is there any chance that busse kin go CMP3V?

Cobalt said:
He knows more about it now and he was able to set up an HT protocol that works to his standards. Which is what he could do with 3V as well if he tried it today. But 10 years ago, I know he felt 5160 was not for him. If he comes out with 5160, I know he found a way to make it work
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forgive me if this was already answered but is the 52-100 that Jerry uses for SR-101 in short supply or something? or do you think it is because 5160 costs less an he was able to get it to perform to his standards? because if he was able to get it to work as good or better than sr-101..I would think he would be switching Swamp Rat to the 5160 as well..??
 
Robdude said:
forgive me if this was already answered but is the 52-100 that Jerry uses for SR-101 in short supply or something? or do you think it is because 5160 costs less an he was able to get it to perform to his standards? because if he was able to get it to work as good or better than sr-101..I would think he would be switching Swamp Rat to the 5160 as well..??
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I think they had it laying around and they finally figured out a way to get excellent performance out of it. I don't think it will outperform sr101. But only they can answer that.
 
What exactly are the performance differences between 52100 and 5160? Seems like when comparing ball bearing steel to spring steel you are going to get a varying spread of performance characteristics that comparing them in terms of "better" is contextual.

Also, if this is a dumb question, please forgive me, I haven't had enough coffee yet!
 
lklemz said:
What exactly are the performance differences between 52100 and 5160? Seems like when comparing ball bearing steel to spring steel you are going to get a varying spread of performance characteristics that comparing them in terms of "better" is contextual.

Also, if this is a dumb question, please forgive me, I haven't had enough coffee yet!
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Hard to quantify but here goes. I have had a dozen knives made of 52100. Even the worst ones were excellent knives, like my marbles brand knives from the 90's were 52100 and they were awesome. My customs of 52100 have all been excellent. I have probably owned 4-6 knives made of 5160 excluding my 12 or so khukuris forged from 5160. The edges on my 5160 didn't hold up as well to serious work, both steels were tough and never really noticed a difference there. For me 52100 is just a little better in every area that is important to me. It has better edge holding and abrasion resistance and is as tough or close enough that it is irrelevant.
 
52100 has a great reputation..edge holding,sharpening,tough and as said before does 90% of what Infi does.
But you gotta clean & oil the steel to protect it....Not a deal breaker to me!
I do this with 1095 as well.
I really don't know a lot about 5160 but was surprised to hear that SR was going to it.
 
Bill Siegle is able to get very good performance from his choppers in 5160, so he must have the HT dialed in for that application.

It is probably fair to say that many knives do not reach the potential inherent in the steel due to less than optimal HT for that particular application. Some makers put in the time and the research to get the best out of their steel. A recent example would be Nathan Carothers (Nathan the Machinst). Take a look at what he is able to get from his hard use blades in 3V, as he optimized for edge stability.
 
I fully believe Infi is better than 3v for a large beater. I would however like to see some 3v used in some smaller knives instead of Elmax. Chromium always comes at a cost and Elmax is great for a stainless, but I would take 3v over the stainless steels any day. Infi is tough as hell, but the high vanadium knives will have better edge retention when not used in applications where they will chip (like smaller non beaters).
 
mach 5 said:
I fully believe Infi is better than 3v for a large beater. I would however like to see some 3v used in some smaller knives instead of Elmax. Chromium always comes at a cost and Elmax is great for a stainless, but I would take 3v over the stainless steels any day. Infi is tough as hell, but the high vanadium knives will have better edge retention when not used in applications where they will chip (like smaller non beaters).
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There have been some great user reports on edge retention in Elmax as done by Busse; do you think that 3V could be even better?
 
resinguy said:
There have been some great user reports on edge retention in Elmax as done by Busse; do you think that 3V could be even better?
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Not in edge retention. Elmax is probably one of the toughest stainless steels. Bill Seigle has 5160 dialed in, but it still will not outperform 52100 in any test. It is cheaper though and easier to heat treat than 52100, as in more forgiving than 52100(so I am told)
 
resinguy said:
There have been some great user reports on edge retention in Elmax as done by Busse; do you think that 3V could be even better?
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No, elmax and 3v have similar edge retention, but 3v has superior toughness which elmax trades for corrosion resistance. I find 3v has adequate corrosion resistance and I would rather have the toughness in the trade. As a side note however, cpm 9v according to some charts is still dramatically tougher than cpm30v (which is marginally inferior to elmax) and the edge retention is in completely different league. All stainless knives trade some performance for corrosion resistance. No steel is class leading in all categories, if I have to take a trade off, I will sacrifice a little corrosion resistance and oil my knife.
 
Great thread.
Jerry said if a better steel than INFI comes along, BCG will use it.
rolf
 
I wasn't saying that miller 3v was better....jeeze....all I was stating was it seems they did something right with it. I've tried INFI on much thinner steel and my pics in another thread show the damage. Yes it's fixable damage, but I would love a TGLB in 3v to try the same dest. test and compare. Anyone else see the Monkey Edge vids of the Strider DB in 3v .190 stock? I love INFI....and I have a quality embedded in my lifestyle that has me always striving for better. I am willing to bet mucho casho that Jerry B. himself has a similar attitude. If he didn't, INFI would never be alive today. Just my HAO....bash away guys.
 
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