Things a father should teach his son

[TLM]

But I'm wondering if, beyond the realm of potential sexual opportunities, knowing the difference would create a divergence in treatment.

I could have guessed jsmatos as female (as neutral a word as possible, is it?) from this question. It does, depending a lot on cultural background. Which way is difficult to say but I have this funny habit of looking from above how I behave with females, I can tell from my own reaction to what category she belongs.

Then there is ofcourse the other side as grandfather once explained; you get more out of a whore well treated...

TLM

Who likes ladies better

 

[FullerH]

Maximus Otter, since you are quoting Shakespeare (or was it the Earl of Oxford? ), I'll submit this one:

"And this above all, to thine own self be true.
And it must follow as night the day,
thou canst not be false to any man."

My parents taught me that way and I find that it works well for me. Among other things, it is much simpler than trying to keep the different skeins of untruths going without one of them tripping you up.

 

[hawkpatriot]

How to tell a good guy from a bad one.
How to shake a hand.
How to drive.
How to mow a lawn.
How to use tools and do outdoor work.
How to use a table saw.
How to build things and make do with what you have.

How to discipline a future son.
How to respect people, and how to take disrespect.
To stand up for what you believe in, and be proud of it.

 

[johnniet]

Then there is ofcourse the other side as grandfather once explained; you get more out of a whore well treated...
TLM
Who likes ladies better

I think you may be missing something in my intent.

From my point of view, an honest whore is a lady.

When you are about to dance with a lady, you hold her hand on the way.

Especially if it's a lapdance.

Teases and attention whores are not ladies, and should not be treated as such. Learn how to visibly ignore them.

 

[tarsier]

I have to continue to swim against the tide on this thread.

Gollnick has asked twice for practical things that fathers should teach their sons. There are a lot of ways to learn stuff in life - from parents, friends, neighbors, coaches, teachers, and through your own experience. Everyone has something to offer. My point is that fathers should share what they know and who they are with their kids, regardless of how practical it is.

When a man has passed away, people remember him for the special things that made him unique. If you know how to hang drywall and build a deck, that's great. Teach your son, and your daughter too, for that matter. But if what you do best is to invent games to keep the kids entertained in the backyard, that's fine also. You're way ahead of most parents already, and I see absolutely no difference in value between these things. Time spent with kids doing what you enjoy is far more important than meeting artificial criteria on someone else's list.

 

[StuntDouble]

A bunch of people mentioned teaching the son how to shoot a gun..but I dont' think I saw anyone say, teach the son how to clean a gun.

 

[Gollnick]

Mr. Tarsier,

I'm not implying that things like morals or ethics arent' important. Certainly, a man should teach his son those things. But those things are taught over many years, a lifetime.

What I'm looking for here are discrete things, things that can be shared in a matter of minutes or hours but that, nevertheless, are important for the son to learn and contribute to the father/son relationship.

And here's a question: if you're a father with a son, what are you going to share with your son this weekend? Are you going to teach him to be wise and not foolish? Are you going to teach him personal integrity? Are you going to teach him to give every man thy ear, but few thy voice? Are you going to teach him to be results oriented? No. You might contribute to those lessons, sure. But you're not going to teach those lessons in an hour or even a day.

You, might, though, teach him a lot about throwing a baseball in just an hour or two. You could teach him a lot about sharpening a knife in just an hour or two. The original concept for this whole thread came from Mr. Shann spending a day teaching his son to shoot.

So, if you're a father with a son, what are you going to share with your son this weekend?

 

[MAURICE]

How to network.
How to tell which women are psycho.
How to tell which women are sexually available, and how to make friends with them. (Unless they're psycho, in which case, how to stay away from them.)

Someone needs to teach my buddy Justin that.

How to patch a hole in a wall. Learned this at an early age.

 

[Grim/Don]

I may echo some already posted, but since I have a 6 year old boy, I've got some experience with this...

How to handle a weapon, any weapon. When my son was 2, he knew to turn a knife around butt first before handing back to me (or anyone else). Same with a screwdriver. He's had his own machete for a year now.

The difference between Phillips and Standard.

Never, EVER point a gun at anyone, ever. My whole family got a sudden lesson in this when I had a 12 guage that I thought was unloaded! (Hole in the roof, no one got hurt.)

How to hit a baseball.

How to dribble and shoot a basketball. Even if no other kids in the entire world want to play, you can always shoot baskets by yourself.

How to throw a spiral football, and how to throw a frisbee.

How to swim. How to dive. Was working on this this summer, but it was too cool to go swimming too often.

How to light a fire. (we worked on this one just tonight)

How to talk like an adult, no matter what age. We never "baby-talked" our son and to this day still get compliments on how easy he is to understand (and talk to).

