Still Wanted: Cadet X

[willisoften]

Yeah, I think Victorinox underestimates the market for both. It’s hard to beat the slim factor of the smaller alox frames.

Did you get around to building your 93mm?

Do they? If a new machine only costs a (dirt cheap) 10,000 francs, and the new patterns only cost 1000 f and a new worker only gets 40,000 f a year and then we ignore replacement dies introducing a new process power and raw materials , training and marketing = how many cadet x.

The 58mm parts already exist so an alox rambler might be a more realistic hope.
.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

Do they?

Already said I think so. And I still do.

If a new machine only costs a (dirt cheap) 10,000 francs, and the new patterns only cost 1000 f and a new worker only gets 40,000 f a year and then we ignore replacement dies introducing a new process power and raw materials , training and marketing = how many cadet x.

I think you underestimate the cost by a lot. Orders of magnitude.

It’s been said before there is no ‘scissor machine’. Just specific jigs and dies that need to be engineered and fabricated. Thats for each of the new parts required. Active leaf, inactive leaf, backspring, liner, etc. And those would depend on wether it’s a clean sheet design or sharing some parts to another assembly such as the 74mm and Swisscard units. Then the active leaf, scissor sprung and maybe the grinding and riveting jigs could be reused.

Even with that in mind, I still think they underestimate the market for 84mm X options. Or the value to its fan base if they released it in miscellaneous LEs before turning it to regular production. I think either a Cadet X or Bantam X would be the best place to start. Both as LEs, maybe for the Winter Magic or Onyx or the annual Alox…or something entirely new.

I used to think it would never happen. But after modding some 74mm and 91mm to the 84mm frame, I changed my thinking. I did submit the 74mm option to them last year. Not that it means much.

They took the risk to make PXs and Farmer Xs happen. I think that paid off, and perhaps they’d change their minds about the 84mm, even with the higher cost to develop over the 93mm.

The 58mm parts already exist so an alox rambler might be a more realistic hope.
.

Sure, fewer barriers but I think less demand and potential sales…or so I think.

 

[fuyume]

An Alox Rambler requires zero extra tooling, though. As I understand it (saw someone say on the Internet once), the tooling Victorinox used to use to produce 84 mm scissors has been junked, so it would have to be recreated. I personally feel there’s enough interest to make it a profitable line, but I’m obviously not privy to the company’s financials.

Let me just say this: a Cadet X is much more attractive to me than a Pioneer X, because I simply do not need the extra robustness of the 93 mm models in my daily life in town. In the woods, yes, I want the heftier tool.

I’ve mentioned before that what I really want in an EDC “town” knife is scissors, cap lifter, small penknife, and inline Phillips, and only in the woods would I really want the large blade, reamer, or woodsaw. But while a Cadet X would not have an inline Phillips, and I really never need a can opener, I’m willing to live with the can opener, if I can get a Cadet X. That paired with an Alox Rambler would cover about 95% of what I ever use.

 

[NG VI]

I would like an Alox 84mm Golfer

 

[Lee D]

Maybe Victorinox should take the time to pay attention to Instagram, and notice how fast their modded SAKs sell like hotcakes.

*Head of Victorinox…
“Well golly gee…maybe there is a market for some new products”

 

[NG VI]

Maybe Victorinox should take the time to pay attention to Instagram, and notice how fast their modded SAKs sell like hotcakes.

*Head of Victorinox…
“Well golly gee…maybe there is a market for some new products”

And if they need to pay off some new machinery to do it, go ahead and produce a run with a more respectable blade steel, even just N690, to get the funds recouped

 

[yablanowitz]

It took 65 years to get scissors in the 93mm Alox line. Good luck convincing them there's a huge demand for them in the 84mm Alox line.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

Maybe Victorinox should take the time to pay attention to Instagram, and notice how fast their modded SAKs sell like hotcakes.

*Head of Victorinox…
“Well golly gee…maybe there is a market for some new products”

As I understand it, that’s essentially what happened with the PX and FX. The aftermarket proved the demand.

I think for 84mm scissors, there’s more proof with the used market. Both mods and collectors drive that pricing pretty high. A couple of 84mm X LEs won’t flood the market.

