Rat Worx MRX Chain Drive Auto Knife

I've watched some, and I don't see any that really stress the latch area much. I do like the stabbing tests on oil drums, phone books, and plywood that I've seen, and I know that Rat Worx is planning to do a video showing them cutting a car door with the knife by hammering the hinge area, sort of like batoning. They actually did this first, but the video itself was low quality, and when they redid it, they thought that using an air chisel would better demonstrate the strength of the blade.

All of the "chopping" I've seen was actually batoning even though they said they were "chopping," which is not really a test of the latch area of the blade. I haven't seen any tests of someone taking a big swing at limbs, etc.

Anyway, at this point I am just trying to pass the expectations on to the designer so he understands what people think he needs to show in order to satisfy the claim of "World's Strongest Auto Knife." They actually enjoy the challenge, it seems.
 
TWANGnBANG said:
I've watched some, and I don't see any that really stress the latch area much. I do like the stabbing tests on oil drums, phone books, and plywood that I've seen, and I know that Rat Worx is planning to do a video showing them cutting a car door with the knife by hammering the hinge area, sort of like batoning. They actually did this first, but the video itself was low quality, and when they redid it, they thought that using an air chisel would better demonstrate the strength of the blade.

All of the "chopping" I've seen was actually batoning even though they said they were "chopping," which is not really a test of the latch area of the blade. I haven't seen any tests of someone taking a big swing at limbs, etc.

Anyway, at this point I am just trying to pass the expectations on to the designer so he understands what people think he needs to show in order to satisfy the claim of "World's Strongest Auto Knife." They actually enjoy the challenge, it seems.
Click to expand...

:thumbup::thumbup: That is great to hear and again what I was hoping, that they would hear/read some of this concern and address it.

To my eyes, the air-hammer demonstration looks like slight-of-hand as the blade is subjected to LESS stress (impact and lateral force) than if it were chopping or being batonned, and it certainly puts far less stress on the pivot area. The test could easily be repeated with a much thinner blade. I would LOVE to see the door-hinge video, especially as that is a point of pride for Swamp Rat owners, a user once used a swamp rat fixed blade to successfully cut through car door hinges. It isn't really practical, but it certainly demonstrates strength and fracture resistance!

An example of chopping with so small a blade is seen in the BM Adamas 'test' from vininull, start at 12:17

[video=youtube_share;LWz_JLXgIL0]http://youtu.be/LWz_JLXgIL0?t=12m17s[/video]

In this video, it isn't the Auto Adamas but the manual is almost identical in tang structure - what the manual can endure, so can the auto. Batonning is far more practical so is featured more prominently as here:

[video=youtube;YgAtWhKBfKw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgAtWhKBfKw[/video]

And again, I don't know that the Rat Worx would fail where each challenger would succeed based on the inherent weak points, but since we know what those weak-points are, it seems unfair to me to declare it to be even "strong" (no superlative) until those weaknesses have been tested and demonstrate performance. I'm not asking to see a knife destroyed, rather to see it survive as others have, thus dispelling any doubts about its strength and durability. Thank you for the honest replies :thumbup:
 
I wonder if it'd be possible to design a manual like this? Instead of a button, there's a slide (On the top, or the side.) of sorts that drags the chain back and forth (And the blade.) - the chain is attached to a wheel that is attached to the blade. Could be a framelock, axis lock, etc.
 
jac_solar said:
I wonder if it'd be possible to design a manual like this? Instead of a button, there's a slide (On the top, or the side.) of sorts that drags the chain back and forth (And the blade.) - the chain is attached to a wheel that is attached to the blade. Could be a framelock, axis lock, etc.
Click to expand...

What would be the point?

