Another Bear attack... aother bear thread

ibear said:
It is sad that we have to ask permission to carry a firearm. What is this world coming to?

"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun, therefore, be the constant companion of your walks." --Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785. ME 5:85, Papers 8:407

With your fishing pole, 8 gallon water bottle, back pack, trusty toilet latreeeen with the flip up - fold down pre heated seat, lunch pail, bottle of bear scent, handy dandy razor sharp custom Khukuri and your double action triple traction diamond backed rattle snake motorcycle racing boots.... you should have plenty of room for both the shotgun and the .44 magnum.

Of course, all this may become more of a problem, after you get out of your vehicle.

But, HELL, enjoy the outdoors from inside your car..... I always say! Safety first!
Thanks,

iBear


I've tried Geo/surveyor -type fields vests for those helicopter-assisted day trips and they put the weight on the back of your butt when you load up the back. I'd say the best thing is a field vest for the front pockets, and a medium dyapack to hold clothing and survival gear.

As for the bears, I know a guy who used to carry a revolver with him in Nahani, but has since changed up to a shotgun as he had very little faith in the abilities of a .44 to stop an aggressive bear.

Does anyone know where I could get one of those tactical slings/harnesses to hold the gun at port, muzzle down, in front of the body when hands are free? I'd like one without metal buckles if possible.
 
You'd think the guy would learn his lesson and quite jogging with a porkchop tied around his neck. :footinmou

Worked with a guy who lived outside of Yellowstone. Had to kill a grizzly that went through their sliding glass door and invited himself to the dinner table! :eek: Same guy drove a old beat up Corolla. I asked him "how'd your hood and front end get all smooshed up like that?" "Oh, a moose was crossing the road and I stopped to let it pass. It slipped on the ice and fell onto my hood." :eek:
 
Oh yeah. I think one should bring pepper spray regardless of whether you carry a firearm or not. However I have reservations about its effectiveness in 30 knot barrenland winds. YMMV depending on where you are.
 
mross said:
The Department of Fish and game advise people entering bear country to wear noise-producing devices such as little bells on their clothing to alert, but not startle the bears unexpectedly. They also advise the carrying of pepper spray in case of an encounter with an bear. It is also a good idea to watch for fresh signs of bear activity.

People should recognize the difference between black bear and grizzley bear droppings. Black bear droppings are smaller and contain fish bones and berries. Grizzley Bear droppings have little bells in them and smell like pepper spray.

Sorry, could not resist. :D

BWAAA!!!! Good one!
:D
 
philthygeezer said:
Does anyone know where I could get one of those tactical slings/harnesses to hold the gun at port, muzzle down, in front of the body when hands are free? I'd like one without metal buckles if possible.

I did an armchair search and came up with these:

Specter SOP sling.

Looks like a nice wide comfy sling that will hang in a safe position.
 
Here's Wilderness Tac's Original Giles Sling. Many of us have had Wilderness belts for years.

They also sell a version of the Ching Sling. Eric Ching's a good guy, and his sling will fit longarms with three swivel attachments.

John
 
Dang...I can't help thinkin' that guys the luckiest unfortunate SOB I've heard of in quite some time....

I reckon I might as well chime in with my .02 cents, even if it's in confederate currency ie: worthless :D

As far as handguns for bear, I'm of a rather unique opinion. I really don't think there IS a true handgun to stop bears. Here's a factoid for ya': There had never been a single incident of a charging grizzly being stopped with a .44 mag until this summer in Anchorage when a guy managed it with a 4 inch barreled Model 29 Smith, he had one shot left when the bear collapsed, still alive, but out of commission. (I'd have been saving the last shot for myself personally) But overall, I think the few handguns capable of delivering power THAT truly devastating are too heavy, too slow, and not tested enough. Sometimes they work, but bears have also been killed with Buck knives as well as attacking moose being killed with camp axes, it CAN happen, but what are the odds? They aint in our favor.

That being said, I never venture into the woods without a handgun, but..that handgun is often times a lil' ole 1911 Commander. I carry it because: #1 people are alot scarier to me than bears. I've met alot more people I've disliked when going camping, hiking and fishin than I've ever met bear I've had a problem with. #2 it is WITH ME It's not carried on my belt for an hour or two and then left in the boat, cabin, or campsite when I go to get some water, or take a dump or whatever it is WITH me, kinda like the golden rule of gunfighting is to have a gun....#3 It may not kill a bear, but 8-10 rounds of 200 grain +p+ .45 ACP is VERY likely to discourage one, and if it doesn't than I still have the cold comfort of knowing I left a decent blood trail for the brown shirts to track the *&%$#!! down and kill his furry a$$.

