"byrd" line of knives

I have no problem with Chinese knives but:
1) The comet hole reminds me of that Frost crap :barf: :barf: :barf:
2) What's with the 30 day warranty!?!?!?

Otherwise, I like the bowie blade and the handles but for these two reasons I probably won't buy one.
Matt
 
I hope that you're doing at least some monitoring of the working conditions of the people producing your new products, though. I know that china has been stereotyped as being full of sweat shops, and that this is skilled work and probably not done under those conditions, but pressure from western customers is a big part of what will improve working conditions in the Far East. No OSHA over there.

As for the product, looks good, and I think using a different brand was a wise and responsible move.
 
Two points: if you want Spyderco to be around in five years, they're going to have to do some work abroad, unless Americans either:

1> Stop buying foreign products individually
2> Pass laws heavily taxing foreign imports
3> Start working for $2/hour or less

It's not, at least for me, an issue of national loyalty or pride. Global trade is a fact of life, and if we're going to step out of that ballgame, we have to do it as a nation. Putting pressure on individual companies is unrealistic.

Yes, Wal-mart is essentially the Chinese Embassy, or a virtualized Foreign Concession like Hong Kong. But matters of international trade at this level aren't really affected by individuals, or even pretty large companies. The movement of capital is a matter for the State to regulate, if it is to be touched at all.

Give Sal a break. He's trying to Do the Right Thing.
 
Muppet, maybe you don't realize that there are some US knife companies that don't use foriegn production, TOPs, Queen, Chris Reeve, etc. It all depends upon how well you know your techcnology and market, what types of product you want to produce, and how much return you want on your investment.

I don't mind paying a premium to get a product that is US made, Japanese products are OK, Italian and German knives are good, I take Taiwanese, but given the choice I don't buy Chinese. I don't choose Chinese because of their economic, political and cultural system. But that being said, China is a big country and there is wide variety in Chinese firms and provinces. Hopefully spyderco is subcontracting to the more progressive elements in Chinese society.
 
brownshoe said:
some US knife companies that don't use foriegn production, TOPs, Queen, Chris Reeve, etc.
Click to expand...

Suerte said:
Then buy TOPs, Queen, Chris Reeve, Schrade, etc. and quit whining. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

1) OWNED! (immature to use but true in this case)

2) I've been wondering about the 30 day warranty too, and does any of spyderco's current policy apply to this line?

3) don't think it will sell too well if there is only one place to buy it and only at MSRP price. (knifesite.com at about $40), kinda defeats the purpose of the new line, doesn't it?
 
I'm sure the retail price will come down to what it should be as more shops start carrying the line.
 
Premium products can be produced domestically because they're expensive enough to pay for skilled american labor.

But Spyderco has always been about producing superior knives which everybody could afford, hasn't it?
 
Sorry if I seemed to be whining. My tone comes from disappointment. I hoped that spyderco's US production would someday lead to a completely US company, like the old Benchmade. This hasn't happened and Spyderco has expanded beyond Japan and Switzerland to Taiwan and China. I don't know what country you are in, but one of the US biggest problems is its foriegn trade deficit and new Chinese products does not help this problem.
 
As you have pointed out, benchmade has also expanded their product line to off-shoring. global economy is the future.

as far as whether imported products will be of benefit, that is up for debate. if it helps spyderco to expand and hire more employees here, then it's good. but right now, looking at the penetration of the new line on the market, it has certainly priced itself out of competition for good unless it drops down soon. (as have been pointed out above)

I'm in IT and work in L.A., i know a thing or two about the effects of off-shoring and outsourcing, but to resort to protectionism or isolationism policies would not only not help the situation, it would certainly exacerbate the problem.
 
but that's a government's business: on that we vote.

I'm sure the decision to develop in China wasn't taken lightly.

But, anyway, back to the knife - has anybody bought one and posted a review? How was it?

Are there any ideas kicking around for things which we'd like to have Spyderco build, but that weren't quite "spyderco-ish" enough?

I have one idea: a prybar.

Something with the same kinds of functions as the Prybaby or the Pocketwrench - a small keychain-sized prying tool with a few other functions tossed in besides. Not really something spyderco per-se would make, but perhaps something for the new brand.

I'd also love to see a kubotan-form-factor car escape tool: carbide window breaker on one end, shrouded belt-cutter on the other, possibly with a few other functions (screw driver?) thrown in. Not really a Spyderco speciality, but it'd be nice if *somebody* made them.
 
