Angry Waiter
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The " Roosters " are crowing for the " Farmers"
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wlfryjr
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I feel the need to re-post this in light of new comments and observations.
I am excited to have purchased two new to me farmers jacks although both are redundant in their own way.
Here is the first.A Schrade S 7309F double spring (The only legitimate farmers jack I have found with 2 springs). I have posted another on this thread,which for some reason I can't find the post, that was given me by David Anthony.
It had lost it's handles,as the Fibestos (Schrade's trademark name for these handles) was not hardy, and was rehandled in walnut,which I stained black. This one has it's original handles and seems almost full blades,except for the kinda unusual small belly in the modified pruning blade,which is a Wharncliffe blade. as explained in Scrades catalog cut below.
The handles are badly shrunk and pulled up on the pins.This post from 4/5/2006 by Rich Langston explains more about it:
" Rescue and return of Farmer Jack
As I have said in the past Rarity and condition are two of the biggest factors to be considered by the collector. Often times if a knife is very rare the condition is not as important as it would be on a model or pattern not as unusual or as difficult to obtain. Once in a while you will find a knife which is both rare and in excellent condition. Even more rare is to find an example to which you can validate with a history or provanance. In the past this was not as difficult to do as it is today. In the past people did not know what they had. In todays market the public is much more informed and growing more so each day. The exception to this is when a knife is so rare that people do not recognize it or you know something about that is not generally known or understood. Then once in a while a knife will ( so to speak ) fly under the radar.
I recently received a knife that I purchased on ebay. It is a S7309F (see pic catalogue ref) which is a 4,1/8" Budding and Pruning knife. These were also called farmers jacks, farmer knives, and Wharncliff jacks. These knives had an unusual patterned budding blade with a bark loosener and a pruning blade. This model was handled in Fibestos. This was a very early step up from celluloid and more stable. They also made this knife in a bolstered, shielded bone stag version # S7303 as well as an imi ivory cell version #S7304W. While celluloid and jigged bone can be replaced the original Fibestos is and never will be available again. The fact is that ( relatively ) very few of these were made, as well as this materials property of getting brittle over the years ( it was a form of early plastic) and breaking, means that very few examples in good condition even exist and most of those are in more common patterns that these materials were used on.
While years ago I did own a jigged bone version. I was forced to trade it to another collector as part of 8 knives I traded for a Press Button Guardian. I needed the knife for a book I was writing and really had no other choice. Since then I have seen a couple they were part of the Schrade collection. The only one I have ever seen in fibestos was the one in this collection and it was in pristene condition. When it was announced that Schrade would be selling its collection piece by piece at auction upon liquidation. A 30 page individual listing of these knives was put out. I still have that copy and on page 6 it lists the knife to which I refer. I had noted it to bid on it. ( see pic actual listing from originaly listed pieces ) . As we all know the auction never happened Smokey cut a deal bought it all and has been selling it.
I remembered seeing the knife and it was listed on page 6 of 30 on panel #7B. Because of my affialiation with Schrade I had taken pictures of these panels but since Smokey was on the way to pick them up at the time I was a bit rushed and did not number the panels. Now looking through I cannot find the exact knife however I included a pic of the bone version in the collection which was also on a panel just to show how they were displayed. ( see pic). Schrade made many variations of budding knives most were quite common this model was not.
This knife was apparently sold to a ( well known dealer ) who put it on ebay. He lists it as coming from the Schrade collection and having been bought from Smokey. A couple of well known names bid on it and i sniped it . Sniping is about the only way I seem to be able to bid anything since as soon as I bid early usually other bidders jump in ( from all over). I do not know if it is because of me or everyone has that problem but sniping is fair as far as I am concerned. In this case I paid 130 plus shipping. I was amazed and would have gone much higher ( higher than any sane person would have). The knife is perfect it is like holding a piece of living history. A truly rare pattern in a rare material in Near mint condition. To me this is a treasure.
