CBSA (Canadian border services agency) cracking down on folders entering Canada

shane45-1911 said:
You are looking at a very specific section, and putting far more weight to it than warranted.

"Subordinate legislation" is a broad term used to interpret the "spirit" or intent of any given law and granted to the agency that typically enforces it - the CBSA, in this case.

It is NOT creating a law, as THAT CAN ONLY BE DONE THROUGH PARLIAMENT. It is simply the functional interpretation of any existing laws that the enforcing agency defines. It is subject to legal and parliamentary approval, and does not grant any power to create new legislatation.
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From what I am understanding though…is that even though they can’t make one, then can revise one.
 
Hm, just checked Warrior&Wonder, they just received a new shipment on June 22, which include a bunch of the latest flippers. So at this point I don't know how much weight to put on this "news". For all I know, it's a single triage office being a bit overzealous, not a pan Canadian thing.
 
Floatingby said:
Hm, just checked Warrior&Wonder, they just received a new shipment on June 22, which include a bunch of the latest flippers. So at this point I don't know how much weight to put on this "news". For all I know, it's a single triage office being a bit overzealous, not a pan Canadian thing.
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I received my package of a TRM Atom and MBK Old Mini Guard last week. Inspected and sent on it’s way.

Not sure myself when this “new examination” is going to start or if it even has.
 
It’s probably just the way the one CBSA agent that Cleary talked to on the phone does it. That is the agent who you hope doesn’t open your package of slipjoints. 😂🤣
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
From what I am understanding though…is that even though they can’t make one, then can revise one.
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No. They can interpret the law, but cannot revise one.

This should make it clearer for you....

The criminal code of Canada does not specifically state how much force is required to allow a knife to be flicked open. Therefore, the CBSA has been granted "subordinate legislation" power to interpret the spirit or intent of the law. The CBSA can define what amount of force is required to deem if a knife may be opened by gravity assist.

It is an attempt to add common sense interpretation to the enforcement of a law, yet often times it fails miserably and just adds more confusion.

A man's arm strength is typically stronger than a woman's, so it is far easier for a male CBSA officer to flick open a knife versus his female colleague. Yet the law remains - "NO GRAVITY KNIVES". Therefore, that same knife may be both legal and illegal, depending upon who is doing the flicking.

Understand?
 
Floatingby said:
Hm, just checked Warrior&Wonder, they just received a new shipment on June 22, which include a bunch of the latest flippers. So at this point I don't know how much weight to put on this "news". For all I know, it's a single triage office being a bit overzealous, not a pan Canadian thing.
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All the major Canadian points of entry (and theoretically, the smaller ones) have the exact same SOP.

Most of the major US manufacturers are aware of the Canadian law, and I suspect many of them are tightening pivots to allow them admission into Canada.

And since CBSA has no "force standard" to define how much or little is required to flick open a knife and deem it illegal, I know that many of the agents are erring on the side of common sense and clearing the shipments into Canada.
 
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I do understand that…so since the law doesn’t state what position the blade has to be in before the “flick,” then all folding knives will be illegal based on the CBSA.
 
shane45-1911 said:
All the major Canadian points of entry have the exact same SOP.

Most of the major US manufacturers are aware of the Canadian law, and I suspect many of them are tightening pivots to allow them admission into Canada.
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They may have the same SOP, but they do not all follow it the same way I can state for a FACT.

I refuse to ship through one of our ports of entry cause those folks seem to have gone off the rails. Haha.
 
I do think we can agree that all this is pretty silly, yes? shane45-1911 shane45-1911

I gotta get some shuteye, morning comes quickly. 👍🏼
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
They may have the same SOP, but they do not all follow it the same way I can state for a FACT.

I refuse to ship through one of our ports of entry cause those folks seem to have gone off the rails. Haha.
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Again, no argument because they are trying to enforce a law that is so vague that it almost unenforceable to any given standard.

There are "good" offices and "bad" offices, mostly defined by the volume of humans and goods they process every day. The good offices don't have time for petty enforcement of a vague law. The "bad" ones have too much time on their hands and make a point of trying to enforce every law to their own worst-case interpretation of it.
 
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Sharp & Fiery said:
I do understand that…so since the law doesn’t state what position the blade has to be in before the “flick,” then all folding knives will be illegal based on the CBSA.
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Yes, another undefined parameter of a law that is expected to be enforced.

Too many variables and non-specified parameters make this law WIDE open to interpretation. Sad that it ever reached this state.
 
Well, look like we're screwed, we're gonna have to keep pivot screws permanently jammed. Purchasing from the US, or any other free country, will be awfully complicated.

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Source: https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/cn-ad/cn18-01-eng.html
 
shane45-1911 said:
Quite a grey area, Ken.

Yes, the Canadian brick and mortar stores still have old new stock which may be purchased, and possession is not illegal in Canada.

And if those same brick and mortar stores can convince manufacturers to tighten up any pivots substantially before shipping future orders to Canada, that lessens the chance of seizure. Remember, it is the ACTION of the knife - not the knife itself - that is subject to interpretation and enforcement.
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I have and will no doubt continue to have zero problem buying folding knives of various kinds, including those with assisted opening, from the knife retailers I do business with, within Canada. If I want a folder and it's not offered by a Canadian retailer (rare for non-autos), then I don't buy it until they do. It's likely to be an expensive knife if I'm fishing around outside my borders for a folder, so I'm not going to chance it being scooped up. You won't get a criminal record if it's confiscated, but you could if you contest the seizure and lose your case, which should not be the case.

I have zero problems bringing in fixed blades from anywhere in the World (aside from the few countries where economic sanctions would get in the way or it's from somewhere I don't buy fixed blades from).
shane45-1911 said:
Ah, that's your first mistake my friend.

As I referenced above, Canadians don't have rights - we have "privileges". We have no constitution that grants any rights.
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The Canadian Constitution contains the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. There's a bunch of them. The right to watch Hockey Night in Canada for free is held sacred from coast to coast to coast.
 
shane45-1911 said:
Absolutely no disagreement there.

That's the problem of not having a constitution to protect and clarify our laws in Canada. NOTHING is protected because everything we have in Canada is a "privilege", and we all know that privileges can easily be revoked....

The Court of Interpretation makes far more rulings up here, than a Court of Law.
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Summed it up perfect
 
I guess if you cross the Border: be aware of this, and carry an "appropriate" knife...
Thanks for posting the video! 👍
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No, I don't believe a word of it.To be honest, I sat through Kevin video even though I find him and his voice annoying.

For the record, I received my DLT order consisting of ladybugs and CRK pocket clip last week. The package was not opened but I was taxed for the privilege.Apparently ladybugs are considered Jewelry by CBSA.
 
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