VTAC practical carry?

K

K.Templar

Joined
Jan 26, 2006
Messages
4
G'day all, greetings from OZ...
Got a question for ya's.
Dose any one have any advice for carrying the VTAC?
Jamed in the belt? Attatched to a web vest? handle up or down? I'm asking because as a serving soldier, and looking at heading off the the sandbox soon, I would like some advice from those who have used them, in peace or anger.
Also dose any one have any info about their use in a modern combatant role? cant seem to get any info of modern use out side of the "official" use as a breaching tool. As I'm designing a program for use in the CQB role and would like to get some examples of their use in the role, i.e: senarios.
I'm not asking for anything of a sensitive nature just broad stroke situations.

Any help would be great...

Cheers.

Karl
 
Karl, I spoke with Andy, the owner of American Tomahawk Company and he told me that there were a few instances where the VTACs were used in CQC in Iraq. If you go to the ATC website, the guy you see about to breach the door on the intro on their page was in Iraq and used the VTAC in CQC. I wont get into details because its a mess but the VTAC can and has seen combat in all forms. You will be fine with the VTAC sir. I just got one of mine and I LOVE it! It will deploy to Iraq or Afghanistan with me, for sure.
 
I'm not a soldier, but if I was, I'd carry a VTAC under my left arm (as I'm right-handed), in a Survival Sheath hawk scabbard, either on the origional harness (with Hissatsu mounted on the other side), on a sling or length of paracord tightened up so that the hawk is in or close to the armpit, or tie the sheath to the d-rings found on most LBVs or chest harnesses.

A point I'd like to make is the potential of the hawk or knife in H2H situations: If the enemy is outside of your strike range, don't discount throwing your weapon at him/her (gotta be PC). Don't worry about making it stick, any hit might be enough to make them flinch for the split-second you need to close the distance, get away from their muzzle, and/or smash their head on the ground with your empty hands after knocking them down with your body-weight.

This is just my opinion. Take what's useful, discard the rest. If my big mouth offends anyone's martial sensibilities, I apologize. But if it saves one good soldiers life, it was worth it.

Further reading (good stuff):

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=268811&highlight=vtac+iraq

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=371286&highlight=tomahawk+iraq

Good luck. Try practice chops and strikes on dead trees, too, to get a feel for things.

Take care.
 
HI Guys, thanks for your help, I will take on board this info and use it as best I can.

Dose any one have any recomendations on carry methods or positions?

Cheers
Karl

"Duty First"
 
Someone just suggested wearing a hawk under the weak arm. I'd just like to throw out that it's almost impossible to reach across your body like that with an Interceptor on, especially with all of the mags/etc that will be attached to it.
 
Good point, Skeletor.

I had read about a troop that carried one right on his weak-side chest. A bit more accessable for the encumbered grunt.

Take care.
 
When I go ice fishing I use a strip of plain Jane duct tape to secure a large screwdriver to my jacket arm. If I go through it can be ripped off my weaker arm in a second to pull myself across the ice and out. Other than that the stuff holds well and is cheap. Consider a vertical strip along the shaft securing it to a vest, bulging pocket, or around your forearm etc. If taping around the forearm do not go all the way around and have the tape overlap, or you may have a B..ch of a time yanking it off quickly. This may be applicable or not, its your call.
 
G'day digger! I'm in Baghdad, carrying my old cold steel vietnam under weak arm, blade head' to rear attached to my side armor. K-bar strong side belt. Works well.
Training is a lot like training to use a hand scythe with the addition of the spike. I recommend you check out a martials arts weapons class prior to deployment. Tell them what want to learn to use. Make yourself a light wood/cane model for practice with your friends. Get your mates involved.
The front edge is chopping, inside for cutting/hooking attacks and your rear spikes for well, spiking. Hope you never have to use it but make sure you get some training. Good luck and keep your powder dry.
 
Cheers Gents,
Upnorth thanks for the tape idea, I already use the same idea for my field dressings.
Captevil, Thanks very much for your advice, with the carry under the weak arm are you using a sheath at all? or just slipping it into your web gear?
Any way mate, keep your head down and watch your 6... oh and before I forget.. "do unto others before they do unto you..."

Cheers,

Karl

"Duty First"
 
Templar,
I use the stock sheath. Handle is free so I can tilt it to push it free. Been thinking of going to the sew shop and getting it modified with a quick release snap though.
 
You have to set your body armor up to work with your gear. I carry my rifle ammo and first aid kit down low (waist level) and my pistol ammo high. I can reach across the 9mm mags no problem so I have plenty of room across my chest.
 
Must be nice to get a pistol and a rifle.

The US Army only saw fit to issue me my M4/M203 and no pistol, then wanted me to clear roofs, spiral stairs, and tunnels.

I ended up "acquiring" and old Smith and Wesson snub .38, and carried that tucked into my belt for a time. But I digress...

I carried a hawk horizontally on my back, actually, head on the strong side, spike down. I had too much crap on my chest to place it there, and I found crap on my belt just got hung up on things when I was moving in small spaces or in and out of vehicles.
 
Yeah, it is very nice having a pistol. There are times you don't get a chance to reload and its just a lot quicker to let the rifle hang and pull the 9. I practice that drill over and over. I sure as hell hope I never need to use my hawk or knife in combat but it is nice to have them and the hawk can sure tear things up,
 
Depending on what kind of missions you're going to be doing, the way you carry your 'hawk may change from a day to day basis.

When we were doing mounted operations, I mine was usually in my Patrol Pack. Close enough I could get to it quickly, but out of the way. Humvees don't off too much in the way of room, especially when you're wearing all your kit.

I'd tuck mine into my belt, without sheath, if we were going to be dismounted. I found that when conducting negotiations with a the locals, it provided a bit of intimidation factor.

GL on your trip to the sandbox and if you need anything feel free to PM


Berdar
 
HI Guys thanks for the info.

Berdar, thanks, your advise seems to be going in the same direction as my own thoughts, Captevil, cheers again...

I find it interesting you mention the power of persuasion of the hawk in your belt during negotiations... :D

Keep safe all, watch yer backs...

Karl

"Duty First"
 
K.Templar said:
I find it interesting you mention the power of persuasion of the hawk in your belt during negotiations... :D
Click to expand...

It's just my opinion, and you know how those are, but I think that Iraqis had the same thoughts about my hawk as they do about large knives....I've seen demonstrations where rifles couldn't make them budge, but pointing a big knife in their general direction could make them scatter. I think it has to do with the fear of being decapitated.

Berdar
 
Berdar said:
It's just my opinion, and you know how those are, but I think that Iraqis had the same thoughts about my hawk as they do about large knives....I've seen demonstrations where rifles couldn't make them budge, but pointing a big knife in their general direction could make them scatter. I think it has to do with the fear of being decapitated.

Berdar
Click to expand...

Interesting Berder, I have a friend who got back from Iraq not too long ago and he stated that he would have his M4 and some of the Iraqis would come towards him and in an effort to get them back he would point in their general direction... He said that they arent deterred by a rifle as much as they are a pistol. Evidentally, he said that that was the method Saddams men would execute them by...
 
Hi Karl,

I am going to be at RMC/ADFA on the 14th, 15th and 16th of Feb with Ray Floro working with the MUC Cell on edged weapons, I have some good hawk material I am happy to work with you on if you are in the area, if you are in or near sydney feel free to email me for contact details.

All the best,

Jim.

www.florofighting.com
 
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