CPM-20CV: Tough Enough?

afishhunter

Basic Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2014
Messages
8,661
And if I'm not really worried? Can I then get some opinions and discussion on 20CV?
You asked a question, I answered your question.
Sorry if you were insulted by an honest answer.
If you're not worried about the edge chipping, why did you specifically mention that as one of your concerns?

If you want a discussion on 20CV, there are several of them here in the General Forum section.
Have fun. :)
 
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Joined
May 31, 2018
Messages
213
I'm excited to hear your feedback upon you using your knifes.

I am also excited! But I just haven't used it much. I should do some stress tests but alas, that would require some real exertion.

You asked a question, I answered your question.
Sorry if you were insulted by an honest answer.
If you're not worried about the edge chipping, why did you specifically mention that as one of your concerns?

If you want a discussion on 20CV, there are several of them here in the General Forum section.
Have fun. :)

Thank you for your answer. I am certainly not insulted. I was considering M4. If I do see chipping from just what I do then I most certainly will change my viewpoint on steels like 154CM.

As others have said, though, the edge geometry is very important.
 
Joined
May 31, 2018
Messages
213
Ok, I just ordered a Griptillian in (black) M4 and olive drab. So stylish. So suave.

My 20CV Griptillian has performed without flaw. I have learned I can do everything with it that I have done with my utility knife. This requires some skill, though. No problem...

I have found that the new utility blade sharpness that I require wears off in the course of one day of cutting cardboard and packaging. This is not a complaint but rather a disappointment. It sharpens up in a minute, maybe two.

My skill in sharpening and knife cutting (packaging lol) has increased greatly in recent months. This has to do mostly with the large difference in blade thickness. There is a way to get around the thickness.

Well, good luck to all you CPM20CV users out there. My blade is razor sharp.

And thank you, Benchmade.
 
Joined
Sep 25, 2013
Messages
515
20CV has very good edge retention, but it is not tough. Even with that being said, I still like M390 & 20CV. If I need a bit more toughness, I will settle with S30V.

If I need battle Axe level of toughness, may be S7? ;)
 

Bmurray

Gold Member
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Feb 9, 2012
Messages
6,929
It's held up as good or better than about any steel I've used. This is on my Survive GSO 3.5 fixed blade.
 
Joined
Mar 11, 2019
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I just bought a ZT 0562 cf, it is a Hinderer blade with cpm20CV and it chipped the very first week I owned it while skinning wire. I am not sure if I should send it back. I definitely expected better. It is factory at a 20 degree angle.
 
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Messages
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I just bought a ZT 0562 cf, it is a Hinderer blade with cpm20CV and it chipped the very first week I owned it while skinning wire. I am not sure if I should send it back. I definitely expected better. It is factory at a 20 degree angle.

That is surprising. I have never skinned wire but still.
 
Joined
Aug 19, 2014
Messages
1,435
CPM20CV is just perfect.

It is what all folding knives should be made out of. Either 204P/M390 would work too.

I try and buy exclusively this steel. Very high performance and virtually rust proof.
 

DeadboxHero

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Mar 22, 2014
Messages
4,581
Are cryptic messages your thing or would you like to expand on that?
Are cryptic messages your thing or would you like to expand on that?
Looks like you're new here. Welcome to BladeForums.

Lots of great information here :thumbsup:

It's a saying people have

"Geometry, geometry, geometry"

I believe it was coined or made popular by Kevin Cashen.

It implies that geometry is the most significant factor for either toughness or cutting performance.

So slap a 25dps on the bevel on that baby and hammer away :D:p
 
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DeadboxHero

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Mar 22, 2014
Messages
4,581
You don't think the 20 degree edge angle is good enough to prevent chipping?

Speculating, I would guess the factory edge process led to the chip. Do you think that is a reasonable guess?

The 20cv is fine, yes, there are better steels specific to more durablity but come with trade offs, Always trade offs.

I think this thread can pick a part endless details and still go no where.

At the end of the day, just use it and see.

If it chips, go thicker on the edge angle.

If it seems like the thicker edge angle doesn't cut as good it's cause it's too thick.

Go thinner and use it better, avoid making edge contact with things that damage the edge.

That's the reality of it all and the choices we make, no magic steel is immune, better steel just will enhance the experience.

That's why sharpening is an important skill to learn if you're a very demanding user, you can fine tune the angles and finish to your desire and use.

All things have there limits.

No steel is invincible, tougher steels always seem to imply to newer folks that they are the exception to the rule, but they still blunt and dull and don't cut as long and round over easy in the context of a very, very sharp, crisp edge when a tougher, shock resistant type steel is pressed out of its role. All these steels have their strengthes and weaknesses but nothing is always the best fit for everyone or everything, cost is also a variable, some steels do lots of stuff better but cost alot more.

It's nice to be able to synergize the entire blade geometry to a given use and preference and find the steel and heat treatment that maximizes it.

But that's more custom knife world stuff.

With production knives you get what you get and you just have to use your judgement on what has the geometry that suits your demands and the ability to change up the edge angles and edge finish to enhance your preferences.

20cv is good stuff, premium steel designed to cut a good long while.
 
