Firesteel vs a Lighter...

The vast majority of people you will find in this forum are the salt of the earth.

Firemaking, firestarting, firecraft, whatever you want to call it, it can be basic and all the way up through "advanced."

If you look at the wildfire Arizona has been suffering with for about ten days now, this will also point out that the ability to build a fire is not only the most valuable of outdoors skills, but one of the most dangerous to life and property.

The ability to build a fire under adverse conditions is probably the most valuable survival skill a person can have. Fire can save your life through warmth, it can purify your water, it can cook your food and it can signal your rescuers. While it's debatable that it will ward off dangerous animals like bears I don't think the psychological boost of accomplishing the building of a fire when it is necessary can be ignored or overvalued.
 
Your points are well-said, Don. I think for a bloke like me, who doesn't seem to have the time (unfortunately) to 'get back to nature' for spans longer than a week (if I'm lucky) these days, it's easy to forget that things don't *always* go according to plan. Nothing wrong with a little foresight and being prepared with a well-rounded kit, that's for sure.
 
Just carry both (they're small).
I don't go for loads of equipment, and my "woods bag" is the same back-pack I use for school, the gym and shopping (it's more thread now than bag, twisted and evil :D), but a couple of ways of making fire is a good idea.
If you have a knife and a way to make fire you likely won't die out in the woods, so why not carry a backup for both, especially when it doesn't take up much weight or space?
 
stabman said:
Just carry both (they're small).
I don't go for loads of equipment, and my "woods bag" is the same back-pack I use for school, the gym and shopping (it's more thread now than bag, twisted and evil :D), but a couple of ways of making fire is a good idea.
If you have a knife and a way to make fire you likely won't die out in the woods, so why not carry a backup for both, especially when it doesn't take up much weight or space?
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Your backpack sounds like a wretched hive of scum and villainy... :D
 
stabman said:
Tatooine all the way baby!:D
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Just for you, Stabman... :D

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Note: the new Gerber firesteel...
 
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This is in response to the Zippo idea. I smoke (I know it's bad shame shame shame on me) and I love Zippos...think they are a classic piece of Americana...I own quite a durn few...love flipping that lid and lighting a smoke & slapping it shut just like in the shoot'em'up movies. Buuuuuuut I have never had one that didn't fail at the worst possible moment. Either they run out of fuel, flint too short, or just evil Zippo gremlins conspire against me...but I can't trust one. I carry a Bic all day every day...they work everytime until they run out of fuel. Unless of course they get wet, then I gots to dry it out.
 
Zippos and smokers work well together. They are always using their lighter and in tune with its action, fuel level, how long fuel lasts and need for flints. They tend to be less dependable for the more casual user who stores their lighter from one outing to the next and if they don't religiosity check the lighter before going out. Zippos are notorious for loss of fuel within 3 d to a week and can sometimes leak fuel onto you if you over fill them. A ranger band fitted over the lid and body has been used by many on this board to extend the life over which fuel can be stored (I recall threads showing 3 mo with a simple ranger band fitted over the lid). At REI and other places you can buy small sealed capsules that will hold a shot of fuel as a back-up. The relative windproofness of them also makes them useful for outdoors use and from my recollection, they produced a much stronger flame than a bic which has its uses (even though this zaps the fuel quickly). I'm not sure how well they work in the deep cold or after subject to complete immersion for several minutes (I think I just might have convinced myself to buy a zippo again).

I've bought several of the fancy butane lighters. When they work, they are like a blowtorch, windproof, highly directional flame that allows you to light most anything. I have also found them to be the most finicky bastards ever. Not only being mechanical, they also rely on electronics as part of the ignition system. I have them die for no apparent reason. Add more fuel and still no go. The one thing I've learned about butane lighters is they are the most unreliable things going, that is from the perspective of needing fire at an inopportune time.

Bics excel at long term fuel storage and last the longest in terms of flame/fuel time. They are pretty robust mechanically. Never had a flint go out on one and its pretty rare that you crush or destroy the wheel mechanism (but it does happen from time to time). They are very compact and great addition as a back-up. The mini-bics weight and take up almost no room. The problem is the flame they produce is pretty weak and can be a challenge to ignite difficult material under trying conditions. Sure, its easy to light a cigarette poking your face under your jacket. But what about wood shavings in an unprotected fire pit or in sleet and rain. These are two different things and I've had little luck with bic lighters igniting fires in these conditions and under these conditions basically use the lighter to form an ember in a protected environment like in my jacket and then nurture that ember like I would primitive fire.

Firesteels take more time to use and more dexterity, often requiring 2 hands (although there are a few one-handed firesteels on the market). They require a lot of practice, but once you are proficient in their use they become very reliable. There is nothing mechanical to break, nothing to wet out and the fuel (the rod itself) lasts a very, very long time. You can substitute a variety of things for the scraper, from your knife to a sharp rock, pieces of glass to mussel shells.

I'd take this time to remind Timberweasil since he has just received his new found gerber firesteel to start to use it liberally and practice with it. Start off igniting easy things like petroleum cottonballs and then move onto to do the One Stick Fire (Search One Stick Fire and IAwoodsman for a great video and tutorial). The biggest downfall of the firesteel is that without training and practice it is almost useless to most people. Just not the kind of thing that any person can pick up and intuitively use to start a fire.

While not all that hard to use, there is definitely a learning curve to using them especially to ignite difficult items. Firesteels are also a gateway drug to flint and steel. So beware!
 
I think if people would either stop worshipping the cigarette lighters or stop being intimidated by the ferrocerium rod, a whole new world would open to them. :D
 
Yup firecraft is a very important skill. The most IMO. Thats why im such a fan of the splitwood, or "one stick" fire. With that method, I can have fire at anyplace, anytime, anywhere in the world. Alot of guys get comfy in their locals, which is cool, but some techniques dont transfer to other bioregions, and vice versa. Thats why 18 page debates on "the best" this, or "the best" that really give me a chuckle. There is no best. What is good for one place and time wont be for the next.

I do think the guys who are only carrying lighters and disregarding all other methods as parlor tricks are setting themselves up for failure.
 
XanRa said:
So is using any one method or getting used to a certain method
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Jake, "J Williams," is patiently trying to tell you not to only embrace one way and now it seems as if you are preaching to him not to embrace only one way.
 
A ferro rod is such a small , inexpensive , and mostly reliable piece of gear that anyone going into the woods should carry one always. Doesn't matter what you like to start a fire with ; if you have a firesteel you have a more reliable ignition source than any match or lighter ever invented. This is assuming the owner has the skill necessary to use one ( and dry tinder of course....but any true woodsman knows where to find that;))
I like using matches , but never rely on them as a sole means of ignition. Firesteels are the ultimate back-up...and they're fun!

Nothing wrong with carrying multiple options , but a guy should always have a firesteel with him,imho.
 
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XanRa said:
So is using any one method or getting used to a certain method
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Prep
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Scrapings
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One stick fire....
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A couple strikes and it took....I gotta say im pretty impressed with flint and steel. Gotta try nat materials now...
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cedar bundle
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Fire from flint and steel
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Preping the spindle and hearth.
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notch in bow
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burning in divot
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notching hearth
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wam bam I gots a coal
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Propper prep for a nice fire is very very important. Dont skimp!!
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A nice base will keep your shavings and tinder off the wet ground. This is someshag bark hickory.
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I havent lit a fire in ages with matches. Its important to practice with everything you pack. I was laggin on this.
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Nice fire with plenty of kindling leftover.
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;):thumbup:
 
Im not going to quote a post here because there are so many I would quote with this tid bit. Im only 3 pages deep and already Im thinking wtf, are we really this disconnected? And to point out, I am no expert...

Bic lighters are great for starting your campfire doused in accelerant or with news papers wadded up underneath. But have you ever wondered why every true professional recommend matches for your emergency kit? Disposable lighters have been around for ever but emergency kits still sport matches. Why? is it just to save weight? Doubtful, disposables don't weigh much. Is it to save money. Don't think so; disposables don't cost much.

Have you ever tried to start a fire with butane gas in sub freezing weather? For every guy on this board toting a Bic, I'm thinking not. Heck, have you ever tried to light a cigarette in sub freezing weather with your Bic? Not too easy. You have to warm it up under your armpit just to get a quick spark for your cig.

The reason - butane boils into gas at -2 degrees Celsius. Any temperature below that and butane stays liquid in the lighter and is useless.

The point is...a disposable lighter is great around the campfire in the spring when the leaves are green and the sun is shinning, but when a fire is most important, when its a matter of life and death, matches or flint magnesium, fire steel or whatever you like is the right choice. There are other fuels that boil to gas at a lower temp than butane, but its still really best to have an inorganic solid form to produce your fire.

You can dip your matches in lacquer or wax or other coatings to help keep them dry in storage or during use if that's what turns you off to them. If its simple the fact that you get more lights out of a disposable than a box of matches, well id rather have a dozen good lights than one that doesn't work when I need it. Besides if you cant get a fire going with a dozen matches, then you are in trouble.
 
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