In your opinion, what's the biggest money rip-off in terms of knife ?

We have a political sub forum for a reason. The last two pages I just read should be there, not here. Doesn't matter your reasons for/against buying overseas, but please don't try to force your ideology on others. Let's keep this thread open and try not to incite a flame war.

The Mick Strider controversy is a long decayed dead horse. Put the pitchforks away. Personally, despite the fact that he is a lying dbag, his company made same damn good knives IMO. To me, the quality of the product was the important part to me.

To each their own. Opinions are fine, healthy, help us understand each other, and make us think. But when you try to shove your opinions down other people's throat, that's a problem.

I understand where people are coming from about buying overseas. I do. If we made more products, quality products, I'd buy them.

I grew up, and live in a household where political ideals attempt to be forced on me. My grandfather was an Illinois State Rep for 14 years. (R.I.P. 1996)

My father is extremely opinionated and a bit racist.

I hate having things forced upon me, and people expecting me to change or agree with them.

/End rambling rant

I think many will agree, the biggest ripoffs are at physical stores. Full retail, often more. The sales people are often not knowledgeable, and will even make stuff up to get you to buy.

Once in a while, I'll find something underpriced. I got a Benchmade mini grip in D2 for $40 because it was the last one, and the box was damaged. The clerk was buying the display model for himself. This was back in 2013 or 14.
 
I consider this an overpriced Rip Off at a thousand bucks! But at least it comes with a built in bottle opener :confused:. Sorry Heeter Nation, Yap Yap Yap.
7xGelyi.jpg
 
So you want to stir the pot among our fellow enthusiasts because you feel it's your duty to educate the masses to these injustices? My point isn't to water it down the issue. If you have a real beef with a knife or brand, make a thread specifically. But threads worded like this are open to interpretation and always end up pissing matches. "$400 for a frame lock? Rip off!" "Spending over $50 on a knife? That's a rip off!" etc.

Almost no one here that has spent any length of time on these boards is making uneducated decisions about what they are buying. Pros, cons, warranties, customer service, build quality, etc are all pretty well known. For some, the sum total of what they like about a knife outweighs, to them, features you do not like/would not pay for. That does not make it a rip off.

I do not like the Grip. I'm not a BM fan. They don't speak to me. Some love them and are happy to pay the price. Sometimes thats based on previous quality and not current quality. If BM continues to put out subpar products at inflated prices, it will come back on them. They aren't ripping anyone off. You are getting exactly what they say you are getting. It's not like you buy a Grip and a Gerber Ripstop shows up in the box. They are putting out a poor product which though returns, reviews, and slumping sales will be corrected or they will cease to be in business.

Also there is like a dozen page thread talking about ZT's lock issues. It went a little something like this:
"My locks failed and this concerns me."
"Well none of my locks have failed. I have 2 dozen of them, so I call BS."
"Well, but if I tap it on a roll of tape it will slip the lock."
"Why so that! Spine whacks are useless 'tests'! Hold the knife like a man!"
"But what if, like, I need to hold the knife at a weird angle and it bumps closed on my fingers?"
Etc etc etc etc. I posted my personal concerns with the knives in there. I came to the conclusion that even though they can fail, how I use my knives still makes them worth owning and carrying. I've bought two since that thread. I still find them a good value of fit and finish for $200. I wish the frame lock tolerances were a little better (kinda ironic, I know), but for an off the shelf premium quality knife they aren't bad.

So lemme ask this, what's the end game for this thread? After everyone gets snarky or smug or pounds on the table about what's fair/right/overpriced/patriotic/etc, what conclusion do we have? What empirical and quantifiable measurements will we as a knife-using community be left with? Once we route out all the dirty tricksters, flimflam artists, snake oil salesmen hocking their dangerous wears to we, the ill informed, how does this thread end? Is there a do-not-buy list? An equation that mathematically proves rip-offitude?

My guess? It ends locked with some hurt feelings with nothing productive coming out of it. I'm not trying to be contrarian here. I just want to know how this makes "us" better.

Agreed...hence this will be my only post in this thread.
Keep ‘em sharp!
 
The Mick Strider controversy is a long decayed dead horse. Put the pitchforks away. Personally, despite the fact that he is a lying dbag, his company made same damn good knives IMO. To me, the quality of the product was the important part to me.
I disagree about the strider controversy. First, there is no controversy. The facts that spark put together are there for all to see. To ignore them is to say one doesn't care that a stolen valor scumbag made the knife you are carrying. Second, the issue in not long and dead. I've seen several instances where newcomers didn't know about how shady strider is. Many have been thankful in threads here to have the facts of strider knives being presented when the topic comes up. People who care about stolen valor had no idea they were supporting it. That is why it gets mentioned.
 