I have related this story only to show that these items are out there, and present, to the modern collector one of the last opportunitys to save these bits of history and in some cases find items at flea markets and garage sales worth many time what they pay for them. It like any field requires study and determination. I would strongly suggest any reference books available. References aside from informing the reader whet the appetite. This old farmer is back home surrounded by its contemporarys, in a 80 year old Schrade Cutlery display case ( the way it should be ). "
I stained these walnut handles, maybe I should have left them the way David Anthony rehandled in walnut as a tribute to him. It's a Pennsylvania knife, C Liggit Phila. It's blades are unfettered although tarnished and not having shine doesn't bother me. I stained it because I wanted it to be more original, but little did I know I'd come upon an original albeit not unsharpened as this one , but nice considering.
This knife has the flat blades, modified budder with bark loosener on the spine and thumb jimping on the tang. It's also the only farmer jack I know of not having a single spring. One of my favorites for many reasons.
I'll post an original Fibestos handled in next post.
I am excited to have purchased two new to me farmers jacks although both are redundant in their own way.
Here is the first.A Schrade S 7309F double spring (The only legitimate farmers jack I have found with 2 springs). I have posted another on this thread,which for some reason I can't find the post, that was given me by David Anthony.
It had lost it's handles,as the Fibestos (Schrade's trademark name for these handles) was not hardy, and was rehandled in walnut,which I stained black. This one has it's original handles and seems almost full blades,except for the kinda unusual small belly in the modified pruning blade,which is a Wharncliffe blade. as explained in Scrades catalog cut below.
The handles are badly shrunk and pulled up on the pins.This post from 4/5/2006 by Rich Langston explains more about it:
" Rescue and return of Farmer Jack
As I have said in the past Rarity and condition are two of the biggest factors to be considered by the collector. Often times if a knife is very rare the condition is not as important as it would be on a model or pattern not as unusual or as difficult to obtain. Once in a while you will find a knife which is both rare and in excellent condition. Even more rare is to find an example to which you can validate with a history or provanance. In the past this was not as difficult to do as it is today. In the past people did not know what they had. In todays market the public is much more informed and growing more so each day. The exception to this is when a knife is so rare that people do not recognize it or you know something about that is not generally known or understood. Then once in a while a knife will ( so to speak ) fly under the radar.
I recently received a knife that I purchased on ebay. It is a S7309F (see pic catalogue ref) which is a 4,1/8" Budding and Pruning knife. These were also called farmers jacks, farmer knives, and Wharncliff jacks. These knives had an unusual patterned budding blade with a bark loosener and a pruning blade. This model was handled in Fibestos. This was a very early step up from celluloid and more stable. They also made this knife in a bolstered, shielded bone stag version # S7303 as well as an imi ivory cell version #S7304W. While celluloid and jigged bone can be replaced the original Fibestos is and never will be available again. The fact is that ( relatively ) very few of these were made, as well as this materials property of getting brittle over the years ( it was a form of early plastic) and breaking, means that very few examples in good condition even exist and most of those are in more common patterns that these materials were used on.
While years ago I did own a jigged bone version. I was forced to trade it to another collector as part of 8 knives I traded for a Press Button Guardian. I needed the knife for a book I was writing and really had no other choice. Since then I have seen a couple they were part of the Schrade collection. The only one I have ever seen in fibestos was the one in this collection and it was in pristene condition. When it was announced that Schrade would be selling its collection piece by piece at auction upon liquidation. A 30 page individual listing of these knives was put out. I still have that copy and on page 6 it lists the knife to which I refer. I had noted it to bid on it. ( see pic actual listing from originaly listed pieces ) . As we all know the auction never happened Smokey cut a deal bought it all and has been selling it.
I remembered seeing the knife and it was listed on page 6 of 30 on panel #7B. Because of my affialiation with Schrade I had taken pictures of these panels but since Smokey was on the way to pick them up at the time I was a bit rushed and did not number the panels. Now looking through I cannot find the exact knife however I included a pic of the bone version in the collection which was also on a panel just to show how they were displayed. ( see pic). Schrade made many variations of budding knives most were quite common this model was not.
