Leatherman Charge TTi vs. SwissTool Spirit vs. Swisstool CS Plus

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plowboy said:
...The lock, however, is not nearly as well done on the Charge, IMO -- and I'm not an anti-liner lock guy.:)
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I've said this before, but I've had the lock fail on two Spirits - never on a Leatherman. In their favor though, V-nox replaced both Spirits with new ones and the locks seem to hold up better now.
 
First Buzzbait presents a reasoned argument about why he prefers the Spirit, then he has the nerve to admit that others might have different opinions. This kind of behavior could change the internet... :D

Worse than that, it could change my buying habits. I might have to buy a Spirit just to see what he's talking about! :D

Thanks, amigo.

Buzzbait said:
Different strokes or different folks. I far prefer the smaller size and weight of the Spirit. The Charge, even the titanium version, is too heavy and bulky for me to wear EDC, especially clipped to my pants. 154CM has better edge holding, but I'll bet money that the Victorinox blade's grade of stainless has better rust resistance as well as less likelihood of chipping. It's great steel for those "non-knife" uses.

Yes, the titanium case of the Charge will be almost impervious to the elements, but it's the steel tools of Leathermans that always end up rusting on me.

I'm not so hot on the Leatherman Charge bit driver. Bits are things that get lost. And since the bits are proprietary, you can't just go to a hardware store to get new ones.

There is no wrong answer here. You just have to choose based on the qualities that mean most to you.
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Cobalt said:
Ok here is a comment and question for everyone:

First as far as leathermans go this the order I would place them in:
Charge Ti/TTi
Supertool
Wave

Now for VIctorinox how do they rank?
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My ten years of Leathermanship puts them in this order:

Core
Super Tool/ ST 200
PST

In general, I like the big ones with locking implements, of which Core is an evolutionary improvement from the Super Tool. I don't trust the Charge. Its PE blade folded on me (twice) in use. Sent to Leatherman, it was returned unfixed with a note from Customer Service stating the Charge was in spec. Taking them at their word, I sold it off. I do miss the one handed opening and pocketability, though.

Cranking down on thick wire sprung my Juice CS4. It went to LT for repair, was fixed at no charge and returned promptly. Vic has nothing comparable for tools/size, so I keep the CS4 as a plier based MT for light use. Or maybe I'll get rid of it, haven't made up my mind yet. Mostly, I have reverted to my original PST, which is lighter and stronger, but wish it had a saw.

For scissors, I always have a Micra tucked into my jeans watch pocket, no matter what else rides with me on a given day. They beat most of the ones found on full size multitools, IMHO.

My Vic list:

Swisstool
Spirit
Swisschamp

The Swisstool in its original form has an excellent mix of tools, lacking nothing I would want in a multitool (scissors provided by Micra). All positive comments by others re fit and finish confirmed, but the pliers are too stubby and don't open wide enough. Some of the screwdrivers are short, as well, and "slippery".

The Spirit, smaller but equally high quality, is a pocket worthy alternative. I don't much care for the serrated, blunt knife, and the scissors is the suckiest ever on a Vic. They don't even work well on fingernails. Even the one on the Rambler is better.

The Swisschamp is great, I carried it exclusively for years, but then got spoiled for pliers. It still gets some pocket time, but less than formerly.

Maybe because of my longer experience with Leatherman, I prefer their tools and handling to Vic mulitool products. OTOH, I love my regular SAKs, like the Tinker and Rambler.

I have never handled Gerber or SOG.
 
znapschatz said:
My ten years of Leathermanship puts them in this order:

Core
Super Tool/ ST 200
PST
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Nice choices. The ST200 is an excellent tool. It was too large and heavy for my use, but my father-in-law has made great use of it.

The original PST is my favorite of all Leatherman plier-based tools. The size and weight of the PST is extraordinarily pocketable. I bought one many, many years back, and until the Spirit came out, it was my main multitool. If it had a saw, I might never have purchased a Spirit. Oddly enough, of all my Leathermans, that old PST has the best fit/finish and the least number of rust problems. I sorely wish that Leatherman's current offerings were of the same manufacturing quality as that old PST.

I still carry a Micra every single day, in my front pocket. The scissors alone are worth the purchase. I've owned Squirts, and find them to pale in comparison to the Micra.
 
For me, it all really depends on the user and the usage...

If I were to choose among the three, I'd definitely go for the SwissTool CS Plus. I have handled Gerbers, LMs, and Vics, and still find the Vics to be more useful (in terms of tools/utensils) and better built overall (craftsmanship and robustness). Let's not even get in to the rust issue now... =P

The best solution would be buy all three! But if you can't, then find a way to handle and scrutinize the tools first before purchasing and then decide for yourself afterwards. =)
 
I still carry a Micra every single day, in my front pocket. The scissors alone are worth the purchase. I've owned Squirts, and find them to pale in comparison to the Micra.
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Yes, but with one qualification. If it has to be compact, and you have to have pliers, the P4 is not a bad choice.

I strongly agree on the PST - or did until a month ago or so when I found and bought a Sideclip from a dealer here. I really like the reduced thickness and I'd say the fit/finish is even better than my old PSTs.
 
Gadgetman7 said:
I've said this before, but I've had the lock fail on two Spirits - never on a Leatherman. In their favor though, V-nox replaced both Spirits with new ones and the locks seem to hold up better now.
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I guess my hangup with the Leatherman lock is that of the 4 tools that lock with a liner, the liner falls all over the place. On some, it engages on the lock side of the tang, on others it falls in the middle and on the 154CM blade the liner moves absoultely to the outside of the tang (and they did this when the tool was new). It just seems to me that the QC is very loose.

