spyderco manix 2. why is the lock so hard? and why is it made out of plastic?

i dislike the polymer cage as well...

they should do it similar to an axis lock imo..
 
If your hands are wet or greasy... fuggedaboutit... the ridges on the tabs need to be sharper to afford a better grip.
 
i dislike the polymer cage as well...

they should do it similar to an axis lock imo..

Can you be more specific? Do you think they should use a feeble spring that will let the blade fall open more easily to ensure running afoul of "gravity knife" laws? Or do you think they should use a metal cage to prevent QC from seeing at a glance that the ball is in place? Or do you want the ends of the cage to stick out farther to increase pocket wear and increase the likelihood of inadvertently releasing the lock?
 
I can't really say I have noticed that it is difficult to unlock. I'd much rather have slightly stiff tension than opening in my pocket, or closing on my hand.



I'm guessing that the Manix 2 is not going to change much. Perhaps people that cannot operate it effectively need one of these?

image_28645_450_white.jpg
 
I have small hands and don't have any problems with the lock on the Manix 2. The lock on my 154CM Manix 2 sticks a little, but it doesn't bother me.
 
Can you be more specific? Do you think they should use a feeble spring that will let the blade fall open more easily to ensure running afoul of "gravity knife" laws? Or do you think they should use a metal cage to prevent QC from seeing at a glance that the ball is in place? Or do you want the ends of the cage to stick out farther to increase pocket wear and increase the likelihood of inadvertently releasing the lock?

it doesn't get more specific than "i dislike the polymer cage". again, not the lock itself....
i'm talking about the exposed part that's used to disengage the knife when open.

i hope this cleared up any confusion.
 
it doesn't get more specific than "i dislike the polymer cage". again, not the lock itself....
i'm talking about the exposed part that's used to disengage the knife when open.

i hope this cleared up any confusion.

Ah, we're getting closer. Is it the fact that they chose a polymer they could see through to ensure the ball was in place that you object to, or is it that the ends of the carrier don't protrude far enough to increase pocket wear? Or do you simply object to the nearly indestructible space age polymer that can be precision molded at a fraction of the cost of machining a steel part on the grounds that "it's plastic"?

Yes, I know I sound like I'm just being a prick, but I know that Sal would want to address the concern if it is widespread and more than simply prejudice. I know he spent a great deal of time and money developing the caged ball lock, and a lot of thought, engineering and testing went into the selection of that material. If you don't like it just because it's plastic, there isn't much he can do about it. After all, the G-10 handle scales are essentially plastic as well.
 
Ah, we're getting closer. Is it the fact that they chose a polymer they could see through to ensure the ball was in place that you object to, or is it that the ends of the carrier don't protrude far enough to increase pocket wear? Or do you simply object to the nearly indestructible space age polymer that can be precision molded at a fraction of the cost of machining a steel part on the grounds that "it's plastic"?

Yes, I know I sound like I'm just being a prick, but I know that Sal would want to address the concern if it is widespread and more than simply prejudice. I know he spent a great deal of time and money developing the caged ball lock, and a lot of thought, engineering and testing went into the selection of that material. If you don't like it just because it's plastic, there isn't much he can do about it. After all, the G-10 handle scales are essentially plastic as well.

to keep it simple, i just don't care for it. i could get into detail and further specify my statement but it wont matter. it's apparent that you're looking to debate me or sway my opinion on the polymer cage but it's just not going to happen ;)
 
Also, IIRC, wasn't the polymer used,rather than steel, for its "self lubricating" properties?
 
Also, IIRC, wasn't the polymer used,rather than steel, for its "self lubricating" properties?

If you're talking about the cage, then I have to point out that one of my issues with the Caged-BB lock is that the polymer of the cage/thumb-buttons rubs against the G10 and does not provide a very smooth surface if you happen to own one where the fit between the cage/G10 is particularly tight.