This knife was apparently sold to a ( well known dealer ) who put it on ebay. He lists it as coming from the Schrade collection and having been bought from Smokey. A couple of well known names bid on it and i sniped it . Sniping is about the only way I seem to be able to bid anything since as soon as I bid early usually other bidders jump in ( from all over). I do not know if it is because of me or everyone has that problem but sniping is fair as far as I am concerned. In this case I paid 130 plus shipping. I was amazed and would have gone much higher ( higher than any sane person would have). The knife is perfect it is like holding a piece of living history. A truly rare pattern in a rare material in Near mint condition. To me this is a treasure.
I have related this story only to show that these items are out there, and present, to the modern collector one of the last opportunitys to save these bits of history and in some cases find items at flea markets and garage sales worth many time what they pay for them. It like any field requires study and determination. I would strongly suggest any reference books available. References aside from informing the reader whet the appetite. This old farmer is back home surrounded by its contemporarys, in a 80 year old Schrade Cutlery display case ( the way it should be ). "
I stained these walnut handles, maybe I should have left them the way David Anthony rehandled in walnut as a tribute to him. It's a Pennsylvania knife, C Liggit Phila. It's blades are unfettered although tarnished and not having shine doesn't bother me. I stained it because I wanted it to be more original, but little did I know I'd come upon an original albeit not unsharpened as this one , but nice considering.
This knife has the flat blades, modified budder with bark loosener on the spine and thumb jimping on the tang. It's also the only farmer jack I know of not having a single spring. One of my favorites for many reasons.
I'll post an original Fibestos handled in next post.
wlfryjr
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This one has it's original handles and seems almost full blades,except for the kinda unusual small belly in the modified pruning blade,which is a Wharncliffe blade. as explained above in Schrades catalog cut .The handles are badly shrunk and pulled down upon the pins.
I have affixed handles with varnish to keep the pieces together. It had begun to fall apart since I got it. Otherwise original Schrade Cut Co 7309F.
I'd have to say the 7309F my favorite FJ makeup of all , even though I like other pruning blades better.
The cut isThe cut is from Schrade's 1936 supplement, which seems kinda late in the game for introducing other versions of the farmer jack. It would seem someone at Schrade wanted more of or was greatly interested in the horticultural market with all their so called "innovations and new blades". I'm certainly glad they did. from Schrade's 1936 supplement, which seems kinda late in the game for introducing other versions of the farmer jack. It would seem someone at Schrade wanted more of or was greatly interested in the horticultural market with all their so called "innovations and new blades". I'm certainly glad they did.
I have affixed handles with varnish to keep the pieces together. It had begun to fall apart since I got it. Otherwise original Schrade Cut Co 7309F.
I'd have to say the 7309F my favorite FJ makeup of all , even though I like other pruning blades better.
The cut isThe cut is from Schrade's 1936 supplement, which seems kinda late in the game for introducing other versions of the farmer jack. It would seem someone at Schrade wanted more of or was greatly interested in the horticultural market with all their so called "innovations and new blades". I'm certainly glad they did. from Schrade's 1936 supplement, which seems kinda late in the game for introducing other versions of the farmer jack. It would seem someone at Schrade wanted more of or was greatly interested in the horticultural market with all their so called "innovations and new blades". I'm certainly glad they did.
wlfryjr
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Either Camillus had the flat blades and the modified budding blades ( albeit Schrade's S7309 budder was more exaggerated) long before the Schrade 1936 supplement or the dating of the Camillus stamps is way wrong. At least 18 years ! I think not. The blades wouldn't have the old 3 line serif stamp unless they were made during that time period, no matter when the knife was put together, unless Camillus used the old stamps to mark knives at a later date !
No, I think this pick bone style jigging is more consistent with Goins dating. This knife would not fit in a lot of collections because of it's condition, but it is valuable to a "collector", because of the knowledge it carries. I love this knife and wish I had bought every old farmer jack I could've.