Nonetheless, I'm really glad that the Leatherman has held up well for you. I'm also sorry to hear of your bad experiences with the Vics...guess they are not perfect either.
:)
 
ive had wonderful luck with my vic swiss tools-not perfect but well made, everything locks and it is stout-it is the closest to using real tools-the vic is to overbuilt you can more or less abuse it -use it as a pry bar-etc

and i have the original wave and leatherman super tools too -they have very good points-and its the wave i chose IF i will primarily need something to cut with and need quick in and out -its a good tool too

all are good tools-some have better aspects in certain applications

the vics are robust and high quality-heavy
the leathermans are convenient for quick draw and nice pliers-not quite as heavy-still heavy

since i do a lot of carrying of my gear by foot-weight is a consideration-and mutli tools are really heavy-unless you really need pliers-

its not so expensive to buy one of each and make a decision as to your favorite and use the others for something else -

or give them to a good friend
 
Buzzbait said:
Oddly enough, of all my Leathermans, that old PST has the best fit/finish and the least number of rust problems. I sorely wish that Leatherman's current offerings were of the same manufacturing quality as that old PST.
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This sentiment seems to come up regularly, and honestly, I'm not sure. They all seem reasonably well made and certainly perform well. Never has there been a rust problem on any of my Leathermen, classic or current. I live in a moderate climate and when the tools get wet or dirty, I always wipe them down. Maybe I just haven't had the newer ones long enough.

I still carry a Micra every single day, in my front pocket. The scissors alone are worth the purchase. I've owned Squirts, and find them to pale in comparison to the Micra.
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After trying the Squirts, I have to agree. They seem well made, certainly more finger friendly, a little more convenient to pull out implements, but the screwdrivers are less square than the Micra, and the design doesn't allow (with one exception) extending tools or blade by folding out the trailing handle (not recommended but doable). That can be important whenever it is necessary to increase reach or reduce profile, as I needed to do the last 2 times I used the Micra. The same advantage obtains when comparing classic Leathermen to Swisstools.

For versatility and tools, the Micra is my choice, but Squirts are better finger toys.
 
Actually, the Spirit's pliers click in place neatly which allows relatively secure extension as you mentioned znap.
 
znapschatz said:
This sentiment seems to come up regularly, and honestly, I'm not sure. They all seem reasonably well made and certainly perform well. Never has there been a rust problem on any of my Leathermen, classic or current. I live in a moderate climate and when the tools get wet or dirty, I always wipe them down. Maybe I just haven't had the newer ones long enough.
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Much of my multitool use occurs outdoors. Fishing trips. Hiking and camping trips. That sort of thing. So my multitools are around quite a bit of moisture. The offerings from Victorinox are amazingly stain resistant. I can use a Vic tool for fishing, forget to clean it and store it back in my pack. Months later, I pull the tool out of my pack and clean it off. Not a hint of rust. Let's just say that newer Leathermans do not escape unscathed. ;)
 
Buck268 said:
Actually, the Spirit's pliers click in place neatly which allows relatively secure extension as you mentioned znap.
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You're right! I should have checked first. My memory seems decreasingly useful.

Previous comment inoperative.:eek:
 
JNewell said:
Yes, but with one qualification. If it has to be compact, and you have to have pliers, the P4 is not a bad choice.

I strongly agree on the PST - or did until a month ago or so when I found and bought a Sideclip from a dealer here. I really like the reduced thickness and I'd say the fit/finish is even better than my old PSTs.
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How does one obtain a sideclip? Are there ones available for the mycra?
 
I've had an original leatherman PST, the old wave and the new wave as well as a supertool; but I too, like Buzzbait, find myself favouring the swisstool spirit. For me it's an upgrade on the original LM PST.

But it does come down to your usage pattern and what your 'go to the shed and get the right tool for the job' threshold is.

I've carried my spirit on an 22 day walk in the central Australian desert (along with it's companion Spyderco Military) and just got back from a 2-week work trip in India. The spirit has been all I've needed.
 
CyberPilgrim said:
How does one obtain a sideclip? Are there ones available for the mycra?
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The Sideclip was a tool - you can see it on the Leatherman website under "retired tools." You can find them on auction sites. It's completely separate from the Micra.
 
Leatherman123 said:
NO... the victorinox is a terrible tool. I own almost everyone multitool and leatherman is the best. Vic sucks big balls. LEATHERMAN IS BY FAR SUPERIOR; I USE THE TTI FOR EVERYTHING
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what is it exactly that you find so terrible about the Vic-what application or use?
-what doesnt it do that you think it should?

i take it you own a Vic, are not a girly man, dont live in the city, have a strong bias against Vic, city dwellers, AND us girly men

weve learned so much about you in 8 posts:rolleyes:
 
JNewell said:
Yes, but with one qualification. If it has to be compact, and you have to have pliers, the P4 is not a bad choice.

I strongly agree on the PST - or did until a month ago or so when I found and bought a Sideclip from a dealer here. I really like the reduced thickness and I'd say the fit/finish is even better than my old PSTs.
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Yeah, but I wish they hadn't dropped the awl. Surely, I'm not the odd guy for whom the awl is an essential tool?
 
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