Besides that, even if I can't outrun a bear, I could still shoot my buddy in the kneecap and outrun him. :D

My father has recently taken a similar approach and retired his 629 Classic Deluxe in favor of a Glock 23. 13 rounds of .40 S&W gotta hurt....

Hey, that reminds me, have you heard of Smith & Wessons latest design? It's a .44 mag made specifically for bear in Alaska. It's made without a front sight on it. When asked the reasoning behind this unique design, the factory representative commented "they're designed that way so it'll hurt much less when a bear takes it and shoves it up someones a$$ :D

I'm also a huge fan of the slug loaded shotgun for bear protection, they're cheap, reliable, and they certainly don't eat nuthin' back at the camp, in the truck, or the boat where you're most likely doing all your cookin' and such. Rarely shoulder one through the woods unless I'm actively lookin' for something to kill. (pretty rare) I think the guys who say "just load it with birdshot an' shoot 'em in the face...it'll blind 'em!" are crazy. I have no faith in 00 buck either. barely pops beneath the flesh.....I do like to have a couple of #4 shells with me, just in case somethin' goes wrong and I wind up havin' to forage for a day or two.

I'm a fan of bearspray also...sorta...quit goin' anywhere near it for a couple of years after my genitals had an exposure incident with a leaky can in a valley where no water was available, but...I'm over that now...I think.... :eek: :D

I've heard of it working splendidly for some people, and not working at all other times. My Pitbull got a face full of it once and couldn't have cared less. But, nonetheless it's as good an option as any- My wife usually carries a can of it when we go out. (she can't shoot straight anyways...just don't tell her I said that... :D ) Which does bring me to another point. It's probably a hellaciously good option if someone isn't comfortable with guns, or has the honesty and guts to admit to themselves they aren't good enough with a gun to reliably make use of one. I've known a few folks like that, I admired the hell out of them for it.

Heh...anyone remember the incident with the fly in fishing trip and the bear repellent...Granola boy was dropped off for a fly in fishing trip where the Bush Pilot highly suggested he carry a handgun, ole boy adamantly stated he didn't like guns, and he was just gonna use his bear repellent, end of story. Until of course the Pilot took off, and flew over to see the ole boy hootin', hollerin', an' rollin' around on the ground like he'd lost his ever lovin' mind. Pilot landed the plane and went to investigate, 'lo an' behold Granola boy had been very unsuccessful in applying the bear repellent to himself. :D

Overall, I view the topic of "bear protection" the same way I view other aspects of personal protection- nothing is all inclusive and foolproof on all ocassions, one is best off to work at it from levels.

A deadlock on your front door isn't likely to keep you safe from home invasion by itself. Add an alarm system and you have a new and better level. Add a cell phone in the bedroom and you have another, add some personal defense training and you have another level, add a firearm and you have another level, etc, etc...

Likewise with bears, start out by avoiding areas with problem bears, then when you go out, make alot of noise, then, keep your food out of bears reach and away from YOU, use common sense when cooking, keep a shotgun in the cabin or whatever nearby, keep a handgun with you, etc, etc...basically you're making layers of defense, just like you do with people, just using different hardware. (the making noise part is real smart if there's other people around, it has the added advantage of keeping occassional forementioned unqualified guntoting idiot from mistaking YOU for a bear. :D )

Alright, daylights burnin' and I have to find something productive to do with myself today, or at least pretend I did so the wife doesn't get me....

Maybe wife protection should be a future thread? :D
 
Funny stuff, and thanks...


Runs With Scissors said:
...knowing I left a decent blood trail for the brown shirts to track the *&%$#!! down and kill his furry a$$.

UPS tracks bears too?

Maybe I've been living in the city too long. :rolleyes: :)
 
BruiseLeee said:
Funny stuff, and thanks...




UPS tracks bears too?

Maybe I've been living in the city too long. :rolleyes: :)


There's suddenly been an opening for a new b'ar code scanner in recieving if you are interested.
 
One anecdotal story does not a bear thread, or bear defense make. If I'm going to fight off a Grizzly bear, I'd rather do it with 6 rounds of mag handgun than 15 rounds of 40 Smith and Wesson.