No, I think this pick bone style jigging is more consistent with Goins dating. This knife would not fit in a lot of collections because of it's condition, but it is valuable to a "collector", because of the knowledge it carries. I love this knife and wish I had bought every old farmer jack I could've.
waynorth
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You've shown us a couple of valuable relics, Lyle!!
It's tough piecing together cutlery history!!
Campbellclanman
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Lyle!!!
I’m just picking myself up off the floor!
What a dedicated, stunning collection of extremely hard to get knives - each and every one!
Wow!
It would be hard to choose a favourite- each knife people would scramble for - that Empire 3rd from left bottom row is pretty spectacular, then I look at the Cut CO’s, and then….
I will need to come back and read through this page!
Thank you my friend for your passion and knowledge.
I’m just picking myself up off the floor!
What a dedicated, stunning collection of extremely hard to get knives - each and every one!
Wow!
It would be hard to choose a favourite- each knife people would scramble for - that Empire 3rd from left bottom row is pretty spectacular, then I look at the Cut CO’s, and then….
I will need to come back and read through this page!
Thank you my friend for your passion and knowledge.
wlfryjr
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I've got some info to share about a farmer Jack, but I'm at the Ford dealership and don't have access to my computer.
I did put this together quickly before I left this morning.There's 3 or 4 missing, but that's the most of them. Looking from the top downwards and from the bottom upwards.
I did put this together quickly before I left this morning.There's 3 or 4 missing, but that's the most of them. Looking from the top downwards and from the bottom upwards.
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You have my attention!
Coughenour88
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Amazing collection Lyle!
waynorth
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wlfryjr
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Sorry , I took so long to post the information I recently discovered.
I found this interesting cut about the Wilbert farmer jacks . It says Sears are the initiators ( " An entirely new pattern of our own design") of the modified versions I named rooster combs ( after the term used around this way for all farmer jacks ). This cut came from " The Best of Sears Collectibles, 1905-1910".
Mine is Camillus contract. Did Camillus copy this Wilbert for their patterns? That would put Camillus Cutlery Co. in its infancy and some examples are shown above.
I edited this post after a closer look at the cut's budding blade design with the straight spline as opposed to my examples . I'd like to see a Wilbert farmer jack with the straight spline.
I found this interesting cut about the Wilbert farmer jacks . It says Sears are the initiators ( " An entirely new pattern of our own design") of the modified versions I named rooster combs ( after the term used around this way for all farmer jacks ). This cut came from " The Best of Sears Collectibles, 1905-1910".
Mine is Camillus contract. Did Camillus copy this Wilbert for their patterns? That would put Camillus Cutlery Co. in its infancy and some examples are shown above.
I edited this post after a closer look at the cut's budding blade design with the straight spline as opposed to my examples . I'd like to see a Wilbert farmer jack with the straight spline.
Last edited:
Will Power
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Very interesting sleuth work thanks for sharing it
That particular Budding blade is most attractive , a kind of hybrid Sheepfoot
Thanks, Will
waynorth
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wlfryjr
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Thanks CharlieNice score, Lyle!!
Have you got them all now??
I think I know where a couple more are.
Will Power
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Another one with sublime bone Lyle, and in beaut shape. Your persistence in ferreting out these rarities is to be respected
Thanks, Will
Thanks, Will
Campbellclanman
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Wow Lyle!
I knew you had a few... but Phew!! that's a great collection!
Those last two I can see why you were so pleased to obtain them! Wow!
I knew you had a few... but Phew!! that's a great collection!
Those last two I can see why you were so pleased to obtain them! Wow!
wlfryjr
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Thanks to you my fellow farmer aficionadoAnother one with sublime bone Lyle, and in beaut shape. Your persistence in ferreting out these rarities is to be respected
Thanks, Will
And thank you Duncan for helping me find them. I got that Wostenholm.
Campbellclanman
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Good news Lyle.