How to hold the light while dad works on the car (because his son will have to hold the light in his time)

How to drive (working on this with my 14 year old daughter)

How to change a tire (was working on this last week until I broke a lug off and sent my son inside before he started hearing "car-repair" words)

How to use a computer/mouse/keyboard. I know they learn it in school now, but it doesn't hurt to pick things up at home.

How to dial a home phone and cell phone.

How to check out hotties (I'm working on this but girls are still "icky")

How to be polite to everyone.

How to ride a bike (was working on this until we moved into a new house that's on a hill)

How to be safe around ladders, power tools (mowers, chainsaws, drills... ) safe around cars on jacks, safe with fire, safe around water, safe near the road... That list will never end.

How to tie knots (haven't done this yet as I'm not good myself, but it's on the agenda)

Same with how to read a compass.

How to mix concrete.

How to find books in the library.

How to pump gas! Haven't seen this one listed yet, and it can be tricky the first few times if you've never done it.

How to shave. My father laughed at me when I was trying, and it kinda hurt.

Mom does all the cooking, and he's already picking some up from her.

How to enjoy alcohol responseably.(to re-word that - How to be responsable around alcohol)

I did, or would do, most all of these with my daughter, but we went through some rough times and only became friends a few months ago. Still, I never miss a chance to teach her a skill that may come in handy. Couple weeks ago she learned a basic windmill (inside info for the thread starter! )

Grim/Don
Proud father of Zane

 

[TLM]

I think you may be missing something in my intent.

From my point of view, an honest whore is a lady.

No I did not miss that, though I disagree a bit with the last statement . In these parts of the world there actually is saying that: former whores are the most faithfull wives. I have little experience in that or maybe I wasn't told...

How to tell which women are psycho.

And teasers yes, generally this holds for both sexes equally, the area where it aches differs a bit.

Someone mentioned guns and gun cleaning me and my brothers certainly taught all our children that as early as practical.

All practical skills and everyday knowledge are important but on the long run it is the attitude in life and problem solving that takes you through.

How to tell which women are psycho.

An other way to look at this is: it is a problem to be solved, if one has developed a solution to this it certainly can be generalized to lots of human relation problems.

TLM

Who does not take life allways so seriously.

 

[jsmatos]

I could have guessed jsmatos as female (as neutral a word as possible, is it?) from this question. It does, depending a lot on cultural background. Which way is difficult to say but I have this funny habit of looking from above how I behave with females, I can tell from my own reaction to what category she belongs.

I've always believed that you can tell if a man is a true gentleman by how he treats the women who don't demand respect for themselves. Virtually all men act respectfully around a "lady." That's too easy.

 

[TLM]

I've always believed that you can tell if a man is a true gentleman by how he treats the women who don't demand respect for themselves. Virtually all men act respectfully around a "lady." That's too easy.

Now my usage of "lady" is not the british or american standard one, it is propably quite close to johnniet's. If somebody demands to be treated some way my neck hairs are up instantly, you dö not demand , you earn.

Not easy at all but your title does not affect it.

TLM

 

[jsmatos]

A lady most certainly does demand respect from others. That's not to mean that she walks around with a chip on her shoulder and orders people to behave a certain way. "Demanding respect" is a matter of presence. It's more subtle than how you seem to define it. The message is delivered (or not delivered) more through body language and verbal cues than anything else. If you have to verbally "demand" respect from others in the manner in which you seem to define it, then that battle is probably already lost (but not always). I like to think of it as a line in the sand. People don't like being around people who don't enforce their boundaries. They see them as weak (or in this situation "cheap" may be a better description), and they often treat them accordingly. The kind of respect that I am referring to is NOT earned. It is generally received by most members of society until the person behaves in a manner reflecting that it is not necessary or expected.

The idea that the kind of respect that I am referring to needs to be earned is absurd. Johnniet's explanation of respecting a lady is directly in line with mine so long as he doesn't mistreat the "attention whore" but merely chooses to ignore her. There's nothing wrong with anything he said.

As I said earlier, the sign of a true gentleman is one who treats a woman with respect even when she doesn't demand it. I stand by that statement.

 

[TLM]

I don't care if a person is a woman or not respect is never automatic. Let's say that I treat people somewhat indifferently until I get them classified.

It is a very american attitude from a woman to expect respect just because she is female. Hackles raising...

TLM

 

[Ren the devils trailboss]

Respect for a lady is mandatory in my house. My boys learn that from me, If my boys are dirsrespectful to Mom that is a offense in my house that is is the most severly punished. Men learn how to treat women from thier fathers. My boys are learning that Women are not sex objects, not maids, not cooks, not slaves, but people of undefinable beauty and grace.
With this lesson learned the following lessons of showing respect to the aged, disabled, the poor, the unfortunate, people of different race, or religion, etc. is much easier....for our house respect begins with how to treat a lady.