They won't let us carry grenades, so I'll take my chances with the 41, 44, or 45 Colt. Everything is a tradeoff in life. It's not practical to carry a 416 Rigby at arms all day long. A handgun is better than a pouch of rocks, and a mag is better than a anti personel round like the 9 or 40.




munk
 
One of the nice things about a handgun is that it's a lot less 'in your face' to others that you may meet. It can be worn externally but discretely in a covered flap holster and noone has to stare at it while they talk to you. I like this idea because I feel awkward meeting others in the bush while carrying a firearm.

In many cases, Canadians will judge someone unfairly when they carry a firearm. I have experienced this on a few occasions. I'd prefer to avoid being prejudged by ignorant people who watch too many movies, and I'd like to provide for my own safety at the same time.
 
Brown Shirt= Alaskan Fish & Wildlife Officer, which is much like a leprechaun, since they're non-existent. The latest Commissioner decided to blur the lines, take away the brown shirts and make everyone a Trooper equally capable of fighting street crime or illegal poachers.

Although it should be fairly obvious that UPS DOES track bears. How do you think the National Geographic shows get those little tags in thier ears?

As far as the magnum Vs. .40 thing, perhaps I spoke a bit too strongly. Maybe spent a little too much time on the defensive regarding the topic. If someone feels more comfortable with a Single Action forty whatever and they keep it with them at all times, then that's certainly thier perogative and I respect it. Come to think of it if someone wants to charge a bear den naked armed with nothing but a Swiss Army knife, that's fine with me too, since it's not my a$$ that's in question, I figure I got nuthin' ta' say one way or the other. :D

Hell, Afterall I'm sure Bob Munden and a few folks like that could get by better with a Single Action Peacemaker than I could with an M-60.

As for me, I'm not nearly hardcore enough to go that route, hence the +p+ .45 auto. I spend most of my time in blackie territory anyways, and I know from experience a double tap from it will take care of blackies quite effectively. Incidentally, I'll carry a 1911,S&W 625, Cimarron Arms Bisley, Taurus titanium .357, S&W 586, and a Security Six all in one summer,(no! not at the same time,dangit!) just depends on my mood. The only thing that doesn't ever deviate is that none of them ever leave my reach.

Sheesh, so much for fleeing the computer room and doing something productive. I even passed up a trip into the mountains today to "do something productive" Starting tomorrow I'm gonna quit procrastinating! :rolleyes:
 
philthygeezer said:
One of the nice things about a handgun is that it's a lot less 'in your face' to others that you may meet. It can be worn externally but discretely in a covered flap holster and noone has to stare at it while they talk to you. I like this idea because I feel awkward meeting others in the bush while carrying a firearm.

In many cases, Canadians will judge someone unfairly when they carry a firearm. I have experienced this on a few occasions. I'd prefer to avoid being prejudged by ignorant people who watch too many movies, and I'd like to provide for my own safety at the same time.


Definitely one heckuva good point. I've found that alot of tourists cut a pretty wide berth towards anyone carrying a handgun. Except for sometimes Germans, they'll all cluster around a SA Revolver pointing and shouting "PEACEMAKER! PEACEMAKER!" and It don't matter if it's a Ruger Bearcat. Had a couple of friends that had to carefully explain to some foriegn tourists that they were NOT bandits when thier .44 mags were spotted.
 
I still like a shotgun for all-around woods carry, and home protection.

With the wide variety of loads availible, you can stop about anything that walks the surface of the earth in a pinch. Certainly in North America.

Yeah, a 460 Weatherby magnum would be better, but a bad choice for hunting small game for food.

While I hope that I never encounter anything I am not looking for, I would think that a few rounds of birdshot from an unfortunately very close range would stop/slow or kill about anything I will meet.

An ounch of lead is an ounch of lead be it buckshot or birdshot from about seven feet, gonna make a clean in and dirty out hole.

Maybe have a load of birdshot ready for supper with 00 buck as the next load in case the birdshot is not effective.

Anyhow, camping out to me is a Holiday Inn or Motel 6.
 
