permanently strapped to the shoulder of my MULE pack as an easy access bushcraft knife on hikes and such

That all said:
Does the sheath issue really impact practical performance? Not really. Does it aggravate my OCD when it comes to keeping my blades razor sharp? A tad bit - but it's more a nit-pick issue and definitely nowhere near enough to make me dislike Beckers in the least (alongside my HI kukris, they're my go-to work knives. Well built and very versatile in usage). What does bother me is how defensive you guys get over something I, and a few others, have presented as an issue. Constructive criticism should be taken as such and not broken down like you guys have chosen to do. "Clearly it's user error - and if that's not the case, then clearly you're expecting too much out of a sheath that comes with a $70 knife! If you're not pleased with it, lower your expectations and think of it as a packaging container - buy a custom made one" It's borderline fanboyishness and it has bothered me far more than the sheath issue - heck, my motivation to argue the point further stemmed largely from it.

And BTW, despite my "complaint", I'm still picking up a Gen 2 BK2 - During his trip, my friend took a liking to the BK-2 I lent him and has pretty much decided that I'm selling it to him regardless of whether I want to or not. The changes made with the gen 2 look amazing and who knows, I might luck out and not have the sheath issue on this one. Don't misinterpret me guys: I love my beckers - just because I take one small thing to issue, it doesn't mean otherwise. Kabar/Becker are one of the few companies that take user feedback seriously and that's what makes them and their products great. If you're willing to turn a blind eye to a small issue and are completely unwilling to nit pick, then you're not helping improve the product and aren't actually doing the company as much a favor as you think you are!

 

[AF]

I see nothing wrong with killa concept's complaint re the sheath. I've heard of this issue with other synthetic sheaths. Maybe Becker will look into it.

I just ordered a BK-2 from a major dealer. Will I most likely be getting the 2nd gen sheath?

 

[frontline29]

I see nothing wrong with killa concept's complaint re the sheath. I've heard of this issue with other synthetic sheaths. Maybe Becker will look into it.

I just ordered a BK-2 from a major dealer. Will I most likely be getting the 2nd gen sheath?

I doubt Kabar is gonna do anything about it. Because there is nothing wrong with the sheath.The sheath is a well made piece of gear.

This might simply be a drawback to using synthetic sheath's.

But personally I haven't noticed it, and if I did, it wouldn't bother me on a work horse of a knife like the BK2.
If it was my edc that I use for fine, light, and detailed work, then yes I would be a little disappointed about it. But I'm sure it would end there.

Like I said:
"The very first second that you take that knife out and USE it, the edge is no longer gonna be perfect anymore anyways"
Just keep telling yourself that and you will be fine.

And Yes, more then likely you will be getting the newer version of the sheath.:thumbup:

 

[killa_concept]

Maybe it IS just your OCD do you look at the edge with a microscope? You may just be too nitpicky, OCD is not a joke its a disease. Just reading the description of your sharpening process tires me out

Fanboys? Well this is the Becker forum. You wanna see real fanboy behavior go in the Busse section and write sumthin negative

Wrong - it's a disorder
And no, I simply hold it up the light and move it about - I can see the sections that have deformed as they reflect light differently. Passing it over a strop, these sections visibly pull compound as the edge realigns

snerk - well - it might be user error to put that kind of edge on the knife? just kidding...

okay, so the sheath sucks for your application.

on the way home tonite, i thought about it. esp with the second generation sheath. drill out the rivets on the edge side of the sheath, insert a layer or two of chamois material, re-apply some rivets, or other bolts.

now, in theory, there should be NOTHING but air or chamois to contact the edge. voila. . .

I see nothing wrong with killa concept's complaint re the sheath. I've heard of this issue with other synthetic sheaths. Maybe Becker will look into it.

I just ordered a BK-2 from a major dealer. Will I most likely be getting the 2nd gen sheath?

Thank you! Bladite's playful jests aside, those are the kind of replies that I would expect from the (usually) helpful people here on BF. I'll give your suggestion a try if the gen 2 sheath presents me with the same issues

BTW AF, did you happen to order yours from A**zon? I was considering ordering off there as I've noticed most major retailers that deal with a plethora of items simply don't update their pictures or information as revisions come out... a place I purchased some Leeks from had the blade steel listed as 440A but I actually received 14C28 ones. If not, I guess I could just order off Tomars as their info is up to date and I've dealt with them before.

It has nothing to do with being a fan boy...


Were talking about a hard use work knife here people.
It was designed to be used, and to be put to work out in the field. Like batoning wood for fire's, making shelter's, digging, making trap's, or whatever else you need a hard use knife in the field for.

It was not designed to sit on a desk cutting computer paper or for cleaning the dirt from under your finger nails.

The very first second that you take that knife out and USE it, the edge is no longer gonna be perfect anymore anyways...

I just don't see the problem in a work knife, that's gonna be used for it's intended purpose.

Edited to add: If it was a straight razor and you needed to have that absolutely perfect razor sharp edge, I would understand your concern.

I do put my BK-2 to hard use and yes, it does require touching up afterward as it's not made of adamantium (as much as I'd like it to be). But I don't see why it's such an unreasonable expectation that the knife keep a pristine edge prior to seeing any work. I guess we're just at odds on the issue and you can chalk it up to my self diagnosed OCD (or Faux-CD if akthor is going to get on my case over the seriousness of the "disease" )