first try at a butterfly sheath

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vilePossum

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well, this is my first try at a butterfly sheath (my new edc needed a sheath), and as usual i learned quite a bit from it.









a couple of things:

- i am not satisfied with my work with the stitching awl. didn't get the hang on it this first time. i'll have to see if it improves over time. currently i am more satisfied with armitage's way of creating a faux saddle stich in round holes.
- the tiger thread is great! really, it's just worlds apart from what i used up til now. 0.8mm tiger thread and 001 john james needles (those suckers are pointy for stitching needles)
- applying 2 coats of bag kote over the coloured tooling and then putting the antique past on with a toothbrush worked reasonably well. it shows the best at the outer border of the green. sealed it with another layer of bag kote.
- i need to be a bit more generous with space. the sheath was almost too tight at the throat, i had to wet it on the inside an leave the knife in over night (wrapped the handle in saran wrap).
- next time i won't skive the liner. seems unnecessary to me. also made it harder to glue the pieces/more work to grind flat afterwards.
- how do you guys avoid the "stretch" marks when punching your stitching holes? are my awls not sharp enough, or did the colour not penetrate deep enough?

overall i am reasonably satisfied for a first try. oh, one more thing... there has to be a better way than blocking with finish to make dual/multi coloured leather pieces. i tried a brush this time, but i messed up anyways and wasn't satisfied at all with the eveness of the saturation. how do you guys do it? anybody tried frog tape?
 
vilePossum said:
well, this is my first try at a butterfly sheath (my new edc needed a sheath), and as usual i learned quite a bit from it.

::snip::

a couple of things:

- i am not satisfied with my work with the stitching awl. didn't get the hang on it this first time. i'll have to see if it improves over time. currently i am more satisfied with armitage's way of creating a faux saddle stich in round holes.
I see what you mean. What I suggest is using an "overstitch wheel" that marks the stitch hole locations for you.
- the tiger thread is great! really, it's just worlds apart from what i used up til now. 0.8mm tiger thread and 001 john james needles (those suckers are pointy for stitching needles)
- applying 2 coats of bag kote over the coloured tooling and then putting the antique past on with a toothbrush worked reasonably well. it shows the best at the outer border of the green. sealed it with another layer of bag kote.
- i need to be a bit more generous with space. the sheath was almost too tight at the throat, i had to wet it on the inside an leave the knife in over night (wrapped the handle in saran wrap).
- next time i won't skive the liner. seems unnecessary to me. also made it harder to glue the pieces/more work to grind flat afterwards.
- how do you guys avoid the "stretch" marks when punching your stitching holes? are my awls not sharp enough, or did the colour not penetrate deep enough?
I would say your awl is 1. not sharp enough; 2. too large for the thread you are using and 3. use a stitching pony that lets you work hands free
overall i am reasonably satisfied for a first try. oh, one more thing... there has to be a better way than blocking with finish to make dual/multi coloured leather pieces. i tried a brush this time, but i messed up anyways and wasn't satisfied at all with the eveness of the saturation. how do you guys do it? anybody tried frog tape?
Can't answer you here but I've always dyed the pieces independently and before assembling them as a whole unit.
Click to expand...

To sharpen your awls, watch this man:

[video=youtube;wvY9beqObiQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvY9beqObiQ[/video]

and the overstitch wheel:

[video=youtube;PhQYtw8IrQs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhQYtw8IrQs[/video]
 
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yeah, i know about nigel, i will have to watch this. also good idea about a more solid base, i was using kork, but a soft wood is probably the better choice, thanks.
i did use the overstitching wheel on the top (and failed to hit the right spots several times :D ), but i am having trouble aligning the backside proberly to use a groover and the overstitching wheel there as well. and yes, if i push the stitching awl all the way in/through it will create a diamond larger than the groove.
as for the colouring, if those were different pieces i would dye them seperately, but it is just one piece of leather with different colours.
thanks for the sharpening link!
 
ok. I also found this...which might be the answer to your issue:

Fine-Diamond-Chisel-88057-08.jpg-600x




Tandy Leather, "fine diamond chisel" 8 Prong. 3.5 mm is about 7 holes per inch. Here's Nigel going over the differences in the chisels. This is one of a few in a series:

[video=youtube;ThGbDAcK04o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThGbDAcK04o[/video]
 
It's hard to tell from the pic, but the sheath does not appear to be lined. If it is lined with leather, the liner does not need to be skived - only if it's deerskin or other such soft material.
 
na, i didn't line it, that might be due for the next one. only have a very limited supply of soft leather. sorry, i used the wrong, didn't mean the liner but the welt which protects the stitching. that one was skived, though crudely with a single razor blade.
 
