31 Screws Keep Backing Out

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The pivot and stop pin screws were backing out on my 31 while trying to break it in. The action was still really stiff with the screws fully tightened. Then I noticed that pushing the detent completely off the blade would allow it to move freely, so it definitely wasn't the washers causing excess friction.

I bent the lock bar out a little to relieve some of the tension and all the issues I had went away. The action is smooth with the screws tightened down, I can disengage the lock or open the blade without pain, and the screws have not backed out since.

Disclaimer:
Please be careful if you attempt this. You could potentially damage the knife or make the lockup unsafe.

Just wanted to share my experience for those who are having this problem. Whether it was simply breaking in the washers or tweaking the lock bar that seems to have fixed the issue of screws backing out, I am not sure because both things happened about the same time.
 
dannyp said:
The pivot and stop pin screws were backing out on my 31 while trying to break it in. The action was still really stiff with the screws fully tightened. Then I noticed that pushing the detent completely off the blade would allow it to move freely, so it definitely wasn't the washers causing excess friction.

I bent the lock bar out a little to relieve some of the tension and all the issues I had went away. The action is smooth with the screws tightened down, I can disengage the lock or open the blade without pain, and the screws have not backed out since.

Disclaimer:
Please be careful if you attempt this. You could potentially damage the knife or make the lockup unsafe.

Just wanted to share my experience for those who are having this problem. Whether it was simply breaking in the washers or tweaking the lock bar that seems to have fixed the issue of screws backing out, I am not sure because both things happened about the same time.
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Maybe the tension on the lock bar and the vibration it gives locking in backed out the screws?

Still VERY sceptical on the whole 31 ordeal..

Especially considering the price asked.
 
dannyp said:
I bent the lock bar out a little to relieve some of the tension and all the issues I had went away. The action is smooth with the screws tightened down, I can disengage the lock or open the blade without pain, and the screws have not backed out since.
Click to expand...

Please be aware that this sort of "fix" is what caused CRK to add the stop disc on the Umnumzaan. Folks didn't like the action, they messed with the lockbar tension, and eventually enough of these quietly broken knives got around through secondary sales forced a design change.

You do you, but I thought it was worth mentioning.
 
Possibly, but I'm not sure. Like I mentioned, I think the washers wore in about the same time and maybe that allowed the screws to tighten all the way and grip a little better. I never did have a problem with the rear screw at all.
 
jmclfrsh said:
It's a shame you're having these issues on such an anticipated knife. Maybe Chris will step in as these issues mount and can offer a fix.

He's retired, but not dead. And I'm pretty certain he still cares, As his name is on the building, after all.

Best of Luck my friends.
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Chris might as well be dead. He hasn't been seen or heard from in years. It's the Ann&Tim show now and they won't paricipate here.
 
I don't know if this is silly but is it possible some fluorinated grease got on the surface of the titanium where the screw should gall against? Some alcohol on the surface and screw might help if it is. I have a small micarta 31 and have had so many 21s and mine is every bit as good in fit in finish and the changes seem to be improvements to me. The lockbar tension is definitely a lot stronger, I dissembled it taking out the blade like recommended and the bar slammed to the opposite side with authority. I have found that it's not the washers that cause tightness but almost entirely the lock bar, like Danny said
 
We all have to retire eventually.Chris is there when needed,be sure of that. I'am also sure that Tim and Ann are aware of these issues which customers complain about.Bottom line is that we all forgot to use our knives and stop bickering and searching for the needle in the haystack.If 31 is not your cup just get 21 which are plenty for picking.Simple as that.Cheers.
 
rexromic said:
We all have to retire eventually.Chris is there when needed,be sure of that. I'am also sure that Tim and Ann are aware of these issues which customers complain about.Bottom line is that we all forgot to use our knives and stop bickering and searching for the needle in the haystack.If 31 is not your cup just get 21 which are plenty for picking.Simple as that.Cheers.
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Screws backing out of a $400 knife is not bickering, it's a f-up. Not responding on a company forum is a business strategy to avoid adressing a firm's f-ups.
 
brownshoe said:
Screws backing out of a $400 knife is not bickering, it's a f-up. Not responding on a company forum is a business strategy to avoid adressing a firm's f-ups.
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I think “f-up” is an extremely inaccurate characterization. It’s a tool, put a dab or Loctite on it if you have a problem with it is my take. It’s easier and more reliable than any other action you could take.

Should it happen? No. Give CRK a call and send the knife in.
 