Making the holes in the G10 (for the cage) at a slight angle or radius away from the cage would loosen it up quite a bit (here's a video from Spydusse where he took a Dremmel to his):

[video=youtube;pDIcms1Xz_g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDIcms1Xz_g[/video]
 
to keep it simple, i just don't care for it. i could get into detail and further specify my statement but it wont matter. it's apparent that you're looking to debate me or sway my opinion on the polymer cage but it's just not going to happen ;)

I didn't get that he Yab was trying to get you to change your mind as much as to get you to discuss how you would "fix" the problem that you have with the lock. This kind of discussion has led to some positive design changes with Spyderco in the past.
 
Thanks for the thread; good question. I have also avoided the Manix 2 (and "xl" variety) due to the transparent plastic lock cage. Perception isn't everything but the perception of cheapness is too high for me to shell out and try it. Even if it happens to be strong, I have never seen a transparent or translucent plastic which did not develop a grimy yellow and/or filthy brown coloration after coming in contact with dirt. A metal cage would be sweet. Maybe on the 2XL :D

Otherwise, it's a cool looking blade.
 
Thanks for the thread; good question. I have also avoided the Manix 2 (and "xl" variety) due to the transparent plastic lock cage. Perception isn't everything but the perception of cheapness is too high for me to shell out and try it. Even if it happens to be strong, I have never seen a transparent or translucent plastic which did not develop a grimy yellow and/or filthy brown coloration after coming in contact with dirt. A metal cage would be sweet. Maybe on the 2XL :D

Otherwise, it's a cool looking blade.
Glocks are made of plastic too, are they cheap?
 
I don't know. Show me your transparent Glock and I'll let you know what I think.

Somebody just wrote above that knife design change can come from honest feedback.
 
I'd hate it if the cage was changed over to metal. I would like to see some chamferring of the G-10 surrounding the cage, about the same amount as the outside edge of the scales.
 
Hi Sogflash, Four_shore, and others that dislike the cage.

Like Yab, it would be more constructive to know more specifically what features turn you off.

As far as the materials go, I think we've been using new advanced materials for a long time. No one had ever used many of the polymers and steels before we brought them to the market. We created the cage because there were complaints about unlocking the naked ball. As Yab said, a great deal of time and funds were spent to develop the caged ball. It's not an Axis (rod / scales) or an Arc (rotating rod), etc. It is a different mechanism and different engineering. We've had very few problems with the lock, which has been out for a few years with thousands of knives in the field.

Need more input. If you "just don't like plastic", or you want "less spring tension", I can understand. But we feel the caged ball is a safe, reliable, self adjusting lock. It's different from other locks. It doesn't infringe on anyones patents, in fact it has it's own patents.

Are you questioning whether or not it's a good lock or are you just expressing personal preferences?

sal
 
i understand the mechanical differences in these locks... i was specifically talking about the polymer and it's feel. i've heard a few people say that they merely dropped the knife and the polymer either cracked or broke. it didn't happen to me personally but it led me to believe that it may not be up to hard use. don't get me wrong, the ergonomics are second to none as is the over all design. i just question it's durability.

the benchmade griptilian is a highly regarded knife but i've always felt that the noryl gtx plastic handles feel cheap and could easily break.

plenty of people will disregard a knife simply because of it's feel.

regardless, spyderco is my favorite production company...hands down.

i'm a huge fan and loyal customer.

thanks for staying involved sal. that means alot to us all.
 
When you use a new material or do something that has never been done before, history will be needed to be absolutely sure of results. Lab testing only goes so far. Durability has not been a problem to date. We have more metal parts fail than plastic parts. Modern plastics are tough. "feeling cheap" may be a false perception and one might need more education.

sal
 
I just wanted to add; I got a second batch Moonglow today and the lock is easy to work with just the thumb. I am not sure why my M4 is so much more difficult. The moonglow operates worlds better than my M4 in every respect. Everything is smooth on it, unlike my M4 and has no blade play; which my M4 does even after going to golden. I think My M4 is a lemon, but its functional and I love the knife and M4 steel
 
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