Big Game bullets

None of them hold an edge very well, and thus are useless for chopping.

if used in the correct tubular launching device, the 45-70 if reloaded with .458 500 grain bullets & loaded fairly hot (for use in a modern rifle not a springfield) will probably still be a bit less energetic than the .458. never owned a .375, just a .300 winmag & a 45-70 ruger. i liked the ruger better. specially in bear country up in kodiak. (if you carry a 2nd round in between your fingers, fire, flip the lever & reload quickly you can get off a second shot just before the bear kills you)
 
I like that Russian Double rifle.
Im going to ask for it as a Christmas present from my mother, who is herslef an avid reader of African adventures books.
Hell, she's the one that got me into the subject!
Anyway, the other rounds seemed a little light for Cape buffalo or Kudu, so I want to get the Dobule in 45-70.
I was thinking the 250 grain rounds looked just fast enough to be about the same speed as a heavy 375.

that really is a fantastic price for those rifles, I have been looking for one of those for many many years.
 
Look what I started. :)

For those interested, Unintended Consequences by John Ross has some great info and scenes on big game hunting in Africa. ANd real old way too, for some of the hunters, Holland and Hollands in 600NE, and another double(think it was H&H, can't remember for sure though) in 4 bore.

Just know that it's definitely conservatively slanted big, to say the least. Lots of great history about the gun culture in general though. BIt racy in parts, not something I'd read to kids, but overall, great book that I love.
 
Here's how they compare according to my Speer reloading manual (number 12):

.45-70 Gov't (loaded for modern rifles with strong actions, not trapdoors), 400 grain flat point: muzzle velocity 2018 fps; muzzle energy 8.88 ft-lb per grain.

.458 Winchester Magnum, 400 grain flat point: muzzle velocity 2429 fps; muzzle energy 12.79 ft-lb per grain.

.458 Winchester Magnum, 500 grain round nose: muzzle velocity 2120 fps; muzzle energy approx 9.7 ft-lb per grain.

Don't know about .375 Capstick, but .375 H&H Magnum with 270 grain spitzer: muzzle velocity 2717 fps; muzzle energy approx 16.2 ft-lb per grain.

Whichever you choose, make sure your teeth are screwed down good & tight before you fire. I have a Marlin 1895G in .45-70 that I handload for, and I'm comfortable that it'll stop anything that walks on this continent.
 
I've never fired a .458 Win mag, but I have fired a .416 Rem mag with 500 grain bullets and I've got the scars to prove it. They're not much fun, you can have 'em.

I read Unintended Consequences a few years ago. I found it a bit preachy, along the lines of James Wesley Rawles: a combination novel/manifesto/how-to book. I take exception with some of the author's philosophies, but found it interesting enough to read all the way through.
 
cliff355 said:
...Two guys at my club have had to have detached retina surgery due to too much recoil....
Click to expand...
The worst recoil I ever felt was when I fired both barrels of my Grandpa's 10 GA duck gun. I couldn't move my right arm for about three days. Gramp's said it served me right pulling both triggers like that.
 
I'm not sure about the connection to detached retinas and recoil. Retina's want to detach in many of us due to getting older- the recoil may not have much to do with it. As for the kick, I'll take a 375 300 gr at 25- 2600fps any day over a fast thirty. The fast thirtys are fast- the kick is through your bones before you know what hit you. The larger bores tend to push rather than smack, unless you go to the 378 in which case you get smacked, kicked, punched and elbowed all at once.



munk
 
almost forgot- pick a round you can get ammo for. If you don't handload, the Capstick is going to be a bad choice. If you are ever going to AFrica, the last thing you want is a wildcat without easily available commerical rounds.



munk
 
I've been seeing one of the tippy top eye ball surgeons in Billings and I'll ask him.

After my own injury- rupturing the back of the eye, permanently, he said to go ahead and shoot.

Maybe he meant keep those surgical procedures coming!!

I've a friend who had a detached retina who will take no chances with big bore rifles now- but he wasn't shooting any at the time, either.

The eyeball man told me people's retina's detach when we get older. I must have good contact- because despite major tramua no munk retina has dared to detach. (they were probably afraid to leave home)


munk
 
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1011537/posts

This was interesting.

My grandpappy gave me a trapdoor springfield. It's a lovely rifle. I've always had a fondness for the .45-70. In the Springfield, with low power loads the recoil is a pleasant, but firm push. Shooting at 200 yards, the sound would be a BOOM then a smack as it hit the target. I've never shot hot loads in a lighter gun, but I bet they would be.... spirited. :D

Steve
 
Steve, I load 332 grain RCBS hard cast bullets over 30 grains of SR 4759 in a lightweight rifle (18.5", ported barrel). I've never chronographed the load, but "spirited" is a good term for it. Recoil is not too bad, but the ported barrel will want to knock your earmuffs off.
 
This has been a great thread. The heaviest hitting rifle I have fired is my 8mm Mauser. With 196 grains at about 2700-2900fps I think. I put about 100 rounds through it in one day once and got a nice bruise on my shoulder. The recoil was not unmanagable but did start to bug me after about 50 rounds or so. I am a big guy and the length of pull on the rifle (original stock) is a couple inches too short, the steel buttplate did not help I am sure. So given that example, what would a 45-70 be like in comparison, or a 375 H&H? I have a lot of book knowlegde about cartridges, mostly courtesy of Cartridges of the World by Barnes, but little experience. I am a very good rifle shot from shooting airguns and .22s, my form and breathing control is good, and a lot of it translates well to bigger firearms except for the recoil bit. I don't think I am recoil intolerant, but I have little real experience with hard recoiling rifles. It is something I want to try.
 
DannyinJapan said:
I like that Russian Double rifle.
Im going to ask for it as a Christmas present from my mother, who is herslef an avid reader of African adventures books.
Hell, she's the one that got me into the subject!
Click to expand...

Danny, how difficult is it for an expat to own a rifle in Japan?
 
I've been shooting awhile. I shot an elk with my .375 H&H magnum, didn't seem to do much more than my 30/06. It does kick a bit more though. I reload but don't have my info handy.

I shoot a Marlin guide gun, ported, 45 / 70. I use mostly factory ammo and it handles great. The porting helps allot. Here is some good reading. I hope you like the info.



http://www.garrettcartridges.com/


http://www.buffalobore.com/

I bought both brands in various weights, and it is impossible to decide the better one. I really like the Garrett's in .44 mag. I modified my Marlin 1894 to accept the longer bullets.
 
I will have the rifle shipped to my mom in Texas and she will keep it for me. Inside her house is a floor that no elevator can reach. Inside that floor there is a door that only one key can unlock.
Inside that door is a closet.
Inside that locked closet are all of the dangerous toys I couldnt bring with me to japan. (my luger, my CETME, etc..)

the day they let a dirty foreigner like me own a rifle in Japan, well, you'll know hell is freezing.
 
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