 

[TLM]

Might be semantics Ren or maybe not, jsmatos is using "respect" for what I call common courtesy or just plain good manners. Or maybe not, lets see...

You are easily running out of comparatives with your definition.

Respect for a lady is mandatory in my house.

You have no argument from me there. But all women are not ladies or whores or anything easily definable. They are persons to be treated with common courtesy.

Respect you earn. To say it roughly, an old idiot is an old idiot and not to be respected but unless he bothers me I leave him alone.

TLM

 

[jsmatos]

Might be semantics Ren or maybe not, jsmatos is using "respect" for what I call common courtesy or just plain good manners. Or maybe not, lets see...

We might be dealing with semantics, but I'm simply not sure. I'm really unsure how TLM defines respect. I can see how it can be an ambiguous term. Is he referring to some sort of a deeper, more abiding relationship? Is he referring to deference? I do consider "common courtesy" and "good manners" as fitting within the rubric of "respect." It also means not taking advantage of someone's low regard for themselves. Maybe that is plain "common courtesy," but I think it goes deeper. What I am envisioning is the way a man acts in the presence of a woman who he considers to be "trashy." Does he jump on the bandwagon with his buddies (or other strangers) and talk down to her? A true gentleman wouldn't act that way. My definition has remained the same.

I have this funny habit of looking from above how I behave with females, I can tell from my own reaction to what category she belongs.

TLM's above quotation reflects that his behavior towards a woman would differ depending upon how he would categorize her, ie, whether he considers her a lady or not. If he is not referring to common courtesy than what did he mean? He says it is something that can be discerned by his behavior. How so?

Respect you earn. To say it roughly, an old idiot is an old idiot and not to be respected but unless he bothers me I leave him alone.

So I guess that means that if TLM thinks that someone is an idiot then he'll avoid them. If they bother him he'll treat them like an idiot. Is that not the absence of common courtesy? Let's extend that attitude to women in various categories and see how it works out.

It is a very american attitude from a woman to expect respect just because she is female. Hackles raising..

No, women should expect respect because they are human and valuable. I think that men are equally deserving of respect for the same reasons. I'm not threatened by them. TLM's definition of respect at this point is very unclear. Maybe he defines it as a manner of honoring others, however his above statements seem to be in conflict with that definition. I might equate honoring someone for their intelligence (or some other valued characteristic) as "deep respect" (and it would likely be qualified) but not plain "respect."

I sincerely hope that the men on this forum who have daughters especially understand respect in the manner in which I define it and pass that mindset on to their daughters. I also think it should be taught in different contexts some of them will need to be done very forcefully. Teach her the difference in which situation triggers which behavior. Why? Because she's important, she's valuable, and because you love her. Otherwise, failing to do so will result in great heartache for her and for those who love her.

It sounds to me like Ren is doing a wonderful job with his children. Great job.


I AM SINCERELY SORRY TO GOLLNICK FOR RUINING HIS THREAD. I WISH THIS THREAD COULD BE SPLIT OFF AT THIS POINT B/C IT IS AN INTERESTING DISCUSSION. GOLLNICK'S TOPIC WAS ALSO VERY INTERESTING AND SHOULDN"T HAVE BEEN INTERUPTED. I AM VERY SORRY.

 

[Ren the devils trailboss]

TLM
for me all people deserve respect. THen there are people that deserve to be respected, this is what you earn.

anyway..my .02 cents...


SEBENZA!!!!!

 

[fudo]

I was told when I was small to treat every woman like a lady until she proves she isn't.
Jennifer-I don't think that a lady demands respect. I think a lady (or Gentleman)COMMANDS respect. As an example of the difference as it shows in a person's comportment-Madonna/Britney Spears/ Christina Agulera(?) on the one hand and Audrey Hepburn on the other. Dignity and character shows and should be recognised,a character lacking in dignity and class and character should also be recognised.

 

[TLM]

jsmatos my next guess is that you are propably a lawyer or equivalent, you are not thinking clearly and reading more into sentences than they say. Here goes:

a man acts in the presence of a woman who he considers to be "trashy."

Why do you think that what I think of somebody automatically shows in how I behave. I have spent enough time talking in bars with women I know to be whores (females exchanging services of sexual nature for money- nothing more nothing less) that I don't go kicking them around.

his behavior towards a woman would differ depending upon how he would categorize her

Certainly does, only the woman propably doesn't see it.

So I guess that means that if TLM thinks that someone is an idiot then he'll avoid them

This part was an answer to Ren's comment, I was saying in a roundabout way that respect does not follow from age.

woman to expect respect just because she is female

You must be a lawyer because you did not even read what I wrote "just because she is female", I don't know how to say that more clearly. This is what followed:

They are persons to be treated with common courtesy.

Wheather I feel respect towards somebody does not in any direct way imply that we have any kind of relationship.

TLM

Who agrees that we shanghaied the thread , sorry.