The chain is there to extend the reach of the springs and give them purchase on the tang. Most designs feature a coil-spring around the pivot or a leaf-spring (torsion bar) against the tang to provide the energy of deployment, but these long springs may be more durable/reliable for repeated operation. The chain is overbuilt for its purpose as it is, but remove the springs to make it a "manual" folder and the chain becomes superfluous, as does the special gear milling in the tang, just a gimmick that makes the knife more difficult to deploy. Remove the chain and springs and you have a button-lock folder just like the Hogue EX-01 -03 -04 or a de-assisted Gerber Propel, etc.

Nevertheless, there may be a market for such designs...
 
chiral.grolim said:
What would be the point?

The chain is there to extend the reach of the springs and give them purchase on the tang. Most designs feature a coil-spring around the pivot or a leaf-spring (torsion bar) against the tang to provide the energy of deployment, but these long springs may be more durable/reliable for repeated operation. The chain is overbuilt for its purpose as it is, but remove the springs to make it a "manual" folder and the chain becomes superfluous, as does the special gear milling in the tang, just a gimmick that makes the knife more difficult to deploy. Remove the chain and springs and you have a button-lock folder just like the Hogue EX-01 -03 -04 or a de-assisted Gerber Propel, etc.

Nevertheless, there may be a market for such designs...
Click to expand...

Indeed, it wouldn't really be practical, it'd just be some fun piece of engineering. I was thinking that a manual knife could just screw the wheel directly ontop of the blade, without milling out some part of it, to provide full control over deployment. This would also provide a secondary lock of sorts.

However, this would also require a gear ratio setup - on a normal folder, the slide on the top of the frame won't have enough room to directly, 1:1 push the chain out (That wouldn't be much fun anyhow.), so the distance the slide has to travel would have to be reduced. Or, perhaps, instead of a slide, it would use a wheel (On top of the folder.) that you turn - wheel is attached to a gear, gear connects to a smaller gear, smaller gear connects to the chain.
 
So, Rat Worx tried to do a few tests based upon what we were discussing today. They put them both up on their Facebook page. These are only the first two of several tests they plan, but they actually are a very busy specialty machine shop and could only do a few things in the shop today. As engineers, they wanted to see these in slow motion, but I think it actually detracts from the amount of force being applied in each strike. In each case, they are swinging as hard as you would to drive a nail. Keep that in mind as you watch these 1/8 speed videos. Oh, and note that this knife is still #11, their test dummy that has been used in every durability test to day without any repair except resharpening and recoating the blade.

Lateral and tip hits with hammer:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=655572827840802&set=vb.100001642729958

Thrusts into plywood:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=655578444506907&set=vb.100001642729958
 
Last edited:
TWANGnBANG said:
Ohhhh... Here's one of them in real speed!

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=655568617841223&set=vb.100001642729958

He's also going to do a similar video with the blade on a 2x4, hitting right at the hinge of the blade. I don't know how soon that will be up, but he said he's already done exactly the same thing cutting the door panel as I previously mentioned.
Click to expand...

:eek: Holy ...

Wow. I still don't understand why they bothered with the internal stop-pin, but, assuming that knife is built the same as all the others (and they deserve that assumption), all of my concerns are silenced. Impact resistance? CHECK! :thumbup:


And let me add, THANK YOU to both TWANGnBANG and Rat Worx for seeing this through and responding professionally to these challenges. I agree, the slow-motion videos did not capture the performance as well. OutSTANDING !!!



Wow.
 
chiral.grolim said:
:eek: Holy ...

Wow. I still don't understand why they bothered with the internal stop-pin, but, assuming that knife is built the same as all the others (and they deserve that assumption), all of my concerns are silenced. Impact resistance? CHECK! :thumbup:


And let me add, THANK YOU to both TWANGnBANG and Rat Worx for seeing this through and responding professionally to these challenges. I agree, the slow-motion videos did not capture the performance as well. OutSTANDING !!!



Wow.
Click to expand...

I don't think TWANGnBANG is affiliated with Rat Worx.
 
jac_solar said:
I don't think TWANGnBANG is affiliated with Rat Worx.
Click to expand...