 

[Lee D]

It took 65 years to get scissors in the 93mm Alox line. Good luck convincing them there's a huge demand for them in the 84mm Alox line.

People pay 4 to 5 times what a Vic made Cadet X would cost (I’m guessing somewhere around $50?) for modded 84mm models with scissors. Not to mention the time they happily wait for a modder to complete the project to his standards.

Not everyone wants to carry a heavy PX or FX in their pocket every day, so imo, the demand for a lighter, slimmer Cadet X is there.

 

[A.L.]

People pay 4 to 5 times what a Vic made Cadet X would cost (I’m guessing somewhere around $50?) for modded 84mm models with scissors. Not to mention the time they happily wait for a modder to complete the project to his standards.

Not everyone wants to carry a heavy PX or FX in their pocket every day, so imo, the demand for a lighter, slimmer Cadet X is there.

Perhaps, but the ”hipster” type instagram folks like the custom ones because they are more expensive and unique, in other words, not what common folks carry. It’s largely vanity.
Of course I am not disagreeing that there would not be demand for cadet x - but nobody knows if it would make sense financially.
But the again Victorinox came out with the limited completely unique (and overpriced) anniversary reproduction lately so who knows if they are just lazy with the cadet x.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

But while a Cadet X would not have an inline Phillips

Part of my suggestion to Victorinox is to add them to the scissor layer like they did for the 111mm frame. A 0/1 size head about the size of the 58mm combo tool, but longer. All fits if they use 74mm based scissors with tang modifications.

I have more hope now that it’s possible since the 74mm line discontinuation rumors turned out to be false or a least inaccurate.

 

[Spikediesel]

Cadet Xs are great 84mm Voyageurs are better in my opinion. I’d be happy with a 93mm Voyageur! Heavy duty blade, scissors and a combo tool, thin and extremely useful!

 

[kamakiri.knives]

I’d be happy with a 93mm Voyageur!

That’s been on my build list for a while. One of these days…

And it’s another example of knives they already have all the parts needed to do it.

 

[NG VI]

Perhaps, but the ”hipster” type instagram folks like the custom ones because they are more expensive and unique, in other words, not what common folks carry. It’s largely vanity.
Of course I am not disagreeing that there would not be demand for cadet x - but nobody knows if it would make sense financially.
But the again Victorinox came out with the limited completely unique (and overpriced) anniversary reproduction lately so who knows if they are just lazy with the cadet x.

That sounds like a heaping helping of projection seasoned with a hearty haul of bs to me, people buy those modded SAKs because they love SAKs and want something different than what the factory offers. Every one of those people would have a factory Cadet X or an Alox Golfer in their collection too if they had the option to buy them, and many of them would have never bought a custom in the first place if they could have gotten those models off of a shelf.


You've confused that they have expensive SAKs beyond the realm of the common, non-knife collecting type with their motivation for owning any SAKs at all. It's backwards. They buy banging mod jobs because they already love the object for what it is.

 

[Lee D]

With all this talk of scissors, are we gonna ignore the fact that modders are putting Dragonfly blades in Cadets? lol

 

[A.L.]

That sounds like a heaping helping of projection seasoned with a hearty haul of bs to me, people buy those modded SAKs because they love SAKs and want something different than what the factory offers. Every one of those people would have a factory Cadet X or an Alox Golfer in their collection too if they had the option to buy them, and many of them would have never bought a custom in the first place if they could have gotten those models off of a shelf.


You've confused that they have expensive SAKs beyond the realm of the common, non-knife collecting type with their motivation for owning any SAKs at all. It's backwards. They buy banging mod jobs because they already love the object for what it is.

It’s all good. I’m just a hater.

 

[DocT]

Everyone write to them, please. I gave the link.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

Everyone write to them, please. I gave the link.

And anyone OK with 74mm/Swisscard sized scissors going in there should add that too. Sharing most of the tooling makes it more likely, IMO.

It seems 93mm did get the green light because the same scissors were already used on 91mm and 111mm.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

Not quite a basic Cadet X with the added hook and 58mm combo:

 

[Lee D]

Not quite a basic Cadet X with the added hook and 58mm combo:

That turned out great