Just a thought in general, which can be applied to knives. If we all just put some loctite/thread tape on, and nobody complains, the company will take it as acceptable. So all new models may have these “quirks”. This is not acceptable to me, and we should be holding companies accountable for their claims. Unless we want inferior products in the future.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
Just a thought in general, which can be applied to knives. If we all just put some loctite/thread tape on, and nobody complains, the company will take it as acceptable. So all new models may have these “quirks”. This is not acceptable to me, and we should be holding companies accountable for their claims. Unless we want inferior products in the future.
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While i have no problems with the loctite, @Sharp&Fiery is absolutely correct. When people just accept what they are given why would any company make a change? These knives have been made for many years, something has changed and this should be addressed.

Having said that, I do still enjoy my only 31 but really looking at the 21's more and more.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
Just a thought in general, which can be applied to knives. If we all just put some loctite/thread tape on, and nobody complains, the company will take it as acceptable. So all new models may have these “quirks”. This is not acceptable to me, and we should be holding companies accountable for their claims. Unless we want inferior products in the future.
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Best way to do that is to give them a call and send it in.
 
Josh K said:
Best way to do that is to give them a call and send it in.
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I would say this is one way yes, which has been done. Just waiting on results.

Don’t underestimate the power of social media. There is a reason politicians, celebrities and others use social media.
Im not the type of person to “sweep issues under the rug.”

I hope CRK makes me proud.
 
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Sharp & Fiery said:
Don’t underestimate the power of social media. There is a reason politicians, celebrities and others use social media.
Im not the type of person to “sweep issues under the rug.”
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I agree publicity/public perception does play a factor. However, I would also point out that if CRK gets 50+ knives back a week for loose screws or whatever other reason, it's much harder to ignore.
 
Josh K said:
I agree publicity/public perception does play a factor. However, I would also point out that if CRK gets 50+ knives back a week for loose screws or whatever other reason, it's much harder to ignore.
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Definitely not implying that you do this Josh, but there are a lot of posters saying “just put locktight on it.” Which doesnt actually inform CRK of how many knives this is actually happening to.

I 100% agree with your assessment quoted above. Forget the locktite and thread tape, and send them in. Let see what kind of numbers are there.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
Definitely not implying that you do this Josh, but there are a lot of posters saying “just put locktight on it.” Which doesnt actually inform CRK of how many knives this is actually happening to.
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It is hard for me to split advice. Personally, I put a dab of Loctite on everything because it gives me peace of mind. Not implying anyone can't tighten screws or whatnot, but the factory screws from CRK are tight. Makes a little crack noise most of the time when unscrewing it for the first time. Are folks tightening them enough? I would feel extra silly suggesting that someone crank down on it only to end up with a stripped hex screw.

Sharp & Fiery said:
I 100% agree with your assessment quoted above. Forget the locktite and thread tape, and send them in. Let see what kind of numbers are there.
Click to expand...

I shouldn't be dismissive of the issue, this is 100% the right advice.
 
Josh K said:
It is hard for me to split advice. Personally, I put a dab of Loctite on everything because it gives me peace of mind. Not implying anyone can't tighten screws or whatnot, but the factory screws from CRK are tight. Makes a little crack noise most of the time when unscrewing it for the first time. Are folks tightening them enough? I would feel extra silly suggesting that someone crank down on it only to end up with a stripped hex screw.



I shouldn't be dismissive of the issue, this is 100% the right advice.
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Truth be told...I do put thread tape on the pivots of my CRK users. There are so many variables to why pivot screws come loose. Some are by accidental bad tolerances from the factory, some are from use (possible torque or too much torque sideways), and other variables.
However, if just sitting on the couch and the pivot screw backs out...that’s just bad tolerances.
I do give CRK kudo’s for trying the new hardened lathed stop pin. But I believe this is where all the issues in the 31 is originating. I do remember reading a post from someone who has installed the new PP in the 21 and its working fine...so those pins must have perfectly parallel shoulders. :)
I guess my biggest quam at the moment is that CRK is reknown for their amazing tolerances and quality, which makes the knives worth the money. So for me it’s just disappointing that CRK hasnt addressed the issues.
I absolutely love my 21’s, Reg’s, Zaan’s and Mnandi’s. Im just having a super hard time loving my two 31’s with the “quirks.”
Im hoping that CRK will continue to strive to make knives that live up to the CRK name. :)

Thank you for the conversation, Josh. I love productive conversations. Bickering is for children. ;)
 
Sebenzas are not supposed to need loktite by design. If it needs loktite to stay together, CRK screwed up. Chris Reeve was proud of the fact the Sebenza didn't need screw glue to keep it together...it's kind of a tool and die maker thing.
 
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