No, but I am keeping them up to date on this thread and ideas to help them demonstrate the strength of the MRX. They are really great people and respond quickly to customers and non-customers, alike. That's a great reflection on what you get with your "Lifetime Warranty." It really means something to Rat Worx.
 
OK. They put up two more abuse videos using a different knife because they were didn't want the cutout for the air chisel to mess up their mallet. The first video is in 1/8 speed, and the second is the other side done in real time. Notice the really bad mis-hits and the obvious hits right in front of the pivot.

There is just no way this knife is going to break due to the slot for the internal stop pin, inherent weakness or not. It just goes to show how great CPM154 is when done right.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=655967554467996&set=vb.100001642729958

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=656012164463535&set=vb.100001642729958
 
Firestrike said:
Quite expensive for something that has 2 very obvious weak points, on the plus side they do offer a lifetime warranty.
Click to expand...

I will now eat my own words...

Thank You Twang-N-Bang, for doing some excellent investigative reporting.

Seems that this knife is just a wee bit tougher than I had imagined.
 
TWANGnBANG said:
.. Notice the really bad mis-hits and the obvious hits right in front of the pivot.

There is just no way this knife is going to break due to the slot for the internal stop pin, inherent weakness or not. It just goes to show how great CPM154 is when done right.
Click to expand...

:thumbup::thumbup:

My regards to Rat Worx for an impressive product, makes me wish autos were legal in Wisconsin.

And in regard to the inherent weaknesses, well you could break it and that's where it'd go, but the sucker sure ain't going to make it easy! Who does their CPM154? Firestrike is right on, "just a wee bit tougher than imagined". Awesome :thumbup:
 
It's very cool to see a new company respond to the questions/concerns of potential customers. If they offer a warranty to back up what they say and show their knives can do I imagine they could do quite well for themselves.
 
TWANGnBANG said:
OK. They put up two more abuse videos using a different knife because they were didn't want the cutout for the air chisel to mess up their mallet. The first video is in 1/8 speed, and the second is the other side done in real time. Notice the really bad mis-hits and the obvious hits right in front of the pivot.
Click to expand...

Awesome! I love the second video, it's great to see how hard they're actually hitting the knife. :thumbup:

Good on ya for shutting down the haters. ;):D
 
Hello , everyone,
First I'd like to say thank you to Twangandbang for a great video on our new knife. Thanks to all for your interest and questions , I really appreciate the criticism. It gives me new ideas
for torture testing the knife. We are the type of guys that like to build things and then try to wreck them to see what they can take. We believe in handling the finest products available. I will explain
a couple of things about why we did what we did with the knife. The stop pin is where it is because of the roller chain. We could not put the stop pin externally. We like it on the inside because
it keeps the knife looking clean. It has the added benefit that in many knives, if you pinch them , they will open slowly or not at all. The MRX stop pin makes it so you can pinch the knife as hard as you
can, and it is impossible to keep it from opening. The other benefit is that from the lock button to pivot to stop pin is as far apart as possible which means the blade locks up extremely tightly. It gives better
bridging than if it were on the top or near the top of the handle close to the lock button. It will give many years of the blade locking up hard. Another benefit of the stop pin
being inside is that it makes a very nice way to stop the blade just as it locks closed. Don't be afraid to ask questions, we love to answer them. We have had tremendous interest in the MRX and they are
selling very well. We hope our customers are happy for many lifetimes. Allen Millhouse , RAT WORX, Inc.
 
I just ordered a mini Rat Worx with a polished double grind blade as they are in the works of making another run of them and almost finished. I'm alittle upset with Microtech for not fixing my cmtx, I had to ship it out for someone else to fix. Microtech does make a nice knife but I am stoked for the Rat Works as it is going to be my everyday knife,
Jimmy Erbe
S.C.
 
My Rat Worx is due here Friday and I am excited.I Love everything I've seen of this knife. It will be a star in my small collection of 16 folders (for now).
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top