The NEXT SALE

On their facebook page, they say more 3v EDC's on March 31. I'd love to see a 4V or two in thrown in!
 
I wish 4V were ready, but we're still working on it. To be clear there are a bunch of 4V knives here in the shop (EDCs and Light Choppers), but we're still in the heat treat development process. I can say this: we've looked at the industry standard heat treat, a variation of the industry standard but with cryo, the standard used by the best industrial heat treater in the knife industry, the heat treat used in the competition cutters, the Delta protocol developed for 3V and we have looked at its sister steel V4E. We're in the optimization process now where we're looking at the effect of different variables.

I came into the process with my mind wide open, but again I have found that the industry standard, using the secondary hardening hump, is the worst performer of the variations we've looked at so far. I think it boils down to inherent edge stability issues with that approach that doesn't cause issues in most applications but causes issues in the very thin sections of a knife edge, and the additional freedom we have being unconstrained by concern for dimensional changes and risk of cracking in thick sections during quench.

Anyway, with an optimized heat treat we're seeing very good edge stability. With the tweaks it's not very chippy or crumbly at all, even above HRC 63 where 3V starts to get chippy. This is going to be a real winner for edge retention at higher hardness and in rough use. It may lack the ductility for reliable extremely rough use (it isn't 3V or Infi) but I think most people are really going to like this steel in many applications, with a tweaked heat treat. We're working on it most every day here now and I think we're getting really close. Look for 4V knives in about 6 weeks?
 
How does the D2 and the 4V compare performance wise? I'm assuming D2 is more stain and corrosion resistant, but how about in regards to toughness, edge stability, and any other performance indicators?
 
xxwarderxx said:
How does the D2 and the 4V compare performance wise? I'm assuming D2 is more stain and corrosion resistant, but how about in regards to toughness, edge stability, and any other performance indicators?
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This is a good question. 4V has better wear resistance on paper, but in reality I think the small rounded carbides fall free from the edge more easily than in D2, so I'm not sure which has longer edge retention in real use. They're both very good. I think it might depend on the media being cut, hardness, geometry and technique. 4V is more durable. So I don't honestly know the answer to this and I need to do more cut testing to form an opinion about it.

I do know that 4V does not develop the toothy edge that makes D2 so sweet as a skinning knife. I also know that 4V has much greater edge durability in thin sections in rough use and can cut nails that would cause D2 to chip. I think that 4V will be a higher performance steel overall, but optimized D2 is a fantastic material and would probably outperform almost anything in certain tasks.

4V stains pretty easily. Not as bad as 1095 or O1, but similar to A2.

I have considered optimized D2 and Delta 3V as being roughly equivalent in rust resistance, but we're finding that Delta 3V does a little better.
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
I have considered optimized D2 and Delta 3V as being roughly equivalent in rust resistance, but we're finding that Delta 3V does a little better.
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This is a remarkable outcome, and counter-intuitive, just based on the material composition (D2 around 12% chrome, 3V around 7.5% chrome). Keep up the excellent, excellent work on optimizing tool steels for knife performance!
 
Any chance you will release the field knife in d2 or 4v?


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J_mcrane said:
Any chance you will release the field knife in d2 or 4v?


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I'm 99.9% sure there won't be any more current gen FKs made in any steel. Besides the small batch at blade show that is.
 
coiledwire said:
I'm 99.9% sure there won't be any more current gen FKs made in any steel. Besides the small batch at blade show that is.
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So there will be a small number of FKs at the Blade Show? If so, I'll have send a family member to get me one.
 
All this talk about super steels reminds me of something I read a very long time ago. A somewhat famous knife maker got a complaint from a collector that his knives were too sharp. The collector kept them in a glass covered case and only took them out to show someone. He was afraid that someone might get cut. The knife maker complained that he made his knives to be used and if they weren't, he might has well make them out of pot metal.

What I'm getting at is, how many of Nate's knives actually are used? ;)
 
UffDa said:
All this talk about super steels reminds me of something I read a very long time ago. A somewhat famous knife maker got a complaint from a collector that his knives were too sharp. The collector kept them in a glass covered case and only took them out to show someone. He was afraid that someone might get cut. The knife maker complained that he made his knives to be used and if they weren't, he might has well make them out of pot metal.

What I'm getting at is, how many of Nate's knives actually are used? ;)
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This would be a good topic in a thread by itself. Personally, I use every one of them. I do keep more than one edc, and I even gifted an edc to my guide after a hunt. He used the edc to skin my mountain lion and liked it so much that I just gave it to him on top of the gratuity. I've used the fk and edc to skin multiple deer. I recently sent my light chopper back to Nathan for edge repair after I smacked a couple rocks with it while cutting down weeds.


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Well I use his skinner almost daily, not for it's attended purpose but in the kitchen, his EDC in D2, is my break down vanity, toilet boxes. But his light chopper just sits right now but not for long, cross country trails will be cleared soon. So simple in design, so complicated under the hood.
 
I used my D2 EDC the other day to cut some stubborn weeds. It performed fabulously!:thumbup::D
 
I was just poking a little fun. I realize that many people do use their knives, but based on what I see in the Exchange and other forums there are even more that don't. :D
 
I treat my CPKs pretty good. I mean I hardly ever use a cheater bar to pry on them or anything. :D

 
UffDa said:
What I'm getting at is, how many of Nate's knives actually are used? ;)
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I am a bit late to Nathan Carother's pursuit of excellence. I have gone from zero to six quickly. I plan to use one of each of the EDC's... one in D2, one in D3V, and one of the Field Knives in D3V.

I am a bit crazy, I actually use expensive knives, but I also intend to significantly narrow my collection of blades over the next year to focus on excellence and away from ...
 
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