Steely_Gunz said:
I think AA's has the right idea. The .38 or maybe a .357 mag snubbie would be a better gun for scaring off a bear just for the simple fact it is easier to carry. Good sized pop that would at least hurt the bear enough to thinking twice. I know that once I get caught up and can actually take some time to get myself lost in the wilderness again I'll probably pick up some kind of critter gun. Most of the places I would choose to hike through will be more apt to have cougars than bears. Maybe black bears. Any wild animal is dangerous, but I'd rather take on a charging black bear than a Kodiak.
I dunno, i guess the best wild animal defense is to just keep your eyes and ears open. Trust your instincts and know the kind of animals that you could encounter. I know I would hate to be tailed by a mountain lion just as much as I would hate to stumble upon a bear.
Poor guy. mauled twice? dang.

Jake
Not exactly! Bears get excited, even enthusistic about tearing you up, especially if the mother is protecting her child. Pepper spray works as do loud noises, if the bear is not inclined to be irreverantly incensed at your presence.

First, run like hell, second run like hell, third use a .44 magnum. A .38 will only piss him off if he is incensed. Of course it depends on the size of the animal and it also depends on many other factors, such as the ability of the shooter to remain calm and objective in the face of a terrible adversary. Bears move very fast, up to 35 to 40 miles and hour, if they are incensed. That is fast, indeed!

It might prove very difficult to make the shot that will kill the bear. Facing a large bear on it's hind legs gives you a decent target, however facing a running bear coming straight at you, gives you only a fleeting target!

That is a fact,
iBear
 
Runs With Scissors said:
Brown Shirt= Alaskan Fish & Wildlife Officer, which is much like a leprechaun, since they're non-existent. The latest Commissioner decided to blur the lines, take away the brown shirts and make everyone a Trooper equally capable of fighting street crime or illegal poachers.

Although it should be fairly obvious that UPS DOES track bears. How do you think the National Geographic shows get those little tags in thier ears?

As far as the magnum Vs. .40 thing, perhaps I spoke a bit too strongly. Maybe spent a little too much time on the defensive regarding the topic. If someone feels more comfortable with a Single Action forty whatever and they keep it with them at all times, then that's certainly thier perogative and I respect it. Come to think of it if someone wants to charge a bear den naked armed with nothing but a Swiss Army knife, that's fine with me too, since it's not my a$$ that's in question, I figure I got nuthin' ta' say one way or the other. :D

Hell, Afterall I'm sure Bob Munden and a few folks like that could get by better with a Single Action Peacemaker than I could with an M-60.

As for me, I'm not nearly hardcore enough to go that route, hence the +p+ .45 auto. I spend most of my time in blackie territory anyways, and I know from experience a double tap from it will take care of blackies quite effectively. Incidentally, I'll carry a 1911,S&W 625, Cimarron Arms Bisley, Taurus titanium .357, S&W 586, and a Security Six all in one summer,(no! not at the same time,dangit!) just depends on my mood. The only thing that doesn't ever deviate is that none of them ever leave my reach.

Sheesh, so much for fleeing the computer room and doing something productive. I even passed up a trip into the mountains today to "do something productive" Starting tomorrow I'm gonna quit procrastinating! :rolleyes:

Well sure.... in Alaska! Here in Kalifornia, the good ol' USA, we do things differently. Irrespective of the existing law and especially the second amendment.... of course! But, that is California for you! I love the weather and hate the earthquakes and liberal gun laws!

The people are OK.... sometimes...... if you don't ask them to think to much! Friendly people seem to prosper in the desert...... more or less and then they get fed up with the stupidity of Kalifornia and they up and move to Montana! One extreme to the other..... more or less!
Thanks,
iBear
 
munk said:
One anecdotal story does not a bear thread, or bear defense make. If I'm going to fight off a Grizzly bear, I'd rather do it with 6 rounds of mag handgun than 15 rounds of 40 Smith and Wesson.

They won't let us carry grenades, so I'll take my chances with the 41, 44, or 45 Colt. Everything is a tradeoff in life. It's not practical to carry a 416 Rigby at arms all day long. A handgun is better than a pouch of rocks, and a mag is better than a anti personel round like the 9 or 40.




munk
Hey, what do you mean posting here and making sense? No reason you should be different then the rest of us..... making sense, I mean! You are smart when it comes to these issues! As usual you got it about right!

However, after seeing what a .44 mag will do.... I would put my faith in the .44 magnum.... right after I got done running like HELL! As a last resort! Hittting a running bear, moving fast straight at me, is a crap shoot anyway! Not sure I could make the shot!

Jus thinkin out loud,

iBear
 
philthygeezer said:
In many cases, Canadians will judge someone unfairly when they carry a firearm.

Some Canadians will be frightened if you hold a toothpick in an agressive manner.
 
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