I'm not big on pouch sheaths myself. I did one recently though for myself, just to see if I can
Sorry, I don't mean to kidnap your thread, but I'll post 2 pics if you don't mind

 
na, i don't mind, go right ahead.
how did you do your holes/stitching? way cleaner then mine?
also can you take a picture with the tip facing the camera? i'm curious how the end of the folded spine section looks like. when i do the "normal" pouch style i usually just leave it sort of as a draining hole.
also very nice job on the dangler and the lower buckle.
 
I marked a line with a compass, marked the holes with the wheel and then drilled the holes.

I gave up punching the holes after doing a small sheath made from 9oz leather, 3 layers of that and the chisel was getting stuck every time, took me much longer to punch the holes than to stitch the thing...
 
I didn't do a drainage hole in this, it's all 3 layers along the stitching line on this one.
 
I never drill my holes because drilling removes material. When you prick your holes with an awl as I do you only move the fiber and it doesn´t weaken the leather. i mostly make a groove, wet it and use a stitchwheel and than prick the holes with the awl. With knife sheaths I usely use a punch like the picture like druid189 posted. With one of these you don´t have to use a stitchwheel. Very important is that your groove or line is straight.
I use diamond shape sewing awls with 1-2 and 4 teeth.
 
I know, there's much dislike for drilling the holes among makers...
However today I held a Rowe Leather sheath that's 15+ years and kicking, and that thing was most definitely drilled.
And some say that the groove in leather actually removes the strongest part of it, so there's no way to satisfy everyone...
 
okay, somehow my post got lost.
sure you can't have everything. to me the problem is proper alignment of the grooves front and back. and the hole punching with the awls... and many more things :D still, i only started in february. so i am still very much experimenting with every single pieve i make. i am not yet set on awl or drilling or whatever. for example i will have to make a leather working pony. this will probably make working with the awl easier. then again, i at least managed to finally aquire a granite slab, so tooling work and with an intermediate layer using stitching punches might work as well. quite undecided yet, and since i only have a certain amount of money to spend each month (i get allowances from my wife :D ) i have to prioritize and improvise :)
 
I also have been playing with leather for only a few months.
I don't groove (sometimes on the INSIDE I do), I mark a line and holes and after drilling, using small brush and cold water I wet the leather as I stitch, this allows me to pull the thread into the leather.
Not a big fan of the stitching awl either, prefer the saddle stitch (a 70's booklet by Al Stohlman says that when thread is broken saddle stitch will only loosen, while lock stitch will lead to separation of layers [if not glued]).

There is a big difference for guys who only have a little space available to do stuff and those with a workshop.
 
there sure is. interesting technique about wetting the leather and stitching afterwards. what about dyes? do you dye afterwards or use predyed leather or maybe no dye at all?
cause your stitchin looks really neat in a way that i'd usually associate with a groove.
 
vilePossum said:
there sure is. interesting technique about wetting the leather and stitching afterwards. what about dyes? do you dye afterwards or use predyed leather or maybe no dye at all?
cause your stitchin looks really neat in a way that i'd usually associate with a groove.
Click to expand...

I usually wetform first, let the leather mostly dry, then dye, glue, mark, drill and stitch. By the time the leather dries after stitching I can see if another application of dye is needed. Of course I let the dye dry overnight, or at least a few hours before continuing .
 
wow amazing. really cool work. so do you apply the finish after stitching? cause the finish is often enough at least water reppellent.
i am still trying to find a consistent order of techniques, the usual is:

- wetforming, then letting the leather dry
- marking, groovin, stamping and punching the holes
- dye, letting the dye dry
- atomic wax
- finish
- glue everything together
- stitching
- dying the edges and letting it dry
- burnishing and finishing the edges

i am also not quite sure whether the atomic wax + finish is overkill but well...
so many things... lol, i guess like with everything practices makes perfect, but i am still looking for the best practice ;) one i get my hands on a powered burnishing wheel (or make one myself) i will give beeswax a try, as it seems to give a hardier edge after rehardening compared to gum trag.
 
elof_alv said:
I know, there's much dislike for drilling the holes among makers...
However today I held a Rowe Leather sheath that's 15+ years and kicking, and that thing was most definitely drilled.
And some say that the groove in leather actually removes the strongest part of it, so there's no way to satisfy everyone...
Click to expand...

Since I haven't seen the Rowe sheath I can't be sure, but if it came out of Kenny's shop I'm almost sure it was machine stitched on a heavy stitcher. He has a very complete mechanized shop and while hand stitching is not out if the question, it is very unlikely.

Secondly, the Black sheath you posted above is really a fine looking piece and the construction design of the sheath fits that knife perfectly.

Paul
 
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