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Jul 7, 2012
Messages
1,198
I avoid copper wire with everything but beater knives and multitools it has chipped so many blades on me.

For folders I love M390/204P/20CV. If possible it would be all I have but Ive still got some S35VN due to it being all you can get on some knives. To me "toughness" is not nearly as important on such small blades and is still close enough between the common stainless "super steels" used here I just prioritize edge retention.

For bigger fixed blades I like 3V and 4V for their toughness but would even be cool with old school alloys depending on application.
 

MolokaiRider

Gold Member
Joined
Sep 13, 2017
Messages
3,981
The 20cv is fine, yes there are better steels specific to more durablity but come with trade offs, Always trade offs.

I think this thread can pick a part endless details and still go no where.

At the end of the day, just use it and see.

If it chips, go thicker on the edge angle.

If I seems like the thicker edge angle doesn't cut as good it's cause it's too thick.

Go thinner and use it better, avoid making edge contact with things that damage the edge.

That's the reality of it all and the choices we make, no magic steel is immune, better steel just will enhance the experience.

That's why sharpening is an important skill to learn if you're a very demanding user, you can fine tune the angles and finish to your desire and use.

All things have there limits.

No steel is invincible, tougher steels always seem to imply to newer folks that they are the exception to the rule, but they still blunt and dull and don't cut as long and round over easy in the context of a very very sharp, crisp edge when a tougher, shock resistant type steel is pressed out of its role. All these steels have their strengthes and weaknesses but nothing is always the best fit for everyone or everything, cost is also a variable, some steels do lots of stuff better but cost alot more.

It's nice to be able to synergize the entire blade geometry to a given use and preference and find the steel and Heat treatment that maximizes it.

But that's more custom knife world stuff.

With production knives you get what you get and you just have to use your judgement on what has the geometry that suits your demands and the ability to change up the edge angles and edge finish to enhance your preferences.

20cv is good stuff, premium steel designed to cut a good long while.

Well said!
 

ShannonSteelLabs

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Sep 9, 2015
Messages
3,440
20CV is a great steel.
Having made several knives with it I can back that up. As far as toughness, seems reasonable. None of the knives I made are big choppers. A few small blades for EDC. And my personal kitchen knife.

The kitchen knife is 61HRC with cryo from Peter's. And about 7 to 10 thousands BTE as an estimate. So it's nice and thin and holds up to my poor kitchen knife skills. It also holds up to poor use from people I live with. If it wasnt for them it's likely I would only sharpen once a year!

If your steel has good heat treat and the correct geometry then it will work great at pretty much all EDC tasks. Just be smart with it.
 

sharp_edge

Gold Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2015
Messages
4,826
I avoid copper wire with everything but beater knives and multitools it has chipped so many blades on me.

For folders I love M390/204P/20CV. If possible it would be all I have but Ive still got some S35VN due to it being all you can get on some knives. To me "toughness" is not nearly as important on such small blades and is still close enough between the common stainless "super steels" used here I just prioritize edge retention.

For bigger fixed blades I like 3V and 4V for their toughness but would even be cool with old school alloys depending on application.

This guy with CPM Rex 45 said otherwise.:D
src="
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Joined
May 31, 2018
Messages
213
Well hey. I really like my 20CV Griptillian. I'm pretty careful with it, though.

The 20cv is fine, yes, there are better steels specific to more durablity but come with trade offs, Always trade offs.

I think this thread can pick a part endless details and still go no where.

At the end of the day, just use it and see.

If it chips, go thicker on the edge angle.

If it seems like the thicker edge angle doesn't cut as good it's cause it's too thick.

Go thinner and use it better, avoid making edge contact with things that damage the edge.

That's the reality of it all and the choices we make, no magic steel is immune, better steel just will enhance the experience.

That's why sharpening is an important skill to learn if you're a very demanding user, you can fine tune the angles and finish to your desire and use.

All things have there limits.

No steel is invincible, tougher steels always seem to imply to newer folks that they are the exception to the rule, but they still blunt and dull and don't cut as long and round over easy in the context of a very, very sharp, crisp edge when a tougher, shock resistant type steel is pressed out of its role. All these steels have their strengthes and weaknesses but nothing is always the best fit for everyone or everything, cost is also a variable, some steels do lots of stuff better but cost alot more.

It's nice to be able to synergize the entire blade geometry to a given use and preference and find the steel and heat treatment that maximizes it.

But that's more custom knife world stuff.

With production knives you get what you get and you just have to use your judgement on what has the geometry that suits your demands and the ability to change up the edge angles and edge finish to enhance your preferences.

20cv is good stuff, premium steel designed to cut a good long while.

This right here ^ makes this thread worthwhile to me. So yes, this thread is going somewhere, to me it is.

I now want a kitchen knife in 20CV.
 

DeadboxHero

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Mar 22, 2014
Messages
4,581
Nah, I'd rather have a kitchen knife in a steel that can go harder, tougher and thinner like AEB-L at 65rc

Well hey. I really like my 20CV Griptillian. I'm pretty careful with it, though.



This right here ^ makes this thread worthwhile to me. So yes, this thread is going somewhere, to me it is.

I now want a kitchen knife in 20CV.
 
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