I disagree about the strider controversy. First, there is no controversy. The facts that spark put together are there for all to see. To ignore them is to say one doesn't care that a stolen valor scumbag made the knife you are carrying. Second, the issue in not long and dead. I've seen several instances where newcomers didn't know about how shady strider is. Many have been thankful in threads here to have the facts of strider knives being presented when the topic comes up. People who care about stolen valor had no idea they were supporting it. That is why it gets mentioned.
Thanks for the Heads up craytab. I Was aware of his shady business practice but I was completely unaware of the STOLEN VALOR. This ''Man'' and I use the term lightly is a certified piece of :poop: at best and personally I think his knives are Useless in function and ridonculous in form. That's all I'll EVER say again about that Ass Hat. His name will and work will be forever erased from my memory and a big thanks to All that have served.
 
I consider this an overpriced Rip Off at a thousand bucks! But at least it comes with a built in bottle opener :confused:. Sorry Heeter Nation, Yap Yap Yap.
7xGelyi.jpg

that thing looks painful to hold. Who makes it? Nothing about it makes any sense except for the bottle opener
 
that thing looks painful to hold. Who makes it? Nothing about it makes any sense except for the bottle opener
Todd Heeter of Heeter knives. All over priced fantasy pieces IMHO. Look him and and his work for a good laugh or a lesson in Bad blade geometry. I did have my eye on one of his Tacticool Flame anoed knitting needles though.............. Kidding and again, Apologies to the "Heeter Nation", both of you guys.
 
The problem with posts like this is they evade the question IMO, simply because it is IMO. :(
I disagree. There is obviously an objective measure of value, if only the price of the material itself and perhaps a standard hourly rate as a placeholder. This idea of everything being 100% subjective is as fallacious as the opposite: saying that each product has a set value. The truth, as with everything, is going to be somewhere in between.....but is IS measurable, as long as people set the parameters properly. And that's where the fluff comes in; and that's where people seem to have difficulty is simply stating up front what their variables and assumptions are.

I'll give you two extreme examples:

Let's say I wanted a knife like I had as a kid; and I was so rich that money was no object. If I truly WANTED it, to the point where I would pony up any price; then what I eventually paid would not be setting a value on the knife...it would be setting a value on me getting what I wanted. And if money was no object for me, then what the hell would I care how much I spent?

On the other end of the scale, let's say that I would never pay more than, say, $50 for a simple carbon steel fixed blade...like a Green River. Bear in mind, trappers and hunters of the colonial period got by on knives like that for ages. None of us NEEDS supersteels, or stag horn, or engraving, or whatever, to do the job that a knife needs to do. So, let's say someone wants to sell me a brand new Sebenza for $75; but I refuse. Again, that has nothing to do with the absolute value of the knife.

The problem with people not declaring a value is that so many of us are loathe to offend. But we forget that if a person asks, then they generally want to know what others think.

So tell them honestly. The market has set prices, as markets do. You have your entry level, your mid range, your high end, etc. You also have your "name inflation", your "marketing effect", and other factors that artificially affect prices. You can often find individual pieces of information that sway decisions. And, of course, you have your individual consumer factors, like biases and available resources.

All of those are variables; and all of those can be factored in to present a range of values that can be tightened enough to answer the question "What is this knife worth?"
 
I disagree about the strider controversy. First, there is no controversy. The facts that spark put together are there for all to see. To ignore them is to say one doesn't care that a stolen valor scumbag made the knife you are carrying. Second, the issue in not long and dead. I've seen several instances where newcomers didn't know about how shady strider is. Many have been thankful in threads here to have the facts of strider knives being presented when the topic comes up. People who care about stolen valor had no idea they were supporting it. That is why it gets mentioned.

The controversy I speak of is of the war between those who own and like the knives regardless of the bastard owner's lies and those that are offended by the mere implication that you might like or God forbid own one.

At the time I liked my SnG, but sold it to pay bills. That was over four years ago. A lot has changed, I have changed. I won't own for three reasons. The owner's lies and antics, I don't have the money, and I don't care for overbuilt tanks.
 
I never understood all the hate toward the plastic handles of the Grip. They're made of Noryl GTX, which is a very tough material. It's an inexpensive material that is stronger than steel or titanium per unit density (Specific Strength). When have you EVER heard of or seen pictures of them breaking or cracking? It's a rare occurrence. It lacks a solid feel, I agree. I prefer the feel and weight of metallic handles myself. I think it's a hi performance composite material that is more than capable as a knife handle and doesn't deserve all the criticism. How dare they use a strong, inexpensive, lightweight, textured/grippy, colorful/customizable & ergonomic material on a knife!? They're just trying to rip me off!!

I own two full-size Grips and have a love-hate relationship with both of them because of the scales.