All good points and all true. I appreicate the candor and the depth of the dialogue. I also appreciate the civility of the communication, typical of Spyderco forumites.

Spyderco products will not go down in quality! That's why we use Japanese steel in our Taiwan made Salsa.

Spyderco's USA made knives will be entirely made in the USA with USA vendors and USA steel.

I'm not trying to sell you a byrd instead of or even in addition to a Spyderco. I really don't think it will please you. But it is a market that we must consider.

It is our philosphy to be honest and transparent with our customers, even if controversy develops.

I too worry about China globally. I also worry about middle Eastern oil.

At this time, we are using Japanese steel in the byrds, which accounts for the "higher than normal Chinese made knives" price.

I would wish that we as a country/government/people would begin to think beyond our appetetitive, immediate, bigger, more, more more attitudes....and I believe we will. We're a young country with good principles and good people. It is all of our jobs to assist in the education and transition to a smarter America.

sorry for the rant.

sal
 
I think Sal is doing the right thing. I have friends who just want a cheap knife and wouldn't know decent steel if it bit them. Sal has been very honest with us and shouldn't get beat up for it. He has said Spyderco proper will remain a class act. Guys who won't pay for decent steel will get the Byrd so to speak.
 
I have friends who just want a cheap knife and wouldn't know decent steel if it bit them.
Click to expand...
I know people like this too.The problem with it is that they do not know the differance between a 5.00 China and a 25.00 China and will buy the 5.00 China.
The people that do shop for cheap user knives that they do not care what happens too will not buy a China knife that is over 10.00.
 
Hi U812. I think I'm trying to reach the ELU that knows the difference, but simply cannot afford our somewhat pricey Spyderco's. They will get less than Spyderco, but they will also pay less.

I really like Ferrari, but I end up with a Honda or Lotus.

They will also trust that they are getting good value for the $ spent because it is our way.

sal
 
I understand that but I am thinking,how many ELUs that would buy China know the differance.
I guess that can only really be answered by makeing them,putting them in the market and see.I hope they will take off.There is alot of users out there that do buy and use as cheap of a knife as they can get,hell I work with 8 to 10 of them.A owner of a tobacco shop gave on of our drivers several SS Delica knock offs that came free with a 2 pack of off brand skoal.Now there is 4 or 5 of our drivers carrying them around and love them.They really can't see a huge differance between them and my Spydies.Well all but one,he told me he was going to get a better one like it if he lost the knock off.
 
My friends that carry cheap 400 series steel knives think the most important thing is a knife that looks good. I think the qualities of the AUS steels in the Byrds will be lost on them. They re just as happy with the easy to tool 400 series steel. I would use the cheaper steel and put the money into the looks of the knife. They are great guys don't get me wrong but I just don't get people not appreciating a good piece of steel.
 
From one of Sal's earlier replies -I would wish that we as a country/government/people would begin to think beyond our appetetitive, immediate, bigger, more, more more attitudes....and I believe we will. We're a young country with good principles and good people. It is all of our jobs to assist in the education and transition to a smarter America.

Well said if you ask me...

I see the Byrd line as a competitor to the parasite manufacturers who take proven Spyderco designs and make an inferior (putting it nicely) poor looking copy and get a free ride on Spyderco's hard work and success. It looks to me like the Byrd line will offer people who buy these clone knives a better option and give Byrd a piece of the financial pie and give these parasites some stiff competition all while keeping a clear conscience by offering a decent knife.

Also BTW-the company I work for went from about 3300 workers to about 700 of us over the last few years...Ed.
 
The marketplace will sort it all out, it always does. Retail price doesn't matter. What is the selling price and how does the knife stack up against it's competition at that price point? The small run will provide feedback. Several runs could be needed, selectively adjusting different variables based on learning to determine the winning combination(s) for that market niche.

I personally believe the byrd would fit into an important knife catagory: relatively inexpensive but safe and adequate. I wouldn't use those "skoal" knives because they're dangerous, the locks are crap and can fail. I couldn't give something to someone that I knew could potentially harm them. I could give a byrd to my young teen nephews because it won't "break the bank", it's built to be safe, and they'd be happy with it at their current stage of knife sophistication.

Don't stress too much over where it's built. We live in a global economy now, and successfull businesses (and countries) will participate in it, many multi-nationally.
 
I wonder how I missed this thread the first time...

I searched this up while looking for info on the new caracara and meadowlark. I think they'd make excellent beater knives and I like the style.
I never expected to hear all of the negativity.
Maybe we need to set up a passaround...


Neko2
 
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