The Grip is a very capable folder but I will admit it has a cheap feel about it. My biggest problem is the hollow sound you hear when deploying the blade. That just drives me nuts.
 
You guys want to know what a ripoff is?

Cutco

And, don't bother to give me the economics babble about it being the proper pricing if someone is willing to pay that specific price. Even that is true; it's still BS in the everyday world and we all know it.

If you spend $80-100 dollars for a 440A steel folder with injected plastic scales and poor heat treatment, you just got ripped off.
 
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So you want to stir the pot among our fellow enthusiasts because you feel it's your duty to educate the masses to these injustices? My point isn't to water it down the issue. If you have a real beef with a knife or brand, make a thread specifically. But threads worded like this are open to interpretation and always end up pissing matches. "$400 for a frame lock? Rip off!" "Spending over $50 on a knife? That's a rip off!" etc.

Almost no one here that has spent any length of time on these boards is making uneducated decisions about what they are buying. Pros, cons, warranties, customer service, build quality, etc are all pretty well known. For some, the sum total of what they like about a knife outweighs, to them, features you do not like/would not pay for. That does not make it a rip off.


I do not like the Grip. I'm not a BM fan. They don't speak to me. Some love them and are happy to pay the price. Sometimes thats based on previous quality and not current quality. If BM continues to put out subpar products at inflated prices, it will come back on them. They aren't ripping anyone off. You are getting exactly what they say you are getting. It's not like you buy a Grip and a Gerber Ripstop shows up in the box. They are putting out a poor product which though returns, reviews, and slumping sales will be corrected or they will cease to be in business.

Also there is like a dozen page thread talking about ZT's lock issues. It went a little something like this:
"My locks failed and this concerns me."
"Well none of my locks have failed. I have 2 dozen of them, so I call BS."
"Well, but if I tap it on a roll of tape it will slip the lock."
"Why so that! Spine whacks are useless 'tests'! Hold the knife like a man!"
"But what if, like, I need to hold the knife at a weird angle and it bumps closed on my fingers?"
Etc etc etc etc. I posted my personal concerns with the knives in there. I came to the conclusion that even though they can fail, how I use my knives still makes them worth owning and carrying. I've bought two since that thread. I still find them a good value of fit and finish for $200. I wish the frame lock tolerances were a little better (kinda ironic, I know), but for an off the shelf premium quality knife they aren't bad.

So lemme ask this, what's the end game for this thread? After everyone gets snarky or smug or pounds on the table about what's fair/right/overpriced/patriotic/etc, what conclusion do we have? What empirical and quantifiable measurements will we as a knife-using community be left with? Once we route out all the dirty tricksters, flimflam artists, snake oil salesmen hocking their dangerous wears to we, the ill informed, how does this thread end? Is there a do-not-buy list? An equation that mathematically proves rip-offitude?

My guess? It ends locked with some hurt feelings with nothing productive coming out of it. I'm not trying to be contrarian here. I just want to know how this makes "us" better.

First, about the bolded, you make it sound like you don't know that non-registered users are also browsing this forums. You do, you're part of the staff, but for 1 knowledgable bladeforums users, you probably have 100 lurkers who read this forums to gain insights or build knowledge about the knife industry and the products it offers. I lurked for something like 3 years before deciding to join the forums, for exemple. And Yes, I think it's our duty to provide them arguments.

About your question, we don't need a conclusion. All we need is opinions and opinions can't be proved by equations or maths. How does this thread make us better ? I don't know, I didn't create it with that question in mind. When someone ask if he should chose between a mora classic and a mora companion, how does that make us better ? What's the supposed conclusion of that kind of thread ? Same about my past thread about Nick Shabazz. We're here for the discussion, I create thread for discussion, period. If that's against the rule, call me out on it and I'll let other people create threads about knife pics or "what are you caring today" instagram style, because I'm certain those threads make the community as valuable as it is right now (that's sarcasm).

By the way, I've yet to see the pissing match you talk about. I took the Grip as an exemple, a very popular knife. Some agree, some don't, most of the discussion have been backed by argument from each side and most have been civil for the most part. Same about the Sebenza (I consider it worth the price, but many don't and I understand their arguments).
 
Still have the same cutco knives we've had since 1985. While certainly not the best, they have actually been great. The steak knives, less so. I have a set of Wusthof steak knives I got back when I was married, and we use those a lot. Much better all the way around.

I've heard cutco went downhill since we got ours. More money, less quality, shady business practices.
 
The new CRKT that's 750.00 is a rip off . I love the lock, everything else is ugly; the blade the handle,the pocket clip, looks well made but anyone who buys it is almost guaranteed to lose money trying to resell it. Say what you want about a Sebenza at least if you get tired of it you can